Discussion
Now the e92 335i is getting on a bit does anyone have any anecdotal comments on the reliability of it? I am looking at 07/10 reg as value for money looks good.
I was thinking to go for the 3.0 NA but I’m thinking just go for it and get the turbo as purchase cost is the basically the same.
I was thinking to go for the 3.0 NA but I’m thinking just go for it and get the turbo as purchase cost is the basically the same.
Turbos can be a bit squiffy (two of them on pre-facelift cars), high pressure fuel pumps fail and are expensive, injectors leak, electric water pumps fail
If you read the internet they’ll break ever day and bankrupt you and I imagine that a bad one is a proper pain in the bum but there must be plenty of owners who own them with relatively minor issues. Condition and service history will be key.
If you read the internet they’ll break ever day and bankrupt you and I imagine that a bad one is a proper pain in the bum but there must be plenty of owners who own them with relatively minor issues. Condition and service history will be key.
I much prefer the 330i over the 335i.
I took a 320i M-Sport e92 (N43) the other week as a part ex, even that was a total joy to drive, I was genuinely shocked at how much fun it was.
There is something about a NA petrol that can't be beat, sure some of the latest FI cars like the new M3 come close, but I would take the 330i over the 335i every time.
I took a 320i M-Sport e92 (N43) the other week as a part ex, even that was a total joy to drive, I was genuinely shocked at how much fun it was.
There is something about a NA petrol that can't be beat, sure some of the latest FI cars like the new M3 come close, but I would take the 330i over the 335i every time.
It is perfectly fine. It faces all the issues most modern BMW's face today. HPFP issues, injector issues, and even turbocharger issues are certainly not exclusive to the 335i. The water pump issues have plagued BMW since the early years, and still do to this date. In terms of BMW's and their running costs, these are rather good. Solid gearbox, less issues as not a diesel, tyres aren't £1100 per set and no xDrive system to worry about. X5's are reliable as well but with them come considerably higher running costs.
In the end of the day, a 335i is a 3 series. I know someone who left theirs on a driveway for a few years. £800 later from Halfords and it is ready to drive for a few thousand miles a month for work, with a full MOT and new tyres and brakes.
If you want a car that is a blast to drive, very powerful and has sharp handling, the 335i is for you. The costs that come with it are standard BMW costs that come associated with all BMW's, in my opinion.
In the end of the day, a 335i is a 3 series. I know someone who left theirs on a driveway for a few years. £800 later from Halfords and it is ready to drive for a few thousand miles a month for work, with a full MOT and new tyres and brakes.
If you want a car that is a blast to drive, very powerful and has sharp handling, the 335i is for you. The costs that come with it are standard BMW costs that come associated with all BMW's, in my opinion.
N/a is great with a manual , but I wanted the fastest so chose a 2009 335i. I picked one with an impeccable service and maintenance record and only had to replace injectors to 85k miles.
I prefer the looks of pre LCI. The early ones , just 2007 I think , were in the high tax bracket.
I didn’t like auto (6 speed) but from late 2008 there is DCT option , which was very good. From 1/9/2008 builds you start seeing CIC iDrive which is better.
I prefer the looks of pre LCI. The early ones , just 2007 I think , were in the high tax bracket.
I didn’t like auto (6 speed) but from late 2008 there is DCT option , which was very good. From 1/9/2008 builds you start seeing CIC iDrive which is better.
It's a great choice, the N54 is a fantastic engine that feels much less turbocharged that other engines due to the two smaller turbos. It is a fundamentally sound engine.
Reliability can be good, but BMW parts can get pricey. Same with the N53 330i, make sure the High Pressure Fuel Pump and the injectors have been changed. I can't imagine there are many out there that haven't been done yet though.
Water pump can go, just as with many BMW 6 cylinder engines so budget for that.
Turbos used to be a big problem as they developed wastegate rattles that meant the whole unit needed replacing, but the are repair kits now that massively reduce the cost to fix.
As with all direct injection engines of that age, the intake valves get covered with gunk over time, meaning that performance and economy can be affected. Walnut blasting is the official technique by which they are cleaned. Worth doing every 50-60k miles and shouldn't be too expensive.
Depending on driving style, 30+mpg isn't hard to get and up to 40 is possible if hypermiling. Tax in LCI models is better at £320ish compared to £500+, but honestly, why worry about that? It's a drip in the ocean of modern motoring costs.
