Defender TD5 v TDCi
Discussion
I have a 110 300tdi hardtop that is used for all short journeys that I do and also all rugged duties that the various other cars can't do (z4/allroad/etc). The 110 is great, and has had pretty much everything done to it (chassis professionally waxoyled regularly, new gearbox, suspension, diffs, rad, turbo, alisport intercooler) etc and I love it - but I have a hankering after a 110 dual cab/utility/CSW that I can take all the kids in and would maybe be a little more modern. It will also be a 'keeper' as once I get a good one, and then do all the other things that will invariably need doing, I will hang on to it indefinitely. I will probably do 5-6000 miles a year in it.
My question is - is it worth paying a premium for a Puma TDCi, or would it be best to get a TD5? I like the idea of a bit more grunt than the 300tdi I have, and I do quite like the interior and idea of a 6 speed box that the TDCi has - but I've heard horror stories about reliability of the 07 on Pumas, plus a lot of people seem to prefer the character/torque etc of the TD5.
Thoughts?
My question is - is it worth paying a premium for a Puma TDCi, or would it be best to get a TD5? I like the idea of a bit more grunt than the 300tdi I have, and I do quite like the interior and idea of a 6 speed box that the TDCi has - but I've heard horror stories about reliability of the 07 on Pumas, plus a lot of people seem to prefer the character/torque etc of the TD5.
Thoughts?
Been running a tdci puma 90 for over year now and have to say I have been impressed with it, although I am no Defender expert, but I did drive Landies in the Army years ago.
Tried a td5 before but the cabin felt very outdated steamed up a lot and didn't feel any more powerful than puma.
Stating the obvious but you must try them both for yourself. The cabin on the puma is a much better place IMO the heater and ac work well and it's better laid out.
I would have preferred the 4 inward facing rear seats, but then the 2 forward facing seats on the puma are a lot more comfortable and safer, good luck.
Tried a td5 before but the cabin felt very outdated steamed up a lot and didn't feel any more powerful than puma.
Stating the obvious but you must try them both for yourself. The cabin on the puma is a much better place IMO the heater and ac work well and it's better laid out.
I would have preferred the 4 inward facing rear seats, but then the 2 forward facing seats on the puma are a lot more comfortable and safer, good luck.
Don't know why you're asking us, you're the one who has to live with it!!! Go & test drive both & see what you think.
The interiors are completely different as are the gearboxes and power delivery. The interior & gearbox on the TD5 is the same as your TDi but the power delivery and feel of the throttle will be completely different. Where as the TDCi has a completely different interior & gearbox but the power delivery is very similar to that of the TDi.
FWIW - The rear seats on the TDCi are more comfortable.
M
The interiors are completely different as are the gearboxes and power delivery. The interior & gearbox on the TD5 is the same as your TDi but the power delivery and feel of the throttle will be completely different. Where as the TDCi has a completely different interior & gearbox but the power delivery is very similar to that of the TDi.
FWIW - The rear seats on the TDCi are more comfortable.
M
camel_landy said:
The interior & gearbox on the TD5 is the same as your TDi but the power delivery and feel of the throttle will be completely different. Where as the TDCi has a completely different interior & gearbox but the power delivery is very similar to that of the TDi.
M
Could you explain how the power delivery is different? I've had a 300 Defender and have a D2 so would guess it's the lack of torque low down.M
The standard Td5 is pretty poor tbh, although it doesn't run out of puff like a 300, but a remap utterly transforms it.
Bill said:
Could you explain how the power delivery is different? I've had a 300 Defender and have a D2 so would guess it's the lack of torque low down.
The standard Td5 is pretty poor tbh, although it doesn't run out of puff like a 300, but a remap utterly transforms it.
It depends on how sensitive you are to the way a car drives... A 5cyl engine, naturally has different characteristics to a 4cyl. On top of that, the TD5 is an early example of a fly-by-wire, so you'll have the characteristics of the EFI system too.The standard Td5 is pretty poor tbh, although it doesn't run out of puff like a 300, but a remap utterly transforms it.
Personally, I notice a difference and quite like the TD5 but I know others that don't. That's why I said to the OP to ignore the armchair experts,
(FWIW - I find it most noticeable when you're dragging yourself though the clag... The 4 pots need to be revved that little bit more.)
