Audi S1 quattro trying to kill me
Discussion
Hi guys, just popped over from the TVR forum with an issue with my new daily driver. It's a Feb 2016 S1 in Mythos Black and I've had it three weeks.
It's a great looking car and goes quite well, but on three occasions now (twice in the damp, once in the dry) I've had trouble keeping it on the black
stuff going around medium to tight bends, and generally when pushing on it feels a bit twitchy.
So, I checked the Bridgestone Potenza S001 225/35x18 tyre pressures last week and was amazed to find out the fronts were 38psi and the rears 32psi, which sounds very high to me, and why the difference?
So I checked the manufacturers recommended pressures as on the driver door label, which was even higher 39 front 33 rear unladen.
Anyone running lower pressures, if so what? I've lowered them to 33psi front, 30psi rear which seems to ride the bumps and pot holes better, but driving like
Miss Daisy at the moment.
A few years ago I ran 18's on my Chimaera, the fronts were exactly the same size as the S1; 18x7.5 225/35 but Toyo S01's, and I ran them with no issues
at 24psi - even on track days.
The Bridgstones have a date stamp of 2012, so only five years old. I wouldn't have thought they've gone off.
Any thoughts?
It's a great looking car and goes quite well, but on three occasions now (twice in the damp, once in the dry) I've had trouble keeping it on the black
stuff going around medium to tight bends, and generally when pushing on it feels a bit twitchy.
So, I checked the Bridgestone Potenza S001 225/35x18 tyre pressures last week and was amazed to find out the fronts were 38psi and the rears 32psi, which sounds very high to me, and why the difference?
So I checked the manufacturers recommended pressures as on the driver door label, which was even higher 39 front 33 rear unladen.
Anyone running lower pressures, if so what? I've lowered them to 33psi front, 30psi rear which seems to ride the bumps and pot holes better, but driving like
Miss Daisy at the moment.
A few years ago I ran 18's on my Chimaera, the fronts were exactly the same size as the S1; 18x7.5 225/35 but Toyo S01's, and I ran them with no issues
at 24psi - even on track days.
The Bridgstones have a date stamp of 2012, so only five years old. I wouldn't have thought they've gone off.
Any thoughts?
Franksy said:
Bridgstones
This is the cause of your issues, at least from the vehicle point of view. The Bridgestones are not great, but add cold weather and damp conditions and you really need to dial the enthusiasm back a bit until spring, or fit some better rubber! 5 year old tyres with some significant wear on them are pretty much past their bestThe car only had 3400 miles on the clock from new and still with plenty of tread depth. Thought the Potenzas were better than that.
What's the preferred alternative? A lot of the TVR guys like the Uniroyal Rainsport 3's and I had them on my previous daily driver
a Volvo V70 D5 estate - don't laugh! Even with a better tyre is 39psi front and 33psi rear still really recommended?
What's the preferred alternative? A lot of the TVR guys like the Uniroyal Rainsport 3's and I had them on my previous daily driver
a Volvo V70 D5 estate - don't laugh! Even with a better tyre is 39psi front and 33psi rear still really recommended?
Double checked all four tyres this morning. They are the correct tyre for the vehicle i.e.: 87Y XL. The DOT code on all four is the same, week 28, year 2015. So
correct for the age of vehicle and still with 5-6mm of tread all round. But on another section of side wall it states Made In Poland 2012 which is odd.
I'm therefor inclined to believe the tyres aren't up to much, and so while the weather's iffy I'll have to tippy toe around. I'll wait and see if they're any better in the spring. If not, I'll change them and also get my TVR guy whose set up my track car to check the geo to make sure everything's pointing in the right direction.
correct for the age of vehicle and still with 5-6mm of tread all round. But on another section of side wall it states Made In Poland 2012 which is odd.
I'm therefor inclined to believe the tyres aren't up to much, and so while the weather's iffy I'll have to tippy toe around. I'll wait and see if they're any better in the spring. If not, I'll change them and also get my TVR guy whose set up my track car to check the geo to make sure everything's pointing in the right direction.
I'd go by the DOT date stamp - that's supposed to be moulded on at the time of production. Other markings (especially non-regulatory) won't change unless there's a good reason.
I haven't looked at the Bridgestones on our new (to us) Golf GTI aside from checking pressures and tread depth - will try to at weekend and see if they're similarly marked.
I'll be swapping them for better rubber as they wear out. Probably Michelin.
I haven't looked at the Bridgestones on our new (to us) Golf GTI aside from checking pressures and tread depth - will try to at weekend and see if they're similarly marked.
I'll be swapping them for better rubber as they wear out. Probably Michelin.
This may sound really condescending but isn't meant to be.
Are you driving it as a 4wd should be driven rather than a RWD or FWD, they are very different driving styles and what unsettles one will be fine for the other.
My GT-Four did strange things a few times when I first got it and I realised I was trying to drive it like I used to drive FWD's, once I drove it how you should drive a 4WD, it behaved much more as expected.
Are you driving it as a 4wd should be driven rather than a RWD or FWD, they are very different driving styles and what unsettles one will be fine for the other.
My GT-Four did strange things a few times when I first got it and I realised I was trying to drive it like I used to drive FWD's, once I drove it how you should drive a 4WD, it behaved much more as expected.
eybic said:
This may sound really condescending but isn't meant to be.