Handling wise it is heavy so no Elise, but it is good and hydraulic steering system helps make it feel less disconnected as with modern cars. It can be comfortable even in M Sport spec, but avoid 19 inch alloys as they will impact on the ride. Bigger alloys are prone to cracking too.
As for spec, most nice things were options so assume nothing is standard. Try and find ones with the Logic 7 system fitted, easily identified by having tweeters in the a pillar and a speaker in the dash under windscreen. It is good and the standard system is not. IDrive is good, but only on the post September 2008 cars. Earlier system is clunky. M Sport seats are great and very supportive, standard seats are not. Ideally you want them heated and electric, but many are not.
Alternatives are Audi S4 / S5 (V8) which as a little more power, but not as good to drive it seems. Mercedes had a C350 that seems comparible, but not as much about l think. With modifications the N54 can be tuned to around 900hp in the extreme, but 400-500hp is quite achievable and 360-380 is a remap away, if that is your thing
They are really good cars for the money, but buy a ropey one and you will spend a lot of money fixing it.
Reliability can be good, but BMW parts can get pricey. Same with the N53 330i, make sure the High Pressure Fuel Pump and the injectors have been changed. I can't imagine there are many out there that haven't been done yet though.
Water pump can go, just as with many BMW 6 cylinder engines so budget for that.
Turbos used to be a big problem as they developed wastegate rattles that meant the whole unit needed replacing, but the are repair kits now that massively reduce the cost to fix.
As with all direct injection engines of that age, the intake valves get covered with gunk over time, meaning that performance and economy can be affected. Walnut blasting is the official technique by which they are cleaned. Worth doing every 50-60k miles and shouldn't be too expensive.
Depending on driving style, 30+mpg isn't hard to get and up to 40 is possible if hypermiling. Tax in LCI models is better at £320ish compared to £500+, but honestly, why worry about that? It's a drip in the ocean of modern motoring costs.
Handling wise it is heavy so no Elise, but it is good and hydraulic steering system helps make it feel less disconnected as with modern cars. It can be comfortable even in M Sport spec, but avoid 19 inch alloys as they will impact on the ride. Bigger alloys are prone to cracking too.
As for spec, most nice things were options so assume nothing is standard. Try and find ones with the Logic 7 system fitted, easily identified by having tweeters in the a pillar and a speaker in the dash under windscreen. It is good and the standard system is not. IDrive is good, but only on the post September 2008 cars. Earlier system is clunky. M Sport seats are great and very supportive, standard seats are not. Ideally you want them heated and electric, but many are not.
Alternatives are Audi S4 / S5 (V8) which as a little more power, but not as good to drive it seems. Mercedes had a C350 that seems comparible, but not as much about l think. With modifications the N54 can be tuned to around 900hp in the extreme, but 400-500hp is quite achievable and 360-380 is a remap away, if that is your thing
They are really good cars for the money, but buy a ropey one and you will spend a lot of money fixing it.
I had an e90 330i and now have an e92 335i, loads quicker, more tuneable if that's your thing, (which it is for me) but more expensive things that can possibly go wrong, so far mine is ok, injectors may be ticking a bit so I'll think about getting that looked at soon, but it was an 83k car for £4900 so I have a bit of leeway with repairs. I suppose it comes down to whether or not you want more power, if not the 330i is more than fast enough and potentially less costly repairs
I've had my 2007 E90 M Sport manual 335i for six years now. I bought it at 79,000 miles, shipped it back to NZ, and it now has around 108,000 miles on the clock. It had both turbos and injectors replaced under warranty at around 60,000 miles, and since I have owned it, has had the DSC pump and water pump replaced, plus a serpentine belt tensioner which got noisy. I've had some voluntary preventative work carried out on it too - coils, plugs, walnut blasting, engine and gearbox mounts, and a couple of other bits and bobs just to keep it in tip top condition. It has never let me down and it doesn't use a drop of oil between services (that is if the electronic dipstick is to be trusted!)
