Lando Norris

[Monkeylegend]

Having watched Lando Norris in F2 this weekend and McLarens qualifying performance, if ever there was a partnership dead in the water before it started, this is it.

God help McLaren for 2019, they are going to need it.

Or did I just catch Norris on a bad weekend? There seem to be many better drivers in F2 to choose from but maybe it's all down to money?

[super7]

It was a bad day...... He cocked up by entering the Trident Pit, but then the team dropped and broke the car!

Russel didn't have a good day either......

[Monkeylegend]

Then a 10 second drive through for a schoolboy error in the second race on the formation lap. He will be eaten alive when he tries to mix it with the big boys.

[Order66]

I have my doubts as well. Russell seems a far more mature and well-rounded driver. For me Norris is 3rd or 4th in terms of the current F2 talent, with Russell being top. I'm not convinced either are F1 material yet, but Russell is definitely the closest.

[Kraken]

Norris by his own admission earlier in the season said he would prefer a season of FP1 stints before going into a full race seat. McLaren know they aren't going to be competitive next year so, in their eyes, it could be a good season to give a youngster the experience.

They had to give him something though otherwise he would have been a free agent at the end of September and all the time and money they had put into him would have benefited another team instead.

It's nigh on impossible to judge who is good from F2 alone. The team and track experience plays such a massive part in a spec series and the strike rate for outstanding F2 talent setting the world alight in F1 is not good.

[thegreenhell]

I'd be more worried by having Sainz replace Alonso.

[corozin]

thegreenhell said:

I'd be more worried by having Sainz replace Alonso.

I don't understand your comment. The car isn't that quick, it's not improving, Fernando has had enough and wants to be released to do other stuff. On the other side, Saintz has proven himself quick and consistent, and presumably McLaren have enough data to convince themselves he has the minerals.

The issue remains with the car. I can't understand your comment.

[thegreenhell]

corozin said:

thegreenhell said:

I'd be more worried by having Sainz replace Alonso.

I don't understand your comment. The car isn't that quick, it's not improving, Fernando has had enough and wants to be released to do other stuff. On the other side, Saintz has proven himself quick and consistent, and presumably McLaren have enough data to convince themselves he has the minerals.

The issue remains with the car. I can't understand your comment.

Yes, the car is st. But it is only Alonso's determination that has got them to 6th in the WCC. Sainz is little more than mediocre, and they'd probably be 8th or 9th if he was in the car this year.

[Dr Murdoch]

corozin said:

and presumably McLaren have enough data to convince themselves he has the minerals.

and presumably Red Bull have enough data to convince themselves he doesn't have the minerals?

[mattikake]

You caught Norris on one of his 2 really bad weekends. He has won everything he has competed at in a full season in except Ginetta Juniors and I guess soon to add F2 to that, including the highly competitive Euro F3 series where he shone. Russell OTOH has pretty much appeared from nowhere in GP3 (his Euro F3 season was nothing special) and hasn't had anywhere near as shinny earlier career as Norris. Russell has certainly surprised me.

I think until recently, Norris has been in championship conservation mode since race 1 Russell has been chasing. Russell was also with ART in GP3 and F2. Arguably the best team. Carlin are good but maybe not as good.

A better measure for their performances has been to compare them to teammates. Sette Camara has had the measure of Norris several times in quali and race. Aitkin has been blown away by Russell. Both drivers can race on their day.

But Russell has been the clear class of the field in F2 on pace, race craft and consistency. He should have an even bigger lead is you take Baku into account (taken out on a SC restart, while leading comfortably in race 1 and therefore ruining race 2 for him). If you're only as good as your last race, Russell needs to have Bottas' or Stroll's seat.

Neither have a record like Hamilton's though. In fact, not even if their records were combined... Still, both are capable of winning the F1 championship in the right car imo.

[Muzzer79]

corozin said:

thegreenhell said:

I'd be more worried by having Sainz replace Alonso.

I don't understand your comment. The car isn't that quick, it's not improving, Fernando has had enough and wants to be released to do other stuff. On the other side, Saintz has proven himself quick and consistent, and presumably McLaren have enough data to convince themselves he has the minerals.

The issue remains with the car. I can't understand your comment.

If the issue is with the car, why not retain Vandoorne?

Sainz is good, but he’s no Alonso. This may be a good thing (taking away the pressure of having a double WDC in the team may help) or a bad thing (Alonso gets results that car has no right to get, not sure Sainz has the same ‘minerals’)

[Kraken]

Muzzer79 said:

If the issue is with the car, why not retain Vandoorne?

Sainz is good, but he’s no Alonso. This may be a good thing (taking away the pressure of having a double WDC in the team may help) or a bad thing (Alonso gets results that car has no right to get, not sure Sainz has the same ‘minerals’)

Presumably with the mountains of data they have McLaren know that the problems aren't all with the car with Stoffel.

[RobGT81]

I don't understand the rush to get any of these kids into F1 cars.

[Monkeylegend]

Artem Markelov would have been my choice based on this weekend, did a Verstappen in the first race, or should I say Verstappen did a Markelov in the F1 race

[ajprice]

When Verstappen is the old guy...

[Kraken]

RobGT81 said:

I don't understand the rush to get any of these kids into F1 cars.

Just the way it is with the fan base these days. They're obsessed with getting youngsters in the cars whether it's F1, BTCC or anything else.

[Norfolkit]

Dr Murdoch said:

corozin said:

and presumably McLaren have enough data to convince themselves he has the minerals.

and presumably Red Bull have enough data to convince themselves he doesn't have the minerals?

I'm confused, which minerals does he not have or indeed have, as the case may be?

[Some Gump]

He's had some very good performances, and is head and shoukders winning the PR battle.

McLaren have needed better PR ever since they lost vodafone. If there is even a chance hst Norris can open sponsorship doors they'd be daft not to have a punt.

[anonymous-user]

Some Gump said:

He's had some very good performances, and is head and shoukders winning the PR battle.

McLaren have needed better PR ever since they lost vodafone. If there is even a chance hst Norris can open sponsorship doors they'd be daft not to have a punt.

Do you mean his dad can open sponsorship doors?

[andrewcliffe]

Norris' family seems to have plenty of money, but probably contacts as well.

Russell started his single seater career in Formula Renault Europe, but won the BRDC Formula Four title in 2014, before moving back to Europe for the F3 series in 2015 and 2016. Respectable performances but he wasn't in a Carlin or Prema car. Won the GP3 championship in 2017 at his first attempt and moved to F2 for 2018 and is currently on course for the title.

Norris is two years younger and has risen through the ranks quicker, and has been busy - 2015 contested four UK/European championships winning one, 2016 contested three European championships winning two and an New Zealand championship, again winning it. 2017 won European F3, 2018 skipped GP3 and went straight to F2.

Both are talents and GB Motorsport should be proud, but also remember they are youngsters and need time to develop.