Talk me in to a 996...
Discussion
So, a bit of background info.
I'm up in Aberdeen and working in the oil & gas industry and, like many people up here, was made redundant last year due to the oil price debacle. This meant I had to sell my pride and joy - 2007 Aston V8 Vantage. Before that I had a few fast Audis, most recently a B5 RS4.
I've just bought a 2001 Mini Cooper snotter for the commute etc and I now have a reduced budget for a fun car (~£15k). 996 prices are holding firm/rising and this appeals. I quite fancy my first Porsche and don't think I can stretch to a manual 928 as much as I'd love one.
I've spotted a manual Guards red C4 selling privately that I like the look of - should I be overly bothered it has 100k+ miles on it and no evidence of IMS & RMS work? I know that's a difficult question to answer, having read up on the topic.
Other cars I'm considering include: Lotus Elise or Esprit, 928, RS4, 190 Cosworth, V12 XJS (6.0)...
Please convince me that I'll love a 996!
I'm up in Aberdeen and working in the oil & gas industry and, like many people up here, was made redundant last year due to the oil price debacle. This meant I had to sell my pride and joy - 2007 Aston V8 Vantage. Before that I had a few fast Audis, most recently a B5 RS4.
I've just bought a 2001 Mini Cooper snotter for the commute etc and I now have a reduced budget for a fun car (~£15k). 996 prices are holding firm/rising and this appeals. I quite fancy my first Porsche and don't think I can stretch to a manual 928 as much as I'd love one.
I've spotted a manual Guards red C4 selling privately that I like the look of - should I be overly bothered it has 100k+ miles on it and no evidence of IMS & RMS work? I know that's a difficult question to answer, having read up on the topic.
Other cars I'm considering include: Lotus Elise or Esprit, 928, RS4, 190 Cosworth, V12 XJS (6.0)...
Please convince me that I'll love a 996!
Get the Elise (or a VX220) - you'll enjoy it a damn sight more than an aging 996 prone to horrific garage bills due to the engine which is made from chocolate.
They're also incredibly dull to drive.
I'm sure there'll be others here that have an alternative view based on their ownership. I can only speak of mine, and that of my two friends who also had a 996 (one still has his C4S as he's ploughed £17K into it in the last two years)
They're also incredibly dull to drive.
I'm sure there'll be others here that have an alternative view based on their ownership. I can only speak of mine, and that of my two friends who also had a 996 (one still has his C4S as he's ploughed £17K into it in the last two years)
I had an early 996 3.4 and one of the best cars I ever had, thoroughly engaging to drive, felt solid and also quite compact, and sounded good as well. I understood the 3.4 engine was actually one of the most reliable units ??
Mine had the factory sports suspension pack, bit of a mini GT3 only lighter !!
Mine had the factory sports suspension pack, bit of a mini GT3 only lighter !!
2001 996 c2 manual coupe owned a year. Only regret is not getting one sooner,
Have a search for the write up user CMOOSE did on here - worth a read.
Mine had a minor service last week £250 at well known Indy. I do think they are sensitive to suspension wear (like any 15 year old car)and also suspension geometry. Mine did take a little fettling in that department, but well worth it.
Have a search for the write up user CMOOSE did on here - worth a read.
Mine had a minor service last week £250 at well known Indy. I do think they are sensitive to suspension wear (like any 15 year old car)and also suspension geometry. Mine did take a little fettling in that department, but well worth it.
About 10-12 years ago people used to compare here Porsche 964 and Honda S2000, due to reliability or cheap parts. 
(Guess who is laughing now?)
Porsche is more expensive to run especially if it's 100k+ 15 years old, just like the majority of unique and old things in life. Lotus Elise is a totally different kind of car imho, its small and super fun to drive up to 80-100 but doesn't really have much to say after that, a hassle free-crisp 996 would drive great all day whether its motorway, urban or country roads. If I was living in somewhere warmer, twisty fun roads without many motorway trips I would pick Elise probably but other than that 996 is a more convenient choice.