It remains a joy to drive (apart from in traffic where the manual gearbox is a bit tiresome) - and the cold start sounds fruity enough for most. I tuned mine to MHD stage 1 and at a guess it now has around 350BHP and 360 lb.ft. The engine feels muscular and flexible, if not a screamer like an S65, but for the majority of day to day situations it may well be a better prospect than the M engine. Tooling around town is easy and you can stay in a higher gear than you'd expect, but floor it in third at 50 mph and it'll lunge ahead with that sweet inline 6 howl. I'm considering upgrading the intercooler and downpipes with German Wagner units for a bit of extra pep, since it's become purely a toy with another car taking over family duties. I've fitted Apex wheels and Pilot Sport 4S, along with a Bilstein B12 kit and M3 front arms so it handles just fine now too.
Admittedly I have looked into an E90 M3 because of the wow factor and the sound, but it's just too much extra money. I'd have to sell this and drop another 10,000 quid to get into one - and home improvement costs call!!
So my thoughts are go for it - keep some money aside for the predictable repairs, and enjoy!!
It remains a joy to drive (apart from in traffic where the manual gearbox is a bit tiresome) - and the cold start sounds fruity enough for most. I tuned mine to MHD stage 1 and at a guess it now has around 350BHP and 360 lb.ft. The engine feels muscular and flexible, if not a screamer like an S65, but for the majority of day to day situations it may well be a better prospect than the M engine. Tooling around town is easy and you can stay in a higher gear than you'd expect, but floor it in third at 50 mph and it'll lunge ahead with that sweet inline 6 howl. I'm considering upgrading the intercooler and downpipes with German Wagner units for a bit of extra pep, since it's become purely a toy with another car taking over family duties. I've fitted Apex wheels and Pilot Sport 4S, along with a Bilstein B12 kit and M3 front arms so it handles just fine now too.
Admittedly I have looked into an E90 M3 because of the wow factor and the sound, but it's just too much extra money. I'd have to sell this and drop another 10,000 quid to get into one - and home improvement costs call!!
So my thoughts are go for it - keep some money aside for the predictable repairs, and enjoy!!
Edited by Rdawson on Sunday 14th April 02:03
Evenging,
I'm no technical person, but I always strike up a conversation with indy bmw garages and the likes of. Also i have a few friends with xyz bmws and the likes of.
I used to have an N52 engine and that was really superb. I now drive a car with an n55.
I believe the n54 is great and more like the higher performance cars (most M cars went for the twin turbo vs twin scroll). So when treated / maintained well can be a superior motor, but the n55 is better 'out of the can' and can do more will less xyz done to it.
That being said, a change of turbo on most bmws won't cost much in parts (£500) but will be 12+ hours in install. So when something does eventually happen, then it could be a bit hit (from what I gather from speaking with garages).
In terms of driving, natural vs turbo for bmw to me seems night and day. The n52 was refined and sophisticated. The turbo n55 is boisterous and playful. The turbo lag is little to none, so don't think that's a thing really. It's more a case of power delivery.... essentially what I'm saying is that you may think X is a better decision for mechanical / servicing / cost of usage, but you are looking at 2 very very difference cars depending on turbo vs non turbo. Some may float your boat, others may not.
I'm not sure what I prefer (turbo vs non turbo) but i guess some people have more of a preference between x an y.
I have seen friends spend £xxxx on the n54, so no matter how good it is, I would personally steer clear. I guess some people more savvy with mechanical work would be better off than I would!
FYI ALLL the indy mechanics i speak to have NA engines, bar a few who race / rally etc.... I guess you could ask yourself what prices are you willing to pay for power!? At the end of the day any turbo will increase that power massively, but it comes at a cost.
On a side note my m135i is getting an average of 23mpg, which is far lower than I was expecting.
I'm no technical person, but I always strike up a conversation with indy bmw garages and the likes of. Also i have a few friends with xyz bmws and the likes of.
I used to have an N52 engine and that was really superb. I now drive a car with an n55.
I believe the n54 is great and more like the higher performance cars (most M cars went for the twin turbo vs twin scroll). So when treated / maintained well can be a superior motor, but the n55 is better 'out of the can' and can do more will less xyz done to it.
That being said, a change of turbo on most bmws won't cost much in parts (£500) but will be 12+ hours in install. So when something does eventually happen, then it could be a bit hit (from what I gather from speaking with garages).
In terms of driving, natural vs turbo for bmw to me seems night and day. The n52 was refined and sophisticated. The turbo n55 is boisterous and playful. The turbo lag is little to none, so don't think that's a thing really. It's more a case of power delivery.... essentially what I'm saying is that you may think X is a better decision for mechanical / servicing / cost of usage, but you are looking at 2 very very difference cars depending on turbo vs non turbo. Some may float your boat, others may not.