M
Currently I have both, a 2001 TD5 90 (hard top) and a 2014 2.2 Tdci 90 (XS SW) (with only 570km on it so far)
I like them both. The reduced noise levels in the Puma is a revelation over my TD5.
The better dash, seats, and aircon, remote central locking, electric windows etc etc are also fantastic. The upgraded stereo is also great with bluetooth.
On the motorway it is more pleasant and it really goes pretty well bearing in mind it is totally standard, especially when my TD5 is remapped.
I think the latest 2.2's are probably the nicest to drive of all of them.
Not totally keen yet on the very short first gear, and the gap to second, along with the very abrupt clutch action but it will probably grow on me or I will get more used to it. Other than that I cant really fault it much yet.
The TD5 is much neater under the bonnet and looks far simpler. My TD5 has also been very reliable and has been around a lot of remote Australia with no engine issues. The 2.2 has its work cut out for it as it will be expected to do the same!
10 years ago people thought the TD5 would be an electronic nightmare but it isn't and I have every faith in mine, and I hope the 2.2 will be the same.
I like them both. The reduced noise levels in the Puma is a revelation over my TD5.
The better dash, seats, and aircon, remote central locking, electric windows etc etc are also fantastic. The upgraded stereo is also great with bluetooth.
On the motorway it is more pleasant and it really goes pretty well bearing in mind it is totally standard, especially when my TD5 is remapped.
I think the latest 2.2's are probably the nicest to drive of all of them.
Not totally keen yet on the very short first gear, and the gap to second, along with the very abrupt clutch action but it will probably grow on me or I will get more used to it. Other than that I cant really fault it much yet.
The TD5 is much neater under the bonnet and looks far simpler. My TD5 has also been very reliable and has been around a lot of remote Australia with no engine issues. The 2.2 has its work cut out for it as it will be expected to do the same!
10 years ago people thought the TD5 would be an electronic nightmare but it isn't and I have every faith in mine, and I hope the 2.2 will be the same.
wrightyninety said:
Hi all, new to this site.
I am about to buy a defender 90 swb 2012, it has the 2.2 tdci engine, can it be replaced by a td5 or are the differences in setup too great? I like the sound and feel of the td5, i find the 2.2 tdci a little souless.
Anything is possible...I am about to buy a defender 90 swb 2012, it has the 2.2 tdci engine, can it be replaced by a td5 or are the differences in setup too great? I like the sound and feel of the td5, i find the 2.2 tdci a little souless.
Bear in mind it'd be far more than just the engine, at very least you would need to consider a different gearbox, bulkhead, ECU and wiring looms.
M
Having owned a 2011 90 as my sole vehicle for ~5 years, if I could go back, I would have bought the latest Td5 I could find.
I love my defender and would never sell it, but on balance, I think the Td5s are better (with a bit of work).
Remap for more power / smoothness, Ashcroft can increase the final gearing for motorway cruising, dynamat throughout for sound proofing, replace the head unit / upgrade the speakers, and find some decent replacement front seats.
Do the above and it will be on par / if not surpass the majority of the puma upgrades / refinements.
Also, you then don’t have to worry about someone nicking your bonnet!
I love my defender and would never sell it, but on balance, I think the Td5s are better (with a bit of work).
Remap for more power / smoothness, Ashcroft can increase the final gearing for motorway cruising, dynamat throughout for sound proofing, replace the head unit / upgrade the speakers, and find some decent replacement front seats.
Do the above and it will be on par / if not surpass the majority of the puma upgrades / refinements.
Also, you then don’t have to worry about someone nicking your bonnet!
If you go for the Puma engine then check when the diesel injectors were done. I had a very low mileage 2.4 Puma (50k miles) and the injectors went costing me £2k.
Seemingly quite common for them to go on the Puma engine.
This was my 3rd Defender (had 300Tdi, 2.2 Puma, 2.4 Puma) and loved the refinement of the Puma engine and the fact you could have a conversation above 40mph. Maybe something to bear in mind with the kids in the back.
Seemingly quite common for them to go on the Puma engine.
This was my 3rd Defender (had 300Tdi, 2.2 Puma, 2.4 Puma) and loved the refinement of the Puma engine and the fact you could have a conversation above 40mph. Maybe something to bear in mind with the kids in the back.
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