PCCB durability for track days
Discussion
Looking ahead to the track day season and trying out my amazing new 991.2 GT3 how many track days can I expect before I get a massive new bill for a set of new PCCB's?
Before you all say I should have gone for steels my choice was based on mainly fast road use with just a few track days.
Also I haven't tracked for quite a few years now so very out of practice and likely will be hard on the brakes initially.
All good advice welcome please.
Before you all say I should have gone for steels my choice was based on mainly fast road use with just a few track days.
Also I haven't tracked for quite a few years now so very out of practice and likely will be hard on the brakes initially.
All good advice welcome please.
I’ve gone pccbs too on my car.
My very simplified understanding is that it’s all about heat build up and eventually overheating the discs, they get glazed (?) at which point the damage is done.
tracks with longer straights (spa , the ring and the like ) will mitigate this risk.
Brands Indy , not so much!!
I’ll be driving to spa with mine and I’m not too worried about it.
Cool down laps and short sessions are the order of the day to control this heat issue.
Sand traps are not ideal either!!
My very simplified understanding is that it’s all about heat build up and eventually overheating the discs, they get glazed (?) at which point the damage is done.
tracks with longer straights (spa , the ring and the like ) will mitigate this risk.
Brands Indy , not so much!!
I’ll be driving to spa with mine and I’m not too worried about it.
Cool down laps and short sessions are the order of the day to control this heat issue.
Sand traps are not ideal either!!
Koln-RS said:
Lots of people track with pccbs with no issues - look at some of the PEC cars.
It's only where you are doing regular track days that steels might be more cost effective, but then you'd probably be looking at some aftermarket options.
I was told PCCB equipped cars at PEC always do a cool down lap....don’t know if that’s trueIt's only where you are doing regular track days that steels might be more cost effective, but then you'd probably be looking at some aftermarket options.
Cheib said:
Koln-RS said:
Lots of people track with pccbs with no issues - look at some of the PEC cars.
It's only where you are doing regular track days that steels might be more cost effective, but then you'd probably be looking at some aftermarket options.
I was told PCCB equipped cars at PEC always do a cool down lap....don’t know if that’s trueIt's only where you are doing regular track days that steels might be more cost effective, but then you'd probably be looking at some aftermarket options.
worldwidewebs said:
Cheib said:
Koln-RS said:
Lots of people track with pccbs with no issues - look at some of the PEC cars.
It's only where you are doing regular track days that steels might be more cost effective, but then you'd probably be looking at some aftermarket options.
I was told PCCB equipped cars at PEC always do a cool down lap....don’t know if that’s trueIt's only where you are doing regular track days that steels might be more cost effective, but then you'd probably be looking at some aftermarket options.
PCCB’s are great on track, exactly what they were made for!! Spa is pretty heavy on brakes, mainly because of the high speeds you get to in what is a reasonably heavy car.
I tracked my 997RS around 4-5 time’s a year for 6 years of ownership, including 2 trips to spa. Pads would never last that long, especially once the rotors started de laminating. I probably went through a set of front pads every 3 track days. As others have commented, it’s best replace at 50% worn.
At the end of ownership, the discs were fine for road use, but you could visibly see the circular wear markers and the surface wasn’t what they used to be. Track performance suffered with poor heat dissipation.
Cost for new discs= £19k!!
I ended up using a company in Germany to refurbish themfor a quarter of the price; the end result was fantastic, but it took a long time to turnaround.
I would still use pccb’s on track, as their awesome.... but just be aware that if you’re heavy on the brakes, you might have a big bill a few years down the line!!!
I tracked my 997RS around 4-5 time’s a year for 6 years of ownership, including 2 trips to spa. Pads would never last that long, especially once the rotors started de laminating. I probably went through a set of front pads every 3 track days. As others have commented, it’s best replace at 50% worn.
At the end of ownership, the discs were fine for road use, but you could visibly see the circular wear markers and the surface wasn’t what they used to be. Track performance suffered with poor heat dissipation.
Cost for new discs= £19k!!
I ended up using a company in Germany to refurbish themfor a quarter of the price; the end result was fantastic, but it took a long time to turnaround.
I would still use pccb’s on track, as their awesome.... but just be aware that if you’re heavy on the brakes, you might have a big bill a few years down the line!!!
Double gauche said:
I’ve gone pccbs too on my car.
My very simplified understanding is that it’s all about heat build up and eventually overheating the discs, they get glazed (?) at which point the damage is done.
tracks with longer straights (spa , the ring and the like ) will mitigate this risk.
Brands Indy , not so much!!
I’ll be driving to spa with mine and I’m not too worried about it.
Cool down laps and short sessions are the order of the day to control this heat issue.
Sand traps are not ideal either!!
