£50K to invest on behalf of 85 year old neighbour!
£50K to invest on behalf of 85 year old neighbour!
Author
Discussion

Jazzer

Original Poster:

1,758 posts

234 months

Thursday 20th February 2014
quotequote all
Hi folks,

I could do with a wee bit of help!

IFAs are a good idea, but as is often said on here, where do you find these guys!

I'm doing my best to help my neighbour, and dear friend, at a very difficult time.

We've managed to sort out a number of big issues.

Looking to invest £50K for capital growth, medium term, medium risk.

ISA allowance used up each year.

Any ideas?

HL offer good managed funds (the multi-manager balanced fund sounds good, more so for the longer term.

Any ideas/suggestions folks?

I'm aware of similar thread titles on here, but quite different circumstances this time!!

Much appreciated.

Jazzer

KTF

10,711 posts

180 months

Thursday 20th February 2014
quotequote all
Get a recommendation for a local IFA and speak to them.

ellroy

7,848 posts

255 months

Thursday 20th February 2014
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Define medium term for someone who's 85?

That's your biggest issue right there.

Ginge R

4,761 posts

249 months

Thursday 20th February 2014
quotequote all
Jazzer,

Only invest if you have goals. Would your mate instead just want access and liquidity, and the ability to spend it all? If so, save money and keep it in a bank savings account, but tiered. Say, 5k instant access, 5k 6 months, 5k 12 months etc? Things are too volatile and uncertain right now for what could be quite short term goals.

b19rak

403 posts

247 months

Thursday 20th February 2014
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I'm A Warwickshire based IFA if your near and can help.

sidicks

25,218 posts

251 months

Thursday 20th February 2014
quotequote all
Jazzer said:
Hi folks,

I could do with a wee bit of help!

IFAs are a good idea, but as is often said on here, where do you find these guys!

I'm doing my best to help my neighbour, and dear friend, at a very difficult time.

We've managed to sort out a number of big issues.

Looking to invest £50K for capital growth, medium term, medium risk.

ISA allowance used up each year.

Any ideas?

HL offer good managed funds (the multi-manager balanced fund sounds good, more so for the longer term.

Any ideas/suggestions folks?

I'm aware of similar thread titles on here, but quite different circumstances this time!!

Much appreciated.

Jazzer
85 years old
Medium term investment horizon
...does not compute....

HarryW

16,051 posts

299 months

Thursday 20th February 2014
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I'd be chuffed if I make 75 let alone 85, coke and hookers it is then....

anonymous-user

84 months

Thursday 20th February 2014
quotequote all
Tell them there's no pockets in a shroud so get it spent

I bet there's big pockets in an IFA's suit smile

Jazzer

Original Poster:

1,758 posts

234 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
Thanks for the suggestions chaps.

She wants the money to grow, rather than just sitting in a savings account.

Capital growth, five years, accessible if necessary.

I appreciate the age issue, but it's up to her.

Would the HL thing be daft?

Jazzer

bogie

17,100 posts

302 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
85 years old ...time to spend it not save it ...get her on a £5k dream holiday each year...

Ginge R

4,761 posts

249 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
Just because the lady is 85, it doesn't mean she hasn't got a grasp of her facilities and there is no law which says she can't invest.. we haven't got to that extent yet. But an adviser will have a huge hurdle to leap to demonstrate that it is going to be in the client's best interests.

Even if the client becomes an insistent one, an adviser will tread carefully and pay particular attention to need for cash in the event of illness and other aspects of her estate.

Notwithstanding that, assuming you're looking at investment options, then HL is an expensive contract. If the client's remit is 'to grow wealth', then the bias changes from sexy websites, headline returns and other assorted functionality to reduction in yield. In itself, that shuffles HL right down the pecking order - and anyway, why do you need a platform anyway, why not consider a direct investment if that *is* the best thing for the client?

If you have a power of attorney, look at various direct to consumer options which will provide her with far lower costs, and therefore, higher returns and growth. Look at cheap and cheerful trackers, in particular Vanguard and those with lower inclination to volatility - if I was 85, I'd be pretty upset if I was tracking the FTSE these days with only a few years investment timeline, if the objective was to grow wealth.

On a personal note, if I thought that a client wasn't completely up to speed on what was happening with the money, then at that age, it would be a matter of chatting with the power of attorney anyway, who would/could veto the idea if one that had control over financial matters had been activated.

I'm not saying we must treat older people like babies, but the framework exists these days, to give them far greater protection from sharks and to approach the process from a different, 'safer' default position.

Petrus1983

11,221 posts

192 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
I'd personally go down the ultra low cost index tracker funds route on a platform like Co Funds - I think L&G offer a good range of FTSE, European and American tracker based funds all run at minimal expense.