Are you driving it as a 4wd should be driven rather than a RWD or FWD, they are very different driving styles and what unsettles one will be fine for the other.
My GT-Four did strange things a few times when I first got it and I realised I was trying to drive it like I used to drive FWD's, once I drove it how you should drive a 4WD, it behaved much more as expected.
As an S1 owner the car can feel FWD at (most?) times ie simple power on provokes understeer so a lift off turn in seems to be required to get it turning with less understeer, and in the wet the rear can feel a little lively on lift off. For info it is Haldex so naturally more FWD like than a GT-4 or Mitsie Evo with a more "direct" connection to the rear wheelsAre you driving it as a 4wd should be driven rather than a RWD or FWD, they are very different driving styles and what unsettles one will be fine for the other.
My GT-Four did strange things a few times when I first got it and I realised I was trying to drive it like I used to drive FWD's, once I drove it how you should drive a 4WD, it behaved much more as expected.
Having covered a few thousand miles on mine with the oem 18" Bridgestones I'd say they are rather pants, offering little grip in the dry and less in the wet. A set of MPSS transformed the feel of mine and softened the ride a tad which felt harsh on the oems. That said its a short square car so will probably always feel a little nervous on twisty (bumpy) roads especially in dynamic mode (turn bumpsteer on mode?).
Many thanks for the replies and suggestions. I've only had it four weeks and so still getting used to it's handling characteristics. Never had a four wheel drive car before so I think I'll need to adapt my driving style, perhaps I was expecting too much. I need to 'calm down dear'. The dealership test drive was in the dry and of course I was very well behaved. Generally it does drive well, the super sports seats are great, the radio and sat nav are excellent (don't have either in the Chimaera). And it looks great in black with privacy glass. If it still feels twitchy and so not confidence inspiring come the spring I'll change the rubber. Plus I may get a second set of wheels to run each winter with winter or all round specific tyres.
I've recently bought one too and have experienced exactly the same phenomena as you.
I was quite surprised how readily it was to move to over steer when turned in 'semi' aggressively, the back end feels mobile which I wasn't expecting after reading many reviews before hand.
I also checked the tyre pressures and was surprised to see 39F/33R but I've stuck with it for the time being.
I was quite surprised how readily it was to move to over steer when turned in 'semi' aggressively, the back end feels mobile which I wasn't expecting after reading many reviews before hand.
I also checked the tyre pressures and was surprised to see 39F/33R but I've stuck with it for the time being.
Read the handbook re tyre pressures. They have an economy setting and a comfort setting. These days they'll give the economy setting as the standard pressures diplayed on the petrol flap etc as it keeps emissions better etc.
A quick delve into the books will reveal the comfort pressures and I'm sure you'll see an improvement.
Had a similar carry on with a new A4 1.4. Car is now much more comfortable, grippy and on the motorway, quieter.
A quick delve into the books will reveal the comfort pressures and I'm sure you'll see an improvement.
Had a similar carry on with a new A4 1.4. Car is now much more comfortable, grippy and on the motorway, quieter.
MJK 24 said:
Read the handbook re tyre pressures. They have an economy setting and a comfort setting. These days they'll give the economy setting as the standard pressures diplayed on the petrol flap etc as it keeps emissions better etc.
A quick delve into the books will reveal the comfort pressures and I'm sure you'll see an improvement.
Had a similar carry on with a new A4 1.4. Car is now much more comfortable, grippy and on the motorway, quieter.
The handbook says refer to the door sticker ... the door sticker only gives loaded and unloaded (higher) options.A quick delve into the books will reveal the comfort pressures and I'm sure you'll see an improvement.
Had a similar carry on with a new A4 1.4. Car is now much more comfortable, grippy and on the motorway, quieter.
Have to say I think it's your tyres. Like another here I had Bridgestone's on my RS4 B8, great in the warm dry weather but the tram lining was awful. After 14000 miles I switched to Continentals and the difference is quite marked, far more stable under load and much more grip in the wet and cold. HTH
Thanks all - looks like it's the Bridgestone Potenza S001's not liking our cold damp British weather. Thinking about Michelin Pilot Sport 4, Continental ContactSport 5, Goodyear Eagle F1 asymmetric 3 or possibly Uniroyal Rainsport 3 (Tivvers like them.) Only the Conti's & Rainsport available in 225/35x18 I believe, the other two would have to be 225/40x18. Plenty of room in arches but would put speedo out a bit. Got all year to think about it, unless S001's are just as useless in the summer.
Franksy said:
Thanks all - looks like it's the Bridgestone Potenza S001's not liking our cold damp British weather. Thinking about Michelin Pilot Sport 4, Continental ContactSport 5, Goodyear Eagle F1 asymmetric 3 or possibly Uniroyal Rainsport 3 (Tivvers like them.) Only the Conti's & Rainsport available in 225/35x18 I believe, the other two would have to be 225/40x18. Plenty of room in arches but would put speedo out a bit. Got all year to think about it, unless S001's are just as useless in the summer.
It depends how wet summer is. I've never felt like I was going to lose control but I have performed some fairly spectacular four wheel drifts around the roundabout at J9 of the M27 trying to beat the lights in the wet. Presumably the S1 has the same Haldex system as the 8P S3 in which case it will be more prone to understeer and there'll be less flattering and more of an annoyance. I've heard nothing but praise for the Goodyear eagle assymetrics.Gassing Station | Audi, Seat, Skoda & VW | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff