Help me to choose the right 7 please!
Discussion
Dear experienced PHers, I have just put down a deposit on my first 7, and have a few questions, and I guess just making sure I have made the right decision!(I know its a major personal thing, but just want to make sure no serious errors!). I have gone for this at Sevens and classics, http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/c... with help from Callum. I took out the smaller SV's there, and they just didn't have quite enough in it (power) for me, the difference with the 160hp seemed quite vast. Bodywork is excellent, apart form the bonnet fit that Callum has agreed to sort when I confirm. He is also putting on the decals I want, and sorting a battery conditioner as part of it. I love the sound, and certainly the short drive was great.
Now the fly in the ointment was that I went to see a Private 03 plate SV with the 1.8 k series VVC on the way home from Sevens and classics. Bodywork not so clean, few tiny dents and touch ups, plus a couple of areas on side skirts that had pitting at the bottom about the size of 5p piece (3 in total), these were only apparent in close inspection, first look very tidy. 16.8k miles, VVC mapping by DVA. MOT due in August. The seller has put deposit down on larger CSR so looking to get what he can. He would take £20k, was offered £18 on the part ex. IS THIS SOMETHING I SHOULD CONSIDER over the one above? I didn't drive it as was late in the day, but the owner certainly woke me up!, although he didn't go above 5k rpm? What are the thoughts? I am happy with the red sevens and classics, just want to make sure I am not missing out or making a mistake as I have little experience! I suspect that buying through these guys also has benefits as mentioned on this forum before.
This has been available for some time, http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/c... and as you can see is much younger, but I have not been able to get to the midlands to see it in the flesh. The thought of the lower age is playing on my mind, but is of course £2.5k more expensive. Is the 150hp 1.6 better than the K series 1.8 160hp? Should I be considering the younger car.
I do hope that you can all give some advice, and apologies for the "war and peace", the worst thing that could happen for me is turning up at my first blat and hearing.....sharp intake of breath "oh I would not have gone for that one......."
Thanks guys and gals!
Now the fly in the ointment was that I went to see a Private 03 plate SV with the 1.8 k series VVC on the way home from Sevens and classics. Bodywork not so clean, few tiny dents and touch ups, plus a couple of areas on side skirts that had pitting at the bottom about the size of 5p piece (3 in total), these were only apparent in close inspection, first look very tidy. 16.8k miles, VVC mapping by DVA. MOT due in August. The seller has put deposit down on larger CSR so looking to get what he can. He would take £20k, was offered £18 on the part ex. IS THIS SOMETHING I SHOULD CONSIDER over the one above? I didn't drive it as was late in the day, but the owner certainly woke me up!, although he didn't go above 5k rpm? What are the thoughts? I am happy with the red sevens and classics, just want to make sure I am not missing out or making a mistake as I have little experience! I suspect that buying through these guys also has benefits as mentioned on this forum before.
This has been available for some time, http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/c... and as you can see is much younger, but I have not been able to get to the midlands to see it in the flesh. The thought of the lower age is playing on my mind, but is of course £2.5k more expensive. Is the 150hp 1.6 better than the K series 1.8 160hp? Should I be considering the younger car.
I do hope that you can all give some advice, and apologies for the "war and peace", the worst thing that could happen for me is turning up at my first blat and hearing.....sharp intake of breath "oh I would not have gone for that one......."
Thanks guys and gals!
That red SV at S&C looks great.
I bought a seven from them and they did a respray and and a couple of extra bits (half hood ordering, seat and steering wheel exchange).. Great service. Also you get 3 month warranty.
The chance to have the car stickered to how YOU like it is important, not what others think. There are some odd sorts out there who will always say you 'don't want to do that' ... Ignore. I knew what I wanted look wise and I can't be happier.
The private sale one is more difficult, he's shown his hand saying its worth 18k part ex. So 2k difference appears steep (now you know the part ex, the price you need to pay should just be more than the part ex to sway him to go to you, 2k seems steep with this knowledge.)
The third one... I'd travel countrywide if I wanted to spend that much, but if S&C is local ish that's a bonus, particularly if any warranty work is needed, or just building up a good relationship with what is a great place.
I bought a seven from them and they did a respray and and a couple of extra bits (half hood ordering, seat and steering wheel exchange).. Great service. Also you get 3 month warranty.
The chance to have the car stickered to how YOU like it is important, not what others think. There are some odd sorts out there who will always say you 'don't want to do that' ... Ignore. I knew what I wanted look wise and I can't be happier.
