Hillclimbing on a budet?
Discussion
Now before you all go off on one about "this is only £5000" I'm talking budget! I've got no money that isn't spoken for and have to regualy lie to the wife about the costs of my car habit. So, heres the question. The Dutton Pheaton. Right, no sniggering at the back! Could this cheap old kit car be made into something that would stay together long enough to have some fun on the hills? It would seem that this car is my only way into the 7 Style market, I don't want it on the road, only for hillclimbing and sprints. The one I'm loking at has a 2 Litre Pinto and no mot or tax, asking price £1,100ono. Or do you know of any better options?
I had a phaeton .. an S3 , the very worst of the lot (if only I'd known before i bought it!!).
it came with a burton 1600 x flow which was blinking awful, so I fitted a 2 litre pinto / ported head / kent cam / twin webers etc etc and promptly broke the 2000E gearbox. DOH! so then I fitted a 3 litre V6 and box .. just because.
My advice is get a B plus, they look best. The S4 is probably the best day to day version but heavy. an early phaeton with triumph front and escort rear suspension is a worthy contender and can be had for peanuts.
PS have you checked the two rover V8 (one turboed) on the owners club site? .. look great .. yippee.
it came with a burton 1600 x flow which was blinking awful, so I fitted a 2 litre pinto / ported head / kent cam / twin webers etc etc and promptly broke the 2000E gearbox. DOH! so then I fitted a 3 litre V6 and box .. just because.
My advice is get a B plus, they look best. The S4 is probably the best day to day version but heavy. an early phaeton with triumph front and escort rear suspension is a worthy contender and can be had for peanuts.
PS have you checked the two rover V8 (one turboed) on the owners club site? .. look great .. yippee.
Aaagh! 
Your words of wisdom have arrived a little too late! I now have a black S3 Pheaton sat on the drive! Got it for consierably less than the asking price though, and it actually has 11 months MOT. I am very interested to hear you say that the S3 is the worst of the lot, could you please expand on those coments so I have an Idea of what may be in store, Cheers Simon.
>> Edited by simonelite501 on Sunday 18th August 21:53
Your words of wisdom have arrived a little too late! I now have a black S3 Pheaton sat on the drive! Got it for consierably less than the asking price though, and it actually has 11 months MOT. I am very interested to hear you say that the S3 is the worst of the lot, could you please expand on those coments so I have an Idea of what may be in store, Cheers Simon. >> Edited by simonelite501 on Sunday 18th August 21:53
hi simon, well the s3 and later s4 are bigger than the earlier versions, the chassis are not quite as torsionally rigid and they swapped from triumph front suspension to some bespoke (and awful) wishbones using hillman imp coil overs (on my car at least). the rear end is leaf spring rather than four link and coil overs but you can change that (in fact i would advise it, the escort inclined dampers are mounted at the top on the cross tube under the rear parcel shelf .. it always breaks, I doubled the depth on mine but proper vertical dampers would be better). also the side panels are separate steel items and weigh a ton (!) .. replace in fibreglass if you can. the later s4 had the panels as part of the fibreglass body so were better in that respect. but really the worst thing is that because they are that bit bigger than the early cars they don't have quite the same fragile look which is what i like about the caterham v westfield debate .. the smaller caterham is so much daintier, the s3 phaeton is the westfield compared to say a b plus or s1 phaeton as the caterham, if that makes sense.
but hey, you got it now - tune the balls off it and have some fun .. regulars at harewood will know that a little peugeot 1400cc engined phaeton mixes it with the westfields on the hill and probably beats many of them too .. have some fun safe in the knowledge you spent no money and are having just as big a laugh, if not bigger!!! take care, best wishes..
ps mine was vin P3817 .. not the same car is it .. it was black originally before I got the Dulux out ...
Joolz
but hey, you got it now - tune the balls off it and have some fun .. regulars at harewood will know that a little peugeot 1400cc engined phaeton mixes it with the westfields on the hill and probably beats many of them too .. have some fun safe in the knowledge you spent no money and are having just as big a laugh, if not bigger!!! take care, best wishes..
ps mine was vin P3817 .. not the same car is it .. it was black originally before I got the Dulux out ...