(Guess who is laughing now?)Porsche is more expensive to run especially if it's 100k+ 15 years old, just like the majority of unique and old things in life. Lotus Elise is a totally different kind of car imho, its small and super fun to drive up to 80-100 but doesn't really have much to say after that, a hassle free-crisp 996 would drive great all day whether its motorway, urban or country roads. If I was living in somewhere warmer, twisty fun roads without many motorway trips I would pick Elise probably but other than that 996 is a more convenient choice.
I can only say try before you buy. And if you do, buy on the basis of what has been done to the car, not its mileage. I'd say a 50k miler is a worse proposition than a 70k miler because the former is a pile of bills waiting for the next owner, whereas the latter, someone will have paid them!
A coveted car will have a huge pile of bills supporting it. If those bills show regular servicing, replacement of known failure points such as radiators (including air con) coffin arms, suspension bushes, tensioners etc then the car could be just fine. A car without such history needs to be bought very cheaply indeed, just as the chap who finds 996s dull did. He paid £9,400 for his 2002 car - fantastic value for money; assuming he bought a good car of course.
The OP hasn't really described what use he'd want to put his new toy to. Clearly if it's hooning round those lovely Highland roads, he'll not want an XJS or 928; he'd want an Elise. But if he wants to do John O Groats to Lands End in one day, either of those cars will do just fine.
If he wants a mix of both, I think a 996 will be just perfect for him.
The OP hasn't really described what use he'd want to put his new toy to. Clearly if it's hooning round those lovely Highland roads, he'll not want an XJS or 928; he'd want an Elise. But if he wants to do John O Groats to Lands End in one day, either of those cars will do just fine.
If he wants a mix of both, I think a 996 will be just perfect for him.
There is a comparison to be made. An Elise or VX220 will be the same age as "an aging 996" of similar value. It'll be susceptible to some of the same wear and tear issues - suspension and cooling system for example. Beyond that they're totally different as others have pointed out. I had an Elise for a year or so. It did what Elises do very well, but it was so competent on the road it was often unexciting. The 996 has a depth and appeal which engages you even with the engine off, and it's great to drive - competent and characterful. Yes they can have expensive engine problems. All cars have an Achilles heel by 12 or 15 years old.
All round ability it has to be the 911 virtually any version. The Lotus Elise is a great drive when you're in the mood. Aston's great sense of occasion, A fast Audi is just that, a fast Audi. The VX220 great bang for bucks but one big problem. All the other cars have been referred to as Porsche 911, Lotus Elise, Audi RS* etc. People refer to the VX220 as the VX220....
I had a calypso red vx220 for 5 years, fantastic car, but completely different beast to a 996 in any form. I loved the VX, but sold it in favour of a 996 Turbo as i wanted more stability in wet weather, a car that didn't leak, had a heater that worked, could speak in to passenger whilst driving, able to carry some luggage, etc etc etc utterly different machines...
A 996 C4 will be a fantastic entry into 911 ownership, slim hipped, lithe and a great all round sports car. The Elise or VX220 are very track focused and not really daily drivers, I'd go for the 996 and just enjoy it, if you don't get on with it sell it, and choose again!
A 996 C4 will be a fantastic entry into 911 ownership, slim hipped, lithe and a great all round sports car. The Elise or VX220 are very track focused and not really daily drivers, I'd go for the 996 and just enjoy it, if you don't get on with it sell it, and choose again!
Paddy_N_Murphy said:
A VX220 is a great car
When parked in the garage and available as an alternate to a Golf GTI as the DD.
When parked in the garage and available as an alternate to a Golf GTI as the DD.
I'll give you that oneIn all seriousness though the OP already has a snotter (the MINI) and wants something fun as well as this hence him looking at 996s.
The Golf is as dull as ditch water but my point is that so is a 996 so why have two fairly dull and un-involving cars, one of which having horrific reliability issues and equally eyewatering bills to remedy?
996s are massively overrated, except in turbo guise. There, I said it.