I'm not sure what I prefer (turbo vs non turbo) but i guess some people have more of a preference between x an y.
I have seen friends spend £xxxx on the n54, so no matter how good it is, I would personally steer clear. I guess some people more savvy with mechanical work would be better off than I would!
FYI ALLL the indy mechanics i speak to have NA engines, bar a few who race / rally etc.... I guess you could ask yourself what prices are you willing to pay for power!? At the end of the day any turbo will increase that power massively, but it comes at a cost.
On a side note my m135i is getting an average of 23mpg, which is far lower than I was expecting.
Edited by theog87 on Sunday 14th April 21:29
rayyan171 said:
It is perfectly fine. It faces all the issues most modern BMW's face today. HPFP issues, injector issues, and even turbocharger issues are certainly not exclusive to the 335i. The water pump issues have plagued BMW since the early years, and still do to this date. In terms of BMW's and their running costs, these are rather good. Solid gearbox, less issues as not a diesel, tyres aren't £1100 per set and no xDrive system to worry about. X5's are reliable as well but with them come considerably higher running costs.
That's true, but as far as I know the water pump is the only major issue with the N52 engine - certainly no HPFP, injector or turbo issues, nor the coking up needing walnut blasting N53s seem to suffer from. Which is why I bought an N52 as a daily, based on my experience of nearly 5 years of Z4Coupe ownership (also N52 engine) which in a Z4 is pretty close to a standard 335i in performance, but a totally different experience because of what it is fitted to!
But if you want to modify, a 335i has to be the way to go!
Just go and buy it. There are so many valid horror stories and if you believe them all you'll never buy a car.
It was this time last year I was looking to trade in my 335d for something else.
I definitely wanted a convertible and saw a 2008 335i with DCT M Sport. Its a fun car when the weather is nice. I also went for that one as it had the old twin turbo set up but not that £500 VED bill per year.
Go for the best car you can afford, I always remember buying an MR2 n/a when I could have afforded a Turbo for £300 more. You'll only regret not enjoying the car you want, but obviously do it within your means.
It was this time last year I was looking to trade in my 335d for something else.
I definitely wanted a convertible and saw a 2008 335i with DCT M Sport. Its a fun car when the weather is nice. I also went for that one as it had the old twin turbo set up but not that £500 VED bill per year.
Go for the best car you can afford, I always remember buying an MR2 n/a when I could have afforded a Turbo for £300 more. You'll only regret not enjoying the car you want, but obviously do it within your means.
Edited by mm511 on Monday 15th April 17:23
Hi
To the original poster - please ignore everything on the internet and go out and buy the 335i. I have had mine for 7 years and its still under BMW warranty and I have been paying for this for the last 7 years. The car is absolutely amazing and still put a huge smile on my face, the power, the acceleration, the noise and everything else. I believe I have one of the best examples in the country now, White, 335i M Sport Coupe which had every single option ticked years ago. Its the N54 engine and only has 39, 000 miles, the car is wonderful and is only used on Saturdays to go to the gym and back. I read all the horror stories 7 years ago and purchased this car, the car is incredible and its never failed on me and if it ever does I pay BMW £55 a month which will cover all turbos etc.. in the 7 years I have paid BMW about £4600 ON Warranty but I have never had to use it, its a very reliable machine. I am now after 7 years of ownership going to sell this car and get myself a F10 M5 as they have hit the 25k mark where you can buy a nice example. Anyone made the move from a 335i to a M5?
To the original poster - please ignore everything on the internet and go out and buy the 335i. I have had mine for 7 years and its still under BMW warranty and I have been paying for this for the last 7 years. The car is absolutely amazing and still put a huge smile on my face, the power, the acceleration, the noise and everything else. I believe I have one of the best examples in the country now, White, 335i M Sport Coupe which had every single option ticked years ago. Its the N54 engine and only has 39, 000 miles, the car is wonderful and is only used on Saturdays to go to the gym and back. I read all the horror stories 7 years ago and purchased this car, the car is incredible and its never failed on me and if it ever does I pay BMW £55 a month which will cover all turbos etc.. in the 7 years I have paid BMW about £4600 ON Warranty but I have never had to use it, its a very reliable machine. I am now after 7 years of ownership going to sell this car and get myself a F10 M5 as they have hit the 25k mark where you can buy a nice example. Anyone made the move from a 335i to a M5?
