D3 Alpina Bi turbo down on power EGR delet and swirl flaps
Discussion
Hi folks, i've come to the conclusion my D3 is down on power but without any fault codes that bring on the ECU / Limp mode feature i'm loathed to hand the car over to just any gargare as the garage i spoke to said it was £65 to plug it in and start the investigation hence i'd like to find out accurately the cause of the power loss.
I spoke with a DPF cleaning guy who said he could sort the problem out as he suspected the EGR was the fault but also added he wanted £250 to clean it or £350 to do a full clean and there is still no guarantee this will resolve the issue.
I did look at having a go to remove and clean the EGR myself but access isn't easy hence is it worth deleting the EGR and also having the swirl flaps removed and if so where is a good place to get this work done. Im based near Portsmouth.
If i buy a EGR blanking kit will i need to get it remapped to get the ECU to ignore any faults from the EGR etc
Thanks
Ross
I spoke with a DPF cleaning guy who said he could sort the problem out as he suspected the EGR was the fault but also added he wanted £250 to clean it or £350 to do a full clean and there is still no guarantee this will resolve the issue.
I did look at having a go to remove and clean the EGR myself but access isn't easy hence is it worth deleting the EGR and also having the swirl flaps removed and if so where is a good place to get this work done. Im based near Portsmouth.
If i buy a EGR blanking kit will i need to get it remapped to get the ECU to ignore any faults from the EGR etc
Thanks
Ross
Just a few questions:
What are the symptoms?
Does it just feel slower, or less responsive?
Worse MPG or more smoke etc?
How long have you noticed it for?
When was it last serviced?
Have you tried resetting the throttle adaptation and /or the Italian tune up?
Have you tried a different fuel source?
What are the symptoms?
Does it just feel slower, or less responsive?
Worse MPG or more smoke etc?
How long have you noticed it for?
When was it last serviced?
Have you tried resetting the throttle adaptation and /or the Italian tune up?
Have you tried a different fuel source?
Hi Thanks for the reply, the car was last serviced by myself at 89k miles its now on 92 k
The car has been sluggish in my opinion and given its meant to be 211 bhp 450 N standard it certainly doesn't feel like that.
I did also find the airfilter was very blocked hence i did a full service to base line everything.
The car doesn't smoke at all and runs sweet but is basically not as quick on the bottom end as my GT Sport Tdi 170 bhp Golf.
I haven't reset anything as i don't know how to
Thanks
The car has been sluggish in my opinion and given its meant to be 211 bhp 450 N standard it certainly doesn't feel like that.
I did also find the airfilter was very blocked hence i did a full service to base line everything.
The car doesn't smoke at all and runs sweet but is basically not as quick on the bottom end as my GT Sport Tdi 170 bhp Golf.
I haven't reset anything as i don't know how to
Thanks
I found mine to be slower than I was expecting coming from a 2006 Leon with 240hp, it is faster but doesn't feel it as it is much more refined than the MK5 Golf platform. They also deliver power in a lump whereas your twin turbo may be far more linear.
Try resetting the throttle adaptation by:
1. Key in,
2. foot down on accelerator and keep it all the way down, but don't touch the clutch or brake pedal.
3. Press the start button (engine should remain off).
4. Keep foot down for 30seconds and then press start button to turn everything off again
5. Release accelerator.
6. Wait for about 30 seconds.
What this does is reset the throttle adaptation to default. Over time it seems to learn how you drive and default to a softer, more economical setting. If you drive it hard all the time it probably wouldn't. Do this every now and again and it seems to help make it feel more 'perky'.
If that does nothing and everything seems in good order mechanically then it may be time to take it to a Dyno to check it is all ok.
Try resetting the throttle adaptation by:
1. Key in,
2. foot down on accelerator and keep it all the way down, but don't touch the clutch or brake pedal.
3. Press the start button (engine should remain off).
4. Keep foot down for 30seconds and then press start button to turn everything off again
5. Release accelerator.
6. Wait for about 30 seconds.
What this does is reset the throttle adaptation to default. Over time it seems to learn how you drive and default to a softer, more economical setting. If you drive it hard all the time it probably wouldn't. Do this every now and again and it seems to help make it feel more 'perky'.
If that does nothing and everything seems in good order mechanically then it may be time to take it to a Dyno to check it is all ok.