Thanks for the replies folks.
Try before you buy is obviously a great suggestion, but there are none for sale locally at the moment, unfortunately.
If any PH members in or around Aberdeen fancied showing me their 996 that would be great!..
What would I be using it for?
Well I've now got this Mini Cooper for commuting and shopping runs etc., and I also have a 'fast road' MG Midget which is needing some work but will hopefully be back on the road this year. So basically the 996 would be used for longer B-road runs and maybe the short Friday commute and occasional longer trips through the Cairngorms etc.
I've always wanted a S1 Elise but find it hard to justify when I have the MG Midget to fill the 2 seater, no frills thing. And I could never sell the MG, it was my first car and would be like selling a limb!
I don't have kids but do have a ten year old niece and it would be great for her to be able to get in the back of whatever car I choose, but not essential now I have the Mini.
Also, now been offered the B7 RS4 I viewed on Monday for £13,800 and this has tempted me again.
Still confused!
The 996 that I'm most interested in is near Manchester, so a bit of a trek for me to view and kick the tyres (I'm no mechanic) - can anyone recommend a specialist near Manchester / Cheshire that would be open to inspecting the car before I view it?
Much appreciated.
Try before you buy is obviously a great suggestion, but there are none for sale locally at the moment, unfortunately.
If any PH members in or around Aberdeen fancied showing me their 996 that would be great!..
What would I be using it for?
Well I've now got this Mini Cooper for commuting and shopping runs etc., and I also have a 'fast road' MG Midget which is needing some work but will hopefully be back on the road this year. So basically the 996 would be used for longer B-road runs and maybe the short Friday commute and occasional longer trips through the Cairngorms etc.
I've always wanted a S1 Elise but find it hard to justify when I have the MG Midget to fill the 2 seater, no frills thing. And I could never sell the MG, it was my first car and would be like selling a limb!
I don't have kids but do have a ten year old niece and it would be great for her to be able to get in the back of whatever car I choose, but not essential now I have the Mini.
Also, now been offered the B7 RS4 I viewed on Monday for £13,800 and this has tempted me again.
Still confused!
The 996 that I'm most interested in is near Manchester, so a bit of a trek for me to view and kick the tyres (I'm no mechanic) - can anyone recommend a specialist near Manchester / Cheshire that would be open to inspecting the car before I view it?
Much appreciated.
A 996 is not dull as ditchwater, wind your neck in.
Perhaps "I think there is better driving feel to be had for the price". Or are you telling me one of the best selling 911 models of all time left the purchasers all dead inside and no one bothered to say anything like the emperors new clothes?
Come on. Same with the Golf GTi. The Mk3 and Mk4 have big faults and are slow but to label all GTi as dull as ditchwater just shows a very odd and narrow view of the world.
Also saying all 996 are going to go bang tomorrow ( look at the numbers they made!! someone will have issues with older models ) is just Clarksonista rubbish.
I managed to own a TVR Tuscan with [SHOCK AND AWE MOMENT] the original engine where I didn't die and the engine didn't do a chocolate fire guard impression on me. I took it to THREE specialists who all declined to replace it as it "was fine as it was" maybe it will need it in another 15 to 20k , which is my world was up to 5 years away.
This is not meant as an attack on the person above just a plea to stop with the hero negativity and rumor spreading which is rife on PH.
Perhaps "I think there is better driving feel to be had for the price". Or are you telling me one of the best selling 911 models of all time left the purchasers all dead inside and no one bothered to say anything like the emperors new clothes?
Come on. Same with the Golf GTi. The Mk3 and Mk4 have big faults and are slow but to label all GTi as dull as ditchwater just shows a very odd and narrow view of the world.
Also saying all 996 are going to go bang tomorrow ( look at the numbers they made!! someone will have issues with older models ) is just Clarksonista rubbish.