Joolz
Thanks for the input Joolz, I only wish it were the same car, sounds like you had already ironed out some problems. I understand when you say that the S3 looks heavier the the earlier models, but it was dirt cheap and I'm hoping that it will prove to be a whole heap of fun, and not just a whole heap 
As I said before, the motor is a 2 litre pinto and is standard as far as I know. I can't see there being anything hot inside as it's still breaathing through a down draught weber as it would have in the Capri that it came out of. How much modification do you think would be required avoid embaressing myself at a hill climb?, I don't want the thing to fly, just to have a laugh.
As I said before, the motor is a 2 litre pinto and is standard as far as I know. I can't see there being anything hot inside as it's still breaathing through a down draught weber as it would have in the Capri that it came out of. How much modification do you think would be required avoid embaressing myself at a hill climb?, I don't want the thing to fly, just to have a laugh.Simon: should you require a double driver to halve the costs, I would be more than happy to help (as a financial assistant you understand, I would take no pleasure in this whatsoever!
)
Duttons were certainly used on the hills and in sprints (more run off space!) to good effect most of them in the up to 1400 class using a xflow and some uusing pinto motors. These people are usually advertising a run of chepaer kit cars such as the Gemini which IMO is actually far nicer looking than people give credit, again it uses any xflow engine or a pinto. www.affordablekitcars.fsnet.co.uk
There is a dealer called Barrie Brace who advertises in the popular kit mags too, usually a good selsection of Duttons and suchlike.
As for mods, i think a RAC approaved roll bar would be all that you need, a timing strut can be made for a fiver and then you would need to fit the standard battery cut off and fire extinguisher, label the ignition and you are away.
Let us know how you get on and if things start to progress and you need some help at the weekends, give me a call!
) Duttons were certainly used on the hills and in sprints (more run off space!) to good effect most of them in the up to 1400 class using a xflow and some uusing pinto motors. These people are usually advertising a run of chepaer kit cars such as the Gemini which IMO is actually far nicer looking than people give credit, again it uses any xflow engine or a pinto. www.affordablekitcars.fsnet.co.uk
There is a dealer called Barrie Brace who advertises in the popular kit mags too, usually a good selsection of Duttons and suchlike.
As for mods, i think a RAC approaved roll bar would be all that you need, a timing strut can be made for a fiver and then you would need to fit the standard battery cut off and fire extinguisher, label the ignition and you are away.
Let us know how you get on and if things start to progress and you need some help at the weekends, give me a call!
ditto the above. you don't need to spend wads to have fun. best bet is to start of making it reliable, so just go round and replace anything that looks a bit "iffy" (techie term!). With a 2 litre pinto in good order you'll have around 100 bhp so that's enough to get going with, plus there's loads of tuning stuff out there for this engine, although I'd probably save a bit and get the engine changed for something a bit lighter rather than tune the existing lump. best of luck.
quote:
Thanks for the offers of help, I'll be taking you both up on them, you've been warned, Paul, check your Email, I've sent a note to what I believe is your address as the one you posted here didn't look quite right, Cheers guys, Speak soon, Simon.
no, honestly, its pmonis@hotmail.com
! I know of parts which "could" be for sale! There is an awful lot of the car there such as engine, gearbox, instruments etc from memory all that is missing is wishbones, trailing arms, bodywork and chassis! have a look at the MK engineering website www.m-keenan.freeserve.co.uk which has price details of such items as does this one.
www.lolocost.co.uk/ASPpages/summarylist.asp
i cant find the Ron Champion site but again it has an online price list. the car was a westfield but as a friend gradually replaced and upgraded parts, the redundant parts were stored. It would be about £1500 to get the car running and through an SVA though obviously it would be a fair amount cheaper if the car was not road legal.
cheers
paul
>> Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 20th August 22:28
You'd better believe it! Project "Heath Robinson" is well on track to be up and running within the next week or two, and then it' just a matter of fact finding, classes, regulations, that sort of thing. I'm planing to be ready to race in the new year. The car will be ready before then of course, and maybe I can become involved with the BMC road events in the mean time. The project is still running to budget, i,e £0.00 and I just gets more and more fun building and repairing rather than paying huge amounts for replacements, it's not like maintanance on the Lotus at all! I really should have done this years ago! Are you planing on going to this "Black Tie & Pie"? I've just sorted it out (Hopefully), let me know, and pop round when you get a chance.
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