Question for junior doctors
Discussion
I was told, and I find it hard to believe so probably not true, that a reason for the contract change being pushed through was that if one doc did x amount hours overtime they, and all others on their rota, got the whole month at double pay?
I appreciate this sounds far fetched, but the person who told me is in a job that should know this kind of thing.
I appreciate this sounds far fetched, but the person who told me is in a job that should know this kind of thing.
OP that makes no sense, they should be over the moon with that!
The new contract means they no longer get paid overtime on a Saturday and up to 10pm? I think on a weekday.
They get an increase in base pay to compensate.
Argument is it's unsafe, reality is they will be paid slightly less (all things considered) which is really what they are upset about and technically could be asked to work slightly longer hours (unlikely).
The real issue is getting consultants to work weekends, as if you get sick on a Week day you will be seen by an 'expert'. Get sick in the night and on a weekend you will not.
Changing the latter is the real challenge and unlikely.
The new contract means they no longer get paid overtime on a Saturday and up to 10pm? I think on a weekday.
They get an increase in base pay to compensate.
Argument is it's unsafe, reality is they will be paid slightly less (all things considered) which is really what they are upset about and technically could be asked to work slightly longer hours (unlikely).
The real issue is getting consultants to work weekends, as if you get sick on a Week day you will be seen by an 'expert'. Get sick in the night and on a weekend you will not.
Changing the latter is the real challenge and unlikely.
Bertrum said:
OP that makes no sense, they should be over the moon with that!
The new contract means they no longer get paid overtime on a Saturday and up to 10pm? I think on a weekday.
They get an increase in base pay to compensate.
Argument is it's unsafe, reality is they will be paid slightly less (all things considered) which is really what they are upset about and technically could be asked to work slightly longer hours (unlikely).
The real issue is getting consultants to work weekends, as if you get sick on a Week day you will be seen by an 'expert'. Get sick in the night and on a weekend you will not.
Changing the latter is the real challenge and unlikely.
The argument was that what I stated above is what they get now.The new contract means they no longer get paid overtime on a Saturday and up to 10pm? I think on a weekday.
They get an increase in base pay to compensate.
Argument is it's unsafe, reality is they will be paid slightly less (all things considered) which is really what they are upset about and technically could be asked to work slightly longer hours (unlikely).
The real issue is getting consultants to work weekends, as if you get sick on a Week day you will be seen by an 'expert'. Get sick in the night and on a weekend you will not.
Changing the latter is the real challenge and unlikely.
As for consultants, I'd bet a lot of money on their contracts being changed in the same way soon, and being fiercely opposed again.
Bertrum said:
if you get sick on a Week day you will be seen by an 'expert'. Get sick in the night and on a weekend you will not.
Not really.Whenever they come in, pretty much all acute admissions will be clerked first by a 'junior', then seen by a consultant on their ward round. Consultants do ward rounds at the weekend and are on call overnight, so patients admitted at the weekend would normally be seen by a consultant within 16-24 hours of admission at the latest, exactly the same as if they were admitted on a weekday.
There is also always (24/7) a resident speciality registrar, who can be called upon for another opinion.
If a patient is not stable, or the junior is worried there is always an appropriate consultant available to see them, 24/7, every day of the year.
I know many people do not seem to believe the above, but it's what happens.
N Dentressangle said:
Bertrum said:
if you get sick on a Week day you will be seen by an 'expert'. Get sick in the night and on a weekend you will not.
Not really.Whenever they come in, pretty much all acute admissions will be clerked first by a 'junior', then seen by a consultant on their ward round. Consultants do ward rounds at the weekend and are on call overnight, so patients admitted at the weekend would normally be seen by a consultant within 16-24 hours of admission at the latest, exactly the same as if they were admitted on a weekday.
There is also always (24/7) a resident speciality registrar, who can be called upon for another opinion.
If a patient is not stable, or the junior is worried there is always an appropriate consultant available to see them, 24/7, every day of the year.
I know many people do not seem to believe the above, but it's what happens.
The stats given for "more chance of dying at the weekend" have been shown to be at best deeply flawed.
snobetter said:
N Dentressangle said:
Bertrum said:
if you get sick on a Week day you will be seen by an 'expert'. Get sick in the night and on a weekend you will not.
Not really.Whenever they come in, pretty much all acute admissions will be clerked first by a 'junior', then seen by a consultant on their ward round. Consultants do ward rounds at the weekend and are on call overnight, so patients admitted at the weekend would normally be seen by a consultant within 16-24 hours of admission at the latest, exactly the same as if they were admitted on a weekday.
There is also always (24/7) a resident speciality registrar, who can be called upon for another opinion.
If a patient is not stable, or the junior is worried there is always an appropriate consultant available to see them, 24/7, every day of the year.
I know many people do not seem to believe the above, but it's what happens.
The stats given for "more chance of dying at the weekend" have been shown to be at best deeply flawed.
I could have phrased it better, but don't miss quote me.
I believe you are actually most likely to die on a Wednesday as that is when the majority of operations take place. But again, i'd check that.
Edited by Bertrum on Friday 7th October 15:21
Bertrum said:
snobetter said:
N Dentressangle said:
Bertrum said:
if you get sick on a Week day you will be seen by an 'expert'. Get sick in the night and on a weekend you will not.
Not really.Whenever they come in, pretty much all acute admissions will be clerked first by a 'junior', then seen by a consultant on their ward round. Consultants do ward rounds at the weekend and are on call overnight, so patients admitted at the weekend would normally be seen by a consultant within 16-24 hours of admission at the latest, exactly the same as if they were admitted on a weekday.
There is also always (24/7) a resident speciality registrar, who can be called upon for another opinion.
If a patient is not stable, or the junior is worried there is always an appropriate consultant available to see them, 24/7, every day of the year.
I know many people do not seem to believe the above, but it's what happens.
The stats given for "more chance of dying at the weekend" have been shown to be at best deeply flawed.
I could have phrased it better, but don't miss quote me.
I believe you are actually most likely to die on a Wednesday as that is when the majority of operations take place. But again, i'd check that.
Edited by Bertrum on Friday 7th October 15:21
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