Am I being unreasonable?

[Prof Prolapse]

I took a 12 month contract with a company, it's one of those ones where they treat you like staff but you get paid slightly more than the other staff and you're first out the door, worst of both worlds really. I could get more money elsewhere but I'm tired of the same of industry bullst, so I figure I don't mind even though it won't advance my career.

12 months is now up, projects I work on deliver, share prices go up ~40%. My contract is renewed, but only for 6 months, the new contract does not remunerate me for this, inflationary increases are not accounted for, and I don't get any additional increase based on experience as they have historically done. Obviously I have asked them to clarify this before I sign.

I like the company, but on a 6 months contract my rate is effectively half what I could get contracting elsewhere.

Regardless of the job, and even if dread the idea of going back to big companies, on principle you walk don't you?

Thoughts?

[Undirection]

Depends really on whether you need the money or whether the crap in big companies is worth the extra money. You're just hired help really, not staff so you can't expect the same benefits as staff either.

[Prof Prolapse]

Undirection said:

Depends really on whether you need the money or whether the crap in big companies is worth the extra money. You're just hired help really, not staff so you can't expect the same benefits as staff either.

Yeah definitely personal choice. I just wondered if anyone had any thoughts really.

The company runs on fixed term contracts (over 80% I think) and they'll all like this at the moment. So I don't feel hard done by or unfairly treated as a contractor, the industry is volatile as well so being permanent isn't actually a marked advantage a lot of the time.

So no hard feelings, business is business, but I reckon that cuts both ways, and I can't work for less than I'm worth.

[irocfan]

the hard rock of principle... I guess it all depends on how much you value your work/life balance or piece of mind/sanity by leaving a place you like. I do tend to agree with you to a point but you just need to weigh up the intangibles as well as 'the bottom line'

[MitchT]

If you think you can do better elsewhere, go elsewhere, surely? Also, if you're a contractor, tell them what your rate is and let them take it or leave it, again, if you believe you can get that rate easily enough elsewhere. I know large company corporate BS stinks, but at least if you're a contractor you're not immersed in it like the wretches on payroll.

[hornetrider]

As a 'proper' contractor I get renewed on a quarterly basis but have had contracts where its been 6 months, and still get daily contract rates. Personally I think working to a 6 month short term contract, you need to be renumerated on a daily rate basis.

Anything else is taking the piss and you should just walk into a contract with decent rates.

[Gargamel]

Agree its put up or shut up.

If you think you can double your rate, then surely take the door marked exit.

Alternatively, go back and ask for the 5% increase for inflation (what inflation) and experience.

If you are actually wanting a pay increase in line with share price, then be aware stocks go down as well as up ...

[Four Litre]

Your decision as to what you will work for. If your not happy with what they have offered politely decline and move on. Just be 100% sure that you can earn the money you want elsewhere.

I've been contracting for 10 years and you know when you're under or overpaid. As a golden rule, it doesn't matter if the client has made a fortune in the time you've been working there, or made a horrific loss. You get paid what you agreed, nothing more, nothing less.

[All that jazz]

Prof Prolapse said:

I took a 12 month contract with a company, it's one of those ones where they treat you like staff but you get paid slightly more than the other staff and you're first out the door, worst of both worlds really. I could get more money elsewhere but I'm tired of the same of industry bullst, so I figure I don't mind even though it won't advance my career.

12 months is now up, projects I work on deliver, share prices go up ~40%. My contract is renewed, but only for 6 months, the new contract does not remunerate me for this, inflationary increases are not accounted for, and I don't get any additional increase based on experience as they have historically done. Obviously I have asked them to clarify this before I sign.

I like the company, but on a 6 months contract my rate is effectively half what I could get contracting elsewhere.

Regardless of the job, and even if dread the idea of going back to big companies, on principle you walk don't you?

Thoughts?

Surely as a contractor you dictate the rates and terms to them, not the other way round? You may as well be on their payroll if you're going to roll over and tell you how it's gonna be.

As others have said you should be charging per day or per hour, not per 6/12 months then the length of the contract wouldn't matter.

Sounds like you need to grow a pair .

[Prof Prolapse]

All that jazz said:

Surely as a contractor you dictate the rates and terms to them, not the other way round? You may as well be on their payroll if you're going to roll over and tell you how it's gonna be.

As others have said you should be charging per day or per hour, not per 6/12 months then the length of the contract wouldn't matter.

Sounds like you need to grow a pair .

You're obviously an expert, but it's a fairly standard fixed term staff contract, you negotiate in an interview room the same way as any other staff job. Many pharmaceuticals jobs are similar due to the high level of instability in the industry.