The private sale one is more difficult, he's shown his hand saying its worth 18k part ex. So 2k difference appears steep (now you know the part ex, the price you need to pay should just be more than the part ex to sway him to go to you, 2k seems steep with this knowledge.)
The third one... I'd travel countrywide if I wanted to spend that much, but if S&C is local ish that's a bonus, particularly if any warranty work is needed, or just building up a good relationship with what is a great place.
Edited by Stridey on Sunday 7th June 12:04
DouglasBen said:
plus a couple of areas on side skirts that had pitting at the bottom about the size of 5p piece (3 in total), these were only apparent in close inspection,
If by side skirts, you mean where the side panels meet the chassis, this could well be corrosion coming through from the inside.It is common to see this as moisture gets in there and can't get out. The only way to fix this is a reskin involving stripping back to a bare chassis, so I certainly wouldn't want to pay 20K for it and as it is a private sale you won't have any warranty.
I had a similar debate with myself when I bought my Seven, I couldn't find what I wanted privately and spending that much money decided I'd like at lest a small security blanket.... So I looked at what was available in the Dealer network. I looked at two from Millwood then S&C.
Again, I drove both the Rover and Ford Engined cars and to be honest for ME the Rover VVC felt faster, but oddly the 'noise' I didn't like.
In the end I bought a 150 Sigma Engined Car from S&C, it pops and bangs to make all the noises I wanted. Yes, it's probably not 150bhp and the throttle bodies make it lightly quirky, but when it's being driven it's everything I wanted.
but...
My choice is my choice, someone else will always have a different view, that all part of the fun, buy what you like and want, it's as simple as that.
If you're looking at the Red and White SV then it was actually a local car to me and I looked at it before S&C purchased it. They actually collected it the day they delivered mine. I can tell you more if you wish to PM me
Not sure this helps....
Again, I drove both the Rover and Ford Engined cars and to be honest for ME the Rover VVC felt faster, but oddly the 'noise' I didn't like.
In the end I bought a 150 Sigma Engined Car from S&C, it pops and bangs to make all the noises I wanted. Yes, it's probably not 150bhp and the throttle bodies make it lightly quirky, but when it's being driven it's everything I wanted.
but...
My choice is my choice, someone else will always have a different view, that all part of the fun, buy what you like and want, it's as simple as that.
If you're looking at the Red and White SV then it was actually a local car to me and I looked at it before S&C purchased it. They actually collected it the day they delivered mine. I can tell you more if you wish to PM me
Not sure this helps....
I had a similar debate with myself when I bought my Seven, I couldn't find what I wanted privately and spending that much money decided I'd like at lest a small security blanket.... So I looked at what was available in the Dealer network. I looked at two from Millwood then S&C.
Again, I drove both the Rover and Ford Engined cars and to be honest for ME the Rover VVC felt faster, but oddly the 'noise' I didn't like.
In the end I bought a 150 Sigma Engined Car from S&C, it pops and bangs to make all the noises I wanted. Yes, it's probably not 150bhp and the throttle bodies make it lightly quirky, but when it's being driven it's everything I wanted.
but...
My choice is my choice, someone else will always have a different view, that all part of the fun, buy what you like and want, it's as simple as that.
If you're looking at the Red and White SV then it was actually a local car to me and I looked at it before S&C purchased it. They actually collected it the day they delivered mine. I can tell you more if you wish to PM me
Not sure this helps....
Again, I drove both the Rover and Ford Engined cars and to be honest for ME the Rover VVC felt faster, but oddly the 'noise' I didn't like.
In the end I bought a 150 Sigma Engined Car from S&C, it pops and bangs to make all the noises I wanted. Yes, it's probably not 150bhp and the throttle bodies make it lightly quirky, but when it's being driven it's everything I wanted.
but...
My choice is my choice, someone else will always have a different view, that all part of the fun, buy what you like and want, it's as simple as that.
If you're looking at the Red and White SV then it was actually a local car to me and I looked at it before S&C purchased it. They actually collected it the day they delivered mine. I can tell you more if you wish to PM me
Not sure this helps....
I haven't looked at the 7s you are considering but on face value.
S & C have an excellent reputation based on thorough experience, with all the customers I have read about on P/H and they know what they are talking about
They will offer you greater peace mind with a 3 month warranty and will no doubt look after you beyond that as one of their customers if you use them for servicing needs
Their cars will be fully checked and prepped prior to sale, and any niggles will be quickly sorted
Any private purchase may appear very nice but you won't get this peace of mind and any apparent saving could easily be lost if you don't buy the right private purchase, and I'm definitely not saying that all private sales should be avoided but you really need to know what you are looking for if buying a 7 privately.