Most unlikely you would be on Brands for long enough to damage the brakes given the noise issue!My very simplified understanding is that it’s all about heat build up and eventually overheating the discs, they get glazed (?) at which point the damage is done.
tracks with longer straights (spa , the ring and the like ) will mitigate this risk.
Brands Indy , not so much!!
I’ll be driving to spa with mine and I’m not too worried about it.
Cool down laps and short sessions are the order of the day to control this heat issue.
Sand traps are not ideal either!!
xbowdan said:
PCCB’s are great on track, exactly what they were made for!! Spa is pretty heavy on brakes, mainly because of the high speeds you get to in what is a reasonably heavy car.
I tracked my 997RS around 4-5 time’s a year for 6 years of ownership, including 2 trips to spa. Pads would never last that long, especially once the rotors started de laminating. I probably went through a set of front pads every 3 track days. As others have commented, it’s best replace at 50% worn.
At the end of ownership, the discs were fine for road use, but you could visibly see the circular wear markers and the surface wasn’t what they used to be. Track performance suffered with poor heat dissipation.
Cost for new discs= £19k!!
I ended up using a company in Germany to refurbish themfor a quarter of the price; the end result was fantastic, but it took a long time to turnaround.
I would still use pccb’s on track, as their awesome.... but just be aware that if you’re heavy on the brakes, you might have a big bill a few years down the line!!!
Which company in Germany did you use if I may ask?I tracked my 997RS around 4-5 time’s a year for 6 years of ownership, including 2 trips to spa. Pads would never last that long, especially once the rotors started de laminating. I probably went through a set of front pads every 3 track days. As others have commented, it’s best replace at 50% worn.
At the end of ownership, the discs were fine for road use, but you could visibly see the circular wear markers and the surface wasn’t what they used to be. Track performance suffered with poor heat dissipation.
Cost for new discs= £19k!!
I ended up using a company in Germany to refurbish themfor a quarter of the price; the end result was fantastic, but it took a long time to turnaround.
I would still use pccb’s on track, as their awesome.... but just be aware that if you’re heavy on the brakes, you might have a big bill a few years down the line!!!
Thanks all for your replies so far. Clearly I will be doing a couple of cooling off laps but if I can get a few years use from them even with a handful of track days per year that would be a good result.
With my old 996GT3 I had to replace the fronts after 2 or 3 track days due to hairline cracks appearing. So maybe the replacement cost wouldn't be so different over time.
With my old 996GT3 I had to replace the fronts after 2 or 3 track days due to hairline cracks appearing. So maybe the replacement cost wouldn't be so different over time.
browngt3 said:
£19k for a set of new disks! Really? Don't feel bad anymore about paying £6k for mine. Or are they subsidised by Porsche when purchasing a new car?
Price on a new car is much less than the replacement cost. You're paying the difference between the standard steel setup and the PCCB setup but even then I think there's a bit of a discount.Replacement disc prices are an absolute shocker!
From experience I know that the rear discs on a 997 GT3 were subject to a lot of wear on track due to the selective intervention of the anti-lock brake mechansim as a stability and traction aid (I seem to recall that you couldn't fully deselect this functionality by using the controls in the cabin). It was related to a change in lsd mechanical (ramp angles?) settings going from 996 to 997, with the 997 generation cars being engineered to rely more on fiddle-brake activation rather than on diff-locking. This led to more wear on rear discs than on the fronts - somewhat counter-intuitive until you understood what was going on and, in the case of PCCBs, a rather expensive experience...
Does anyone know - is this still the case with 991 GT3 generation cars? Are the rear discs still subjected to this harder life (and risk of early and expensive wear-out) as was the case with 997 generation vehicles?
James
Does anyone know - is this still the case with 991 GT3 generation cars? Are the rear discs still subjected to this harder life (and risk of early and expensive wear-out) as was the case with 997 generation vehicles?
James
Edited by short-shift on Wednesday 24th January 12:13
I'll chip in here...
My 991 GT3 has over 30K miles on it.
First owner drove it hard - very hard - for the first 18 months of its life.
I've had it 2.5 years and done a few trackdays (can't remember exactly how many , but its 10+)
My discs are original.
No wear markers visible.
Pads - no idea how old, but I haven't changed them since buying the car from the OPC 2.5 years ago
Front and Rear have both still got 11 mm of material left
I'm pretty sure they are 18mm new.
So, I'm getting ready for new pads all round this year, at around £550 all in
My 991 GT3 has over 30K miles on it.
First owner drove it hard - very hard - for the first 18 months of its life.
I've had it 2.5 years and done a few trackdays (can't remember exactly how many , but its 10+)
My discs are original.
No wear markers visible.
Pads - no idea how old, but I haven't changed them since buying the car from the OPC 2.5 years ago
Front and Rear have both still got 11 mm of material left
I'm pretty sure they are 18mm new.
So, I'm getting ready for new pads all round this year, at around £550 all in
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