The daily rate jobs are still fixed in duration then typically renewed on a monthly basis, not daily. There simply is no scope to negotiate to the level you're suggesting. Most big companies won't negotiate with individual contractor anymore, many even insist on an agency despite it costing far more.

"Grow a pair"? I'm currently re-negotiating salary with the aforementioned company, I've applied for a senior staff job elsewhere, and I've been speaking to former colleagues to see what my options are. What other more macho actions do you suggest I take?

Perhaps I should tear my shirt open, slaver myself in oil, kick down the door in of the directors office, and say "You want this big boy? Well you're going to have to pay for it...".

[randlemarcus]

Prof Prolapse said:

Perhaps I should tear my shirt open, slaver myself in oil, kick down the door in of the directors office, and say "You want this big boy? Well you're going to have to pay for it...".

Definitely do this. If you can crush some cheap glasses frames at the same time, that would be great.

And yes, if you have asked for a rate increase, with objective evidence led arguments, and it has come back "no thanks", then pastures new beckon.

[Prof Prolapse]

randlemarcus said:

And yes, if you have asked for a rate increase, with objective evidence led arguments, and it has come back "no thanks", then pastures new beckon.

My thoughts more succinctly put, thank you.

[CAPP0]

Prof Prolapse said:

I took a 12 month contract with a company, it's one of those ones where they treat you like staff but you get paid slightly more than the other staff and you're first out the door, worst of both worlds really. I could get more money elsewhere but I'm tired of the same of industry bullst, so I figure I don't mind even though it won't advance my career.

12 months is now up, projects I work on deliver, share prices go up ~40%. My contract is renewed, but only for 6 months, the new contract does not remunerate me for this, inflationary increases are not accounted for, and I don't get any additional increase based on experience as they have historically done. Obviously I have asked them to clarify this before I sign.

I like the company, but on a 6 months contract my rate is effectively half what I could get contracting elsewhere.

Regardless of the job, and even if dread the idea of going back to big companies, on principle you walk don't you?

Thoughts?

I'm in a quite similar position. How old are you? I'm mid-50s, I've had the big jobs, I've had the big job titles, but currently I'm working for a company who, even on contract, don't pay "real" contract rates. On the flip, my stress levels are pretty low and I'm well-liked and well-respected. I have more cash in the bank than my mortgage is worth (due to having an offset mortgage, the mortgage is effectively interest-free, or, if you like, I'm getting 3.9% on my savings, so there's no point paying it off if I don't have to), so anything extra I earn would just be for toys.

I do keep thinking, hmm, I could get another £100-£150 a day, maybe more, but then I might be jumping back into a shark tank. And do I want that? No; realistically, I'd happily retire tomorrow, but my finances aren't quite THAT good, not yet. And then I think, couple more years in the shark tank, maybe I WOULD have enough cash to bale out. But, I don't want the cut & thrust of those environments again.

So ultimately you need to judge whether the big company environment is really where you want to go (back) to or not. I know I don't. Not ever. OK, so I can't afford another car of the age/standard I last bought at, but hey, it's still running, it's still comfortable, so what the heck.

[Prof Prolapse]

CAPP0 said:

I'm in a quite similar position. How old are you? I'm mid-50s, I've had the big jobs, I've had the big job titles, but currently I'm working for a company who, even on contract, don't pay "real" contract rates. On the flip, my stress levels are pretty low and I'm well-liked and well-respected. I have more cash in the bank than my mortgage is worth (due to having an offset mortgage, the mortgage is effectively interest-free, or, if you like, I'm getting 3.9% on my savings, so there's no point paying it off if I don't have to), so anything extra I earn would just be for toys.

I do keep thinking, hmm, I could get another £100-£150 a day, maybe more, but then I might be jumping back into a shark tank. And do I want that? No; realistically, I'd happily retire tomorrow, but my finances aren't quite THAT good, not yet. And then I think, couple more years in the shark tank, maybe I WOULD have enough cash to bale out. But, I don't want the cut & thrust of those environments again.

So ultimately you need to judge whether the big company environment is really where you want to go (back) to or not. I know I don't. Not ever. OK, so I can't afford another car of the age/standard I last bought at, but hey, it's still running, it's still comfortable, so what the heck.

I'm thirty, I have a young family, my goal is paying off debts, and then leaving this line of work entirely for something a bit simpler. So a lean towards higher risk/reward makes more sense.

Career wise I've still not ventured outside the more technical jobs, so keeping this job doesn't further either my career or financial goals sadly.

I hated the big companies, but they offer stability, and they're the only ones where you can get the training to change careers. So I think I'd go back to move forward, but not for slightly more money.

I guess it's just how much can you afford for the comfort. Shame though, I liked it here.

[4x4Tyke]

Renewal should be considered an opportunity to renegotiate. There is nothing to stop you demanding an increased rate given your proven track record.