As someone else asked - have you seen any changes in fuel consumption? If a higher mpg then it could be something like throttle calibration (i.e. when your foot's flat down the engine doesn't think it is). If the mpg is lower then the engine isn't running so efficiently, so look at something like DPF causing back pressure. If mpg is the same you're probably imagining it! I don't mean to insult your judgement, but there have been times when I've thought my car's not been running as well as normal especially when you start looking for it.
I assume that you've looked at the engine codes yourself with an ODB2 adaptor? They don't always trigger a fault light. Definitely worth getting a simple one that pairs with your phone if you haven't already got one - only about £15 from Amazon.
I assume that you've looked at the engine codes yourself with an ODB2 adaptor? They don't always trigger a fault light. Definitely worth getting a simple one that pairs with your phone if you haven't already got one - only about £15 from Amazon.
Rossco196x said:
Hi folks, i've come to the conclusion my D3 is down on power but without any fault codes that bring on the ECU / Limp mode feature i'm loathed to hand the car over to just any gargare as the garage i spoke to said it was £65 to plug it in and start the investigation hence i'd like to find out accurately the cause of the power loss.
I spoke with a DPF cleaning guy who said he could sort the problem out as he suspected the EGR was the fault but also added he wanted £250 to clean it or £350 to do a full clean and there is still no guarantee this will resolve the issue.
You’ll only find the issue if it’s plugged in, cannot understand why your loathed to spend £65 but happier to spend £350 with no guarantee that’s the issue? What’s the temperature on your thermostats, below 88c and the car won’t regenerate. Could be many things, a split low pressure hose on the solenoids etc, I’ve had that on a 535d.I spoke with a DPF cleaning guy who said he could sort the problem out as he suspected the EGR was the fault but also added he wanted £250 to clean it or £350 to do a full clean and there is still no guarantee this will resolve the issue.
Iridium engineering In Southampton have a good reputation on various BMW forums, so maybe contact them for advice.
Thanks folks i will try the throttle reset, and yes i've had the same feelling on super bikes where a ducati 996 seems slow compared to a GSXR1000 but clearly both do the same lap times but make power differently.
The D3 Alpina doesn't have a temp guage, DPF seems fine as it get fairly regular 150 mile runs so i think all is fine there. I've also looked for vacuum leaks on the turbo and egr piping but nothing as such, i would investigate the boost control solenoid but its not easy to access.
As for paying £350 to a DPF chap to clean my what exactly, even i don't earn £350 / hr so i've decided to delete the EGR and also remove the swirl flaps as these seem to be fairly sensible mods.
Will update you later and i'm going to use Ergen in fareham to do the remapping of the EGR to remove the ECU fault.
I did test the big turbo waste gate actuator and this moved when a vacuum source was connected but i'm not sure how much its meant to move 6 - 10 mm ?
For the time being the DPF will remain in place.
The D3 Alpina doesn't have a temp guage, DPF seems fine as it get fairly regular 150 mile runs so i think all is fine there. I've also looked for vacuum leaks on the turbo and egr piping but nothing as such, i would investigate the boost control solenoid but its not easy to access.
As for paying £350 to a DPF chap to clean my what exactly, even i don't earn £350 / hr so i've decided to delete the EGR and also remove the swirl flaps as these seem to be fairly sensible mods.
Will update you later and i'm going to use Ergen in fareham to do the remapping of the EGR to remove the ECU fault.
I did test the big turbo waste gate actuator and this moved when a vacuum source was connected but i'm not sure how much its meant to move 6 - 10 mm ?
For the time being the DPF will remain in place.
Rossco196x said:
The D3 Alpina doesn't have a temp guage, DPF seems fine as it get fairly regular 150 mile runs so i think all is fine there. I've also looked for vacuum leaks on the turbo and egr piping but nothing as such, i would investigate the boost control solenoid but its not easy to access.
Search ‘hidden menu’, you’ll find the temperature gauge. The trip distance is irrelevant if it’s not hot enough this does cause a lot of issues, as it won’t regenerate. A mate of mine found this out recently on his 530d the old family garage had being looking after. He goes to a BMW specialist now.The vacuum lines and vacuum turbo reservoir have a history of splitting on twin setups. If you have a boost issue below say 2000rpm, it will be quite evident.