Jazzer

Original Poster:

1,758 posts

234 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
Ginge R said:
Just because the lady is 85, it doesn't mean she hasn't got a grasp of her facilities and there is no law which says she can't invest.. we haven't got to that extent yet. But an adviser will have a huge hurdle to leap to demonstrate that it is going to be in the client's best interests.

Even if the client becomes an insistent one, an adviser will tread carefully and pay particular attention to need for cash in the event of illness and other aspects of her estate.

Notwithstanding that, assuming you're looking at investment options, then HL is an expensive contract. If the client's remit is 'to grow wealth', then the bias changes from sexy websites, headline returns and other assorted functionality to reduction in yield. In itself, that shuffles HL right down the pecking order - and anyway, why do you need a platform anyway, why not consider a direct investment if that *is* the best thing for the client?

If you have a power of attorney, look at various direct to consumer options which will provide her with far lower costs, and therefore, higher returns and growth. Look at cheap and cheerful trackers, in particular Vanguard and those with lower inclination to volatility - if I was 85, I'd be pretty upset if I was tracking the FTSE these days with only a few years investment timeline, if the objective was to grow wealth.

On a personal note, if I thought that a client wasn't completely up to speed on what was happening with the money, then at that age, it would be a matter of chatting with the power of attorney anyway, who would/could veto the idea if one that had control over financial matters had been activated.

I'm not saying we must treat older people like babies, but the framework exists these days, to give them far greater protection from sharks and to approach the process from a different, 'safer' default position.
Thanks for taking the time to reply so helpfully and at such length.

She's a very young 85 year old, sharp as a tac.

You've steered me away from HL, made me think differently.

I'll let you know what we do.

Jazzer

Ginge R

4,761 posts

249 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
Jazzer said:
Thanks for taking the time to reply so helpfully and at such length.

She's a very young 85 year old, sharp as a tac.

You've steered me away from HL, made me think differently.

I'll let you know what we do.

Jazzer
No sweat, hope she gets a good result. Take a look at NSI. If she likes the idea of a flutter, if she is really that smart and switched on she could consider a really small amount in a "play fund" which will keep her engaged, interested and enthusiastic without jeapordising the big picture.

Why should old folk be considered by default to be mentally infirm, batty and helpless? They shouldn't. But the world of investing means that even younger minds have trouble sometimes, keeping up. I would tread very carefully not to create uncertainty and worry; at her age, a little dip in fund performance could create worry quite quickly and that is what no one wants. Least of all, I understand completely, you who wants to help.

http://www.nsandi.com/savings

Don't hesitate to ask if you need more info.

jonny70

1,280 posts

188 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
Jazzer said:
Hi folks,



ISA allowance used up each year.

Any ideas?

HL offer good managed funds (the multi-manager balanced fund sounds good, more so for the longer term.

Any ideas/suggestions folks?

I'm aware of similar thread titles on here, but quite different circumstances this time!!

Much appreciated.

Jazzer
is it just the cash isa is used every year or also the stock and shares isa?

Ideally what does she want to do with the money ? preserve it and grow it to pass down the next of kin?



ringram

14,702 posts

278 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
Id be going low risk for sure.
Has she got an emergency fund as well?
If not see line 1...

pacoryan

671 posts

261 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
Ginge R is bang on the money. Unless an investor has a requirement for risk, they should avoid it in the regulator's eyes. It doesn't help when you have a switched-on but elderly client who likes to speculate!

I follow a "vulnerable client" policy of asking for Attorneys or siblings/children/potential beneficiaries to be included in the conversation where possible.


Ginge R

4,761 posts

249 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
I'm seeing an elderly client the week after next; I have asked that her daughter and son in law to be there. It must be terrifying for some, to feel compelled (and many do) to simply carry out what you suggest. They feel they are being burdensome, which is sad.

mrdemon

21,146 posts

295 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
spend it, she clearly has a load of money if she fills up the ISA every year, you are along time dead.

Jazzer

Original Poster:

1,758 posts

234 months

Friday 21st February 2014
quotequote all
[quote=jonny70]

is it just the cash isa is used every year or also the stock and shares isa?

Ideally what does she want to do with the money ? preserve it and grow it to pass down the next of kin?

The stocks and shares ISA is fully funded each year.

She just wants to grow the money, as she resents terrible returns on deposit etc

L&G Index Tracker Funds look quite interesting, as pointed out elsewhere.

For instance, The Global Technology Index Trust offers the potential for significant growth, but is considered to be towards the high risk end of the spectrum.

Likewise for the International and US trusts.

She is happy with the risk profile.

What do you think??

Thanks again for the excellent advice and help.

Jazzer