Main advise is not to rush in to anything and make sure you try plenty until you are happy.
If you are relatively new to the world of 7s and are unsure of your choice then why not just have another chat with S & C and explain your dilemma and try a few more first before you finally decide on the one. I agree with Chris, make sure you try the S3 as well as the SV and try an S3 R300 : ) if you can afford it, good luck.
S & C have an excellent reputation based on thorough experience, with all the customers I have read about on P/H and they know what they are talking about
They will offer you greater peace mind with a 3 month warranty and will no doubt look after you beyond that as one of their customers if you use them for servicing needs
Their cars will be fully checked and prepped prior to sale, and any niggles will be quickly sorted
Any private purchase may appear very nice but you won't get this peace of mind and any apparent saving could easily be lost if you don't buy the right private purchase, and I'm definitely not saying that all private sales should be avoided but you really need to know what you are looking for if buying a 7 privately.
Main advise is not to rush in to anything and make sure you try plenty until you are happy.
If you are relatively new to the world of 7s and are unsure of your choice then why not just have another chat with S & C and explain your dilemma and try a few more first before you finally decide on the one. I agree with Chris, make sure you try the S3 as well as the SV and try an S3 R300 : ) if you can afford it, good luck.
Edited by SLR400 on Sunday 7th June 18:23
Edited by SLR400 on Sunday 7th June 18:24
Thanks guys appreciate the feedback, looks like s&c the way to go. I've taken out s3 chassis, and my fat feet struggle, as well as broad shoulders, definitely sticking to the SV and have gone back and forth to make sure on that one. With the 160 upgrade on the K series, does that not make it r 300'engine anyhow? One thing I forgot to mention, touring is the main aim, with say 4 track days a year. Not going to race or anything like that, and just want to have that smile that you all mention! The 140 sigma hire car kept me plenty entertained for the day, so I am hoping this slight increase in power will keep me interested for some time! Certainly the 135 s&c also have seemed a little bit sluggish, but only in comparison to the newish 140 hire car. Thanks again guys, any further comments will still be welcome!
Although this is an S3 I'm selling my Roadsport 150 2009 just to give you one more option.
I appreciate you've mentioned it has to be an SV due to the size of your feet. I have size 11 feet and prefer to drive bare foot and I don't struggle for room down there. I'm 6ft as well. I've added a link for you just in case.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/c...
Let me know if you need any other information otherwise I wish you well and hope you get your ideal seven.
I appreciate you've mentioned it has to be an SV due to the size of your feet. I have size 11 feet and prefer to drive bare foot and I don't struggle for room down there. I'm 6ft as well. I've added a link for you just in case.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/c...
Let me know if you need any other information otherwise I wish you well and hope you get your ideal seven.
You'll likely find that the sigma 150 cars are in fact more like 138-140hp. Caterham stopped doing them after a while as some had drive ability issues. They changed to selling super sports instead that had 140hp with a different engine setup that involved updated cams rather than the throttle bodies of the 150 cars. They don't sound as good but do apparently drive better. The vvc car is probably more likely to make the power stated.
The other thing to ask yourself is will you be tempted to upgrade the performance at some stage? If so the k series probably has more options and at a lower cost when compared to the sigma cars.
Might not be important to you but thought I'd mention it
The other thing to ask yourself is will you be tempted to upgrade the performance at some stage? If so the k series probably has more options and at a lower cost when compared to the sigma cars.
Might not be important to you but thought I'd mention it
tomwoodis said:
You'll likely find that the sigma 150 cars are in fact more like 138-140hp. Caterham stopped doing them after a while as some had drive ability issues. They changed to selling super sports instead that had 140hp with a different engine setup that involved updated cams rather than the throttle bodies of the 150 cars. They don't sound as good but do apparently drive better. The vvc car is probably more likely to make the power stated.
The other thing to ask yourself is will you be tempted to upgrade the performance at some stage? If so the k series probably has more options and at a lower cost when compared to the sigma cars.
Might not be important to you but thought I'd mention it
Few people told me not to listen to Caterham's claimed BHP and BHP per tone figures The other thing to ask yourself is will you be tempted to upgrade the performance at some stage? If so the k series probably has more options and at a lower cost when compared to the sigma cars.