BM Man said:
Hi
To the original poster - please ignore everything on the internet and go out and buy the 335i. I have had mine for 7 years and its still under BMW warranty and I have been paying for this for the last 7 years. The car is absolutely amazing and still put a huge smile on my face, the power, the acceleration, the noise and everything else. I believe I have one of the best examples in the country now, White, 335i M Sport Coupe which had every single option ticked years ago. Its the N54 engine and only has 39, 000 miles, the car is wonderful and is only used on Saturdays to go to the gym and back. I read all the horror stories 7 years ago and purchased this car, the car is incredible and its never failed on me and if it ever does I pay BMW £55 a month which will cover all turbos etc.. in the 7 years I have paid BMW about £4600 ON Warranty but I have never had to use it, its a very reliable machine. I am now after 7 years of ownership going to sell this car and get myself a F10 M5 as they have hit the 25k mark where you can buy a nice example. Anyone made the move from a 335i to a M5?
How far is it to the gym and back?To the original poster - please ignore everything on the internet and go out and buy the 335i. I have had mine for 7 years and its still under BMW warranty and I have been paying for this for the last 7 years. The car is absolutely amazing and still put a huge smile on my face, the power, the acceleration, the noise and everything else. I believe I have one of the best examples in the country now, White, 335i M Sport Coupe which had every single option ticked years ago. Its the N54 engine and only has 39, 000 miles, the car is wonderful and is only used on Saturdays to go to the gym and back. I read all the horror stories 7 years ago and purchased this car, the car is incredible and its never failed on me and if it ever does I pay BMW £55 a month which will cover all turbos etc.. in the 7 years I have paid BMW about £4600 ON Warranty but I have never had to use it, its a very reliable machine. I am now after 7 years of ownership going to sell this car and get myself a F10 M5 as they have hit the 25k mark where you can buy a nice example. Anyone made the move from a 335i to a M5?
I guess it depends on the age of the car you're looking at, how much you're looking at spending and how much you value reliability.
Pre-facelift E90 3-Series
The N52 330i is reliable, bar the water pump
The N54 335i has historically had issues with turbos, injectors, high pressure fuel pump, water pump and carbon build up. If these have all been addressed then the risk goes down. I've had a N54 for 3 years - it's had both pumps and injectors replaced in that time.
Facelift E90 3-Series
The N53 330i has issues with injectors, high pressure fuel pump, water pump. If these have all been addressed then the risk goes down
The N55 335i seems to have significantly fewer issues with turbos, carbon build up and injectors. Pumps still seem to fail.
F30 3-Series
I know less about these, but having driven a few the big difference is that you're more isolated from the driving experience. Steering is an electric rather than hydraulic set up which I wasn't a fan of.
The 335i was a N55. Think the 330i became a 4-cylinder at some point.
So if you value reliability either get an old 330i or a newer 335i. To me, the issues with the N53 don't make sense given the minimal increase in power/economy. Unless you really want a facelift model I suppose.
If I was buying now I'd probably get a N55. Bit less character than the N54, but more reliable and can still be tuned to 360/370 HP without much effort
Pre-facelift E90 3-Series
The N52 330i is reliable, bar the water pump
The N54 335i has historically had issues with turbos, injectors, high pressure fuel pump, water pump and carbon build up. If these have all been addressed then the risk goes down. I've had a N54 for 3 years - it's had both pumps and injectors replaced in that time.
Facelift E90 3-Series
The N53 330i has issues with injectors, high pressure fuel pump, water pump. If these have all been addressed then the risk goes down
The N55 335i seems to have significantly fewer issues with turbos, carbon build up and injectors. Pumps still seem to fail.
F30 3-Series
I know less about these, but having driven a few the big difference is that you're more isolated from the driving experience. Steering is an electric rather than hydraulic set up which I wasn't a fan of.
The 335i was a N55. Think the 330i became a 4-cylinder at some point.
So if you value reliability either get an old 330i or a newer 335i. To me, the issues with the N53 don't make sense given the minimal increase in power/economy. Unless you really want a facelift model I suppose.
If I was buying now I'd probably get a N55. Bit less character than the N54, but more reliable and can still be tuned to 360/370 HP without much effort
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