I managed to own a TVR Tuscan with [SHOCK AND AWE MOMENT] the original engine where I didn't die and the engine didn't do a chocolate fire guard impression on me. I took it to THREE specialists who all declined to replace it as it "was fine as it was" maybe it will need it in another 15 to 20k , which is my world was up to 5 years away.
This is not meant as an attack on the person above just a plea to stop with the hero negativity and rumor spreading which is rife on PH.
BluePurpleRed said:
A 996 is not dull as ditchwater, wind your neck in.
Perhaps "I think there is better driving feel to be had for the price". Or are you telling me one of the best selling 911 models of all time left the purchasers all dead inside and no one bothered to say anything like the emperors new clothes?
Come on. Same with the Golf GTi. The Mk3 and Mk4 have big faults and are slow but to label all GTi as dull as ditchwater just shows a very odd and narrow view of the world.
Also saying all 996 are going to go bang tomorrow ( look at the numbers they made!! someone will have issues with older models ) is just Clarksonista rubbish.
I managed to own a TVR Tuscan with [SHOCK AND AWE MOMENT] the original engine where I didn't die and the engine didn't do a chocolate fire guard impression on me. I took it to THREE specialists who all declined to replace it as it "was fine as it was" maybe it will need it in another 15 to 20k , which is my world was up to 5 years away.
This is not meant as an attack on the person above just a plea to stop with the hero negativity and rumor spreading which is rife on PH.
Well said that man! Perhaps "I think there is better driving feel to be had for the price". Or are you telling me one of the best selling 911 models of all time left the purchasers all dead inside and no one bothered to say anything like the emperors new clothes?
Come on. Same with the Golf GTi. The Mk3 and Mk4 have big faults and are slow but to label all GTi as dull as ditchwater just shows a very odd and narrow view of the world.
Also saying all 996 are going to go bang tomorrow ( look at the numbers they made!! someone will have issues with older models ) is just Clarksonista rubbish.
I managed to own a TVR Tuscan with [SHOCK AND AWE MOMENT] the original engine where I didn't die and the engine didn't do a chocolate fire guard impression on me. I took it to THREE specialists who all declined to replace it as it "was fine as it was" maybe it will need it in another 15 to 20k , which is my world was up to 5 years away.
This is not meant as an attack on the person above just a plea to stop with the hero negativity and rumor spreading which is rife on PH.
p4cks said:
Get the Elise (or a VX220) - you'll enjoy it a damn sight more than an aging 996 prone to horrific garage bills due to the engine which is made from chocolate.
They're also incredibly dull to drive.
I'm sure there'll be others here that have an alternative view based on their ownership. I can only speak of mine, and that of my two friends who also had a 996 (one still has his C4S as he's ploughed £17K into it in the last two years)
My 'chocolate' engine 3.4 C2 has done 135k and just had a clean bill of health on a big service. It was bore scoped last year and was fine. It's on H&R adjustable suspension and is a hoot to drive. I can also fit my wife and 2 kids in it which means I can use it more than a 2 seater.They're also incredibly dull to drive.
I'm sure there'll be others here that have an alternative view based on their ownership. I can only speak of mine, and that of my two friends who also had a 996 (one still has his C4S as he's ploughed £17K into it in the last two years)
There's a thread in readers rides by PopPopBangBang and his 996 has done a massive mileage. There's also a Porsche and Lotus specialist up the road from me, he has more Elise's in bit in his workshop than 996's. Considering they built far more 996's, that tells me something
p4cks said:
The Golf is as dull as ditch water but my point is that so is a 996 so why have two fairly dull and un-involving cars, one of which having horrific reliability issues and equally eyewatering bills to remedy?
996s are massively overrated, except in turbo guise. There, I said it.
The 996 is perhaps the most involving platform to have come out of Stuttgart to date, from the lowly C2 up to the 996GT3RS (For me the Turbo is probably the least desirable in the range in driving terms). Some don't like the looks but to say it is dull tells me you have little idea about what makes for an interesting drivers car. 996s are massively overrated, except in turbo guise. There, I said it.
OP the E46 M3 might also be worth considering.
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