Many thanks Bigdom, whats the easiest way to access the hidden menus, i suspect a a leak in the vacuum pipework or a faulty boost control valve but this isn't easy to access as its tucked up towards the very rear of the engine. I've also started to get a EGR fault code so i'm going to delete the EGR and Swirl flaps and investigate the turbo vacuum lines whilst ive got the car in bits.
Myself i avoid main dealers like the plauge, i once received an additional £400 from Porsche OPC when they removed the cam covers to inspect the cylinder head studs on my 964 that had come loose after it had just had £2500 of work at another OPC and as usual Porsche stated it wasn't as a result of poor workmanship hence i took the car away as i declined there invite to remove the engine investigate in return for another £3500 bill.
Will update the forum when i get to the bottom of the issue
Thanks
Myself i avoid main dealers like the plauge, i once received an additional £400 from Porsche OPC when they removed the cam covers to inspect the cylinder head studs on my 964 that had come loose after it had just had £2500 of work at another OPC and as usual Porsche stated it wasn't as a result of poor workmanship hence i took the car away as i declined there invite to remove the engine investigate in return for another £3500 bill.
Will update the forum when i get to the bottom of the issue
Thanks
Just a thought, but for less than half what BMW want to charge you for a diagnosis you could buy a code reader and hopefully that would give you a better idea of the problem(s).
You mention swirl-flaps, but I thought the D3 engine was based on the N47 and I don't think it has them.
Good luck anyway.
You mention swirl-flaps, but I thought the D3 engine was based on the N47 and I don't think it has them.
Good luck anyway.
Mr Tidy said:
Just a thought, but for less than half what BMW want to charge you for a diagnosis you could buy a code reader and hopefully that would give you a better idea of the problem(s).
You mention swirl-flaps, but I thought the D3 engine was based on the N47 and I don't think it has them.
Good luck anyway.
It has swirl flaps.You mention swirl-flaps, but I thought the D3 engine was based on the N47 and I don't think it has them.
Good luck anyway.
My thanks for all the advice and to cut a long story short i parked up the Alpina but did get to access the hidden menu and all seemed fine.
I also managed to get a scan done with the V57 BMW diagnostic tool and that hilighted a problem with the glow plug relay so i replaced that and 2 of the glow plugs and then COVID arrived and the rest is history.
I've still not got to the bottom of the low power or boost issue but i did get as far as ordering a vac pump to check for vacuum leaks but basically i've done very little due to lock down
I also managed to get a scan done with the V57 BMW diagnostic tool and that hilighted a problem with the glow plug relay so i replaced that and 2 of the glow plugs and then COVID arrived and the rest is history.
I've still not got to the bottom of the low power or boost issue but i did get as far as ordering a vac pump to check for vacuum leaks but basically i've done very little due to lock down
Check the Vanos solenoid too if you’re lacking oomph, although this normally shows up as an amber engine light if it persists.
It also had the habit of going into limp mode and asking to drive moderately - found this occurred more on cold starts and off and on once warmed up reset this.
Long term fix was replacing the Vanos solenoid- it’s quite common and not expensive. They swapped positions of the solenoid to identity if it was the Vanos solenoid - BMW won’t fix the part and do a direct replacement.
It also had the habit of going into limp mode and asking to drive moderately - found this occurred more on cold starts and off and on once warmed up reset this.
Long term fix was replacing the Vanos solenoid- it’s quite common and not expensive. They swapped positions of the solenoid to identity if it was the Vanos solenoid - BMW won’t fix the part and do a direct replacement.
Well finally as an update. One of the turbo pressure control circuits was disabled in the ECU and hence an update fixed that.
Next it was leaking hose to the low pressure turbo actuator and then some fault codes with the fuel pressure which cleared after the main filter was replaced and a reg forced on the DPF and all seems good again.
I'm going to do a DPF delete aft the next MOT also but yes you really can chase your arse trying to sort out issues on these cars
Next it was leaking hose to the low pressure turbo actuator and then some fault codes with the fuel pressure which cleared after the main filter was replaced and a reg forced on the DPF and all seems good again.
I'm going to do a DPF delete aft the next MOT also but yes you really can chase your arse trying to sort out issues on these cars
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