Might not be important to you but thought I'd mention it
K series vs Ford i guess is just a personal preference, i prefer a 1600 or 1800 k over a 1600 Ford, but if i was moving to a newer model to mine i would go for a 2L ford. It really does come down to if you can drive a few options and see what your prefer. Going to a company like S&C least gives you the chance that they may have a few different engine/gear box combos to try so you can decide what works best for you. Fact you want a SV may just mean will take a little longer to find the right car or may need to make a compromise. The biggest issue is everyone wants something different from there 7 and there is never the 'right' car out there, you find a spec but wrong colour etc. With your budget there is quite a few cars out there that i like the look of but im looking at none sv light cars. My suggestion to people looking at Caterham's is make a list of what spec they want and have most important bits at the top working own to less important bits and find a car that matches it best.
Quite like the look of this if i was looking for a SV, but does seem Caterham Midlands has a few if wanted to make the trip.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/c...
Edited by texr2000 on Sunday 7th June 22:30
Edited by texr2000 on Sunday 7th June 22:39
Looks a well documented car - http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/c...
Thanks so much guys, really appreciate all of your thoughts, and please do keep them coming!
With regards to the list, I have to be honest and SV is top of the list! I just don't feel comfortable in the S3, and also too close to passenger for me. The pedals are too close together, and just being able to jump in and drive is paramount. Also want to be able to take "older and larger" passengers so all adds up.
So the list would be along the lines of:
SV Chassis
Leather Seats (not tillets or race)
140hp or higher
"out of the box" performance as limited Servicing/mechanical experience right now (although eager to learn once owned)
head turning looks
head turning noise
clean bodywork
gear box (happy with both 5 and 6 speed, but also want ease of touring)
sensible value for money!
Weather pack
Anything else I should consider?
With regards to the list, I have to be honest and SV is top of the list! I just don't feel comfortable in the S3, and also too close to passenger for me. The pedals are too close together, and just being able to jump in and drive is paramount. Also want to be able to take "older and larger" passengers so all adds up.
So the list would be along the lines of:
SV Chassis
Leather Seats (not tillets or race)
140hp or higher
"out of the box" performance as limited Servicing/mechanical experience right now (although eager to learn once owned)
head turning looks
head turning noise
clean bodywork
gear box (happy with both 5 and 6 speed, but also want ease of touring)
sensible value for money!
Weather pack
Anything else I should consider?
Sorry Sbend - lost your point there? The 270 comes in at over £30k when you want to drive it away...well past my budget, and I don't fancy the 160 at all.
really just ensuring that this is the one for me......
http://www.sevensandclassics.com/showroom/caterham...
Perhaps I missed the gist?
really just ensuring that this is the one for me......
http://www.sevensandclassics.com/showroom/caterham...
Perhaps I missed the gist?
What I was trying to say - obviously very badly! - was that it's very easy to get carried away when looking at Caterhams. The "just a little bit more" syndrome can add up to an awful lot of money, and what the article is pointing out is that huge power isn't necessary. I spent a couple of years finding out about Caterhams and eventually decided on a basic cross-flow. For one thing, I wasn't going to do track days - I live in a rural area with lots of twisty roads and not much traffic - and for another, when I looked past the 0-60 figures at the mid range acceleration I reckoned the cross-flow was fast enough and the extra money wasn't worth the extra performance. As I said earlier on, it's about what you personally like, buy the car you fall in love with, the detail isn't important, it'll be a great driving experience regardless of the model.
DouglasBen said:
SV Chassis
Leather Seats (not tillets or race)
140hp or higher
"out of the box" performance as limited Servicing/mechanical experience right now (although eager to learn once owned)
head turning looks
head turning noise
clean bodywork
gear box (happy with both 5 and 6 speed, but also want ease of touring)
sensible value for money!
Weather pack
Leather Seats (not tillets or race)
140hp or higher
"out of the box" performance as limited Servicing/mechanical experience right now (although eager to learn once owned)
head turning looks
head turning noise
clean bodywork
gear box (happy with both 5 and 6 speed, but also want ease of touring)
sensible value for money!
Weather pack
DouglasBen said:
Sorry Sbend - lost your point there? The 270 comes in at over £30k when you want to drive it away...well past my budget, and I don't fancy the 160 at all.
really just ensuring that this is the one for me......
http://www.sevensandclassics.com/showroom/caterham...
Perhaps I missed the gist?
I would say that is pretty close to what you are after, SV body, more road based inside, 140+BHP, has a half hood and probs a toner cover, Red is quite a eye catching colour, Noise cant comment but with Roller Barrels will sing quite well once you open the taps..... really just ensuring that this is the one for me......
http://www.sevensandclassics.com/showroom/caterham...
Perhaps I missed the gist?
Good base car, if you want more performance later on pull the wheel off the back, new exhaust and a few tweeks to the engine and be like a new car, if you want to do some track days pick up a set of 13" wheels with ZZR, A048, CR500 tyres on that always come up forsale
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