Agile PM - what qualification if any?
Discussion
any thoughts on the value of Agile PM qualifications? Is it just a CV pleaser?
Looking for jobs in the market, Agile seems to be the way things are going. Trying to broaden my appeal to other companies and industries (currently in FS) - as I'm working mainly in regulatory stuff atm which is generally more waterfall type methodology (I have Prince2). I have around 3.5 years of formal PM experience (business side not IT). I'm trying to get some exposure to Agile in my current company so I can reference experience although proving difficult as its not used in my current line of work.
I fancy a change (looking to get into something like digital transformation) and trying to figure out the first steps in doing this - any thoughts?
Looking for jobs in the market, Agile seems to be the way things are going. Trying to broaden my appeal to other companies and industries (currently in FS) - as I'm working mainly in regulatory stuff atm which is generally more waterfall type methodology (I have Prince2). I have around 3.5 years of formal PM experience (business side not IT). I'm trying to get some exposure to Agile in my current company so I can reference experience although proving difficult as its not used in my current line of work.
I fancy a change (looking to get into something like digital transformation) and trying to figure out the first steps in doing this - any thoughts?
IMO yes, just a CV pleaser. I work in Service Delivery Management, and went on an Agile Service Manager course earlier this year, the thinking being, could we do more with less, get some new ideas, etc. It turned out to be 2 days of describing the Agile methodology, which I wasn't especially impressed by anyway, and concluded that "so, you can apply Agile to being an SDM".
Felt to me very much like they were just fishing for angles from which they could sell more Agile training and exams, and I said so after.
I think PRINCE2 is far more worth having from the point of view of getting your foot in the door (I am P2 Practitioner) but even then I think that PM comes down a lot more to knowing the subject and the requirement, having a lot of common sense, and being willing to bug people endlessly if they're not delivering what they need to!
Felt to me very much like they were just fishing for angles from which they could sell more Agile training and exams, and I said so after.
I think PRINCE2 is far more worth having from the point of view of getting your foot in the door (I am P2 Practitioner) but even then I think that PM comes down a lot more to knowing the subject and the requirement, having a lot of common sense, and being willing to bug people endlessly if they're not delivering what they need to!
No easy answer, but if it's what the market wants then you need to have it to get to interview otherwise you'll be shortlisted out.
As stated above though, some may not fully understand what it is they're asking for. Best bet is to cover all bases in order to get shortlisted to interview, then you can talk sense with them.
As stated above though, some may not fully understand what it is they're asking for. Best bet is to cover all bases in order to get shortlisted to interview, then you can talk sense with them.
CAPP0 said:
I think that PM comes down a lot more to knowing the subject and the requirement, having a lot of common sense, and being willing to bug people endlessly if they're not delivering what they need to!
I've met a few PMs that were into bugging people. The bad ones were incredibly annoying and counter-productive. The good ones took the time to work out why what should be delivered hadn't been.spikeyhead said:
CAPP0 said:
I think that PM comes down a lot more to knowing the subject and the requirement, having a lot of common sense, and being willing to bug people endlessly if they're not delivering what they need to!
I've met a few PMs that were into bugging people. The bad ones were incredibly annoying and counter-productive. The good ones took the time to work out why what should be delivered hadn't been."What are you doing about this problem?"
"Nothing"
"Why not?"
"Because I'm sitting here talking to you."
Dr Jekyll said:
spikeyhead said:
CAPP0 said:
I think that PM comes down a lot more to knowing the subject and the requirement, having a lot of common sense, and being willing to bug people endlessly if they're not delivering what they need to!
I've met a few PMs that were into bugging people. The bad ones were incredibly annoying and counter-productive. The good ones took the time to work out why what should be delivered hadn't been."What are you doing about this problem?"
"Nothing"
"Why not?"
"Because I'm sitting here talking to you."
Actually, the very best PMs would be proactive, so the most difficult tasks were with the most skilled people and they'd be checking in advance that things were on schedule and add resources and motivation where necessary.
slow_poke said:
First things first I suppose.... You realise there is not such thing as a PM in Agile? Are you thinking Scrum Master role or Product Owner role? Both widely differing from each other.
plenty of PM roles in big corporates that purport to be Agile regardless of whether there should be. I'm a product owner in a scrum team and work with a PM and Scrum Master.OP - if you're in FS, I highly recommend doing this: http://getsmarter.mit.edu/fintech-future-commerce/
I did it last year and my business plan was selected as one of 8 winners (from 1,000 people). Since that's gone on my LinkedIn I get dozens more emails from recruiters every week.
BJG1 said:
slow_poke said:
First things first I suppose.... You realise there is not such thing as a PM in Agile? Are you thinking Scrum Master role or Product Owner role? Both widely differing from each other.
plenty of PM roles in big corporates that purport to be Agile regardless of whether there should be. I'm a product owner in a scrum team and work with a PM and Scrum Master.OP - if you're in FS, I highly recommend doing this: http://getsmarter.mit.edu/fintech-future-commerce/
I did it last year and my business plan was selected as one of 8 winners (from 1,000 people). Since that's gone on my LinkedIn I get dozens more emails from recruiters every week.
slow_poke said:
Ok, I'll bite because I'm interested in how you organize yourselves - what role in Agile does your PM do? Or is it a case of your PM sitting outside the Agile environment but employing it (the SM, the PO, the Scrum of Devs) to deliver his project?
We are set up in demand and supply teams (which I don't really think works with Agile but we pretend it does). I work as a PO in a demand team, the PM lines up work with supply teams and manages finances. My 'SCRUM team' is 2x BAs, 1xPO, 1xPM, 1xSM and 1x solution designer.I'm sure you're going to tell me how that's not Agile but it doesn't really matter, my point was there will be plenty of businesses who describe themselves as Agile employing PMs.
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