991 GT3 driven
Discussion
Had a drive in the new 991 GT3 a few days ago. Will post up more detail when I have a minute. I post purely from a driving perspective
Steering is pretty good to be honest. Not as good as pre electric versions but ultimate feedback s
Is not required to drive the car quickly. The engine is very good - I hear the purists groan - . Time will tell If its track work builett proff but it feels strong and responsive. Don't get the noise valve thing personally.
The gearbox is very quick and - from driving the car and experiencing fist hand the relitave speed of the 997 cup over the 996 - accounts for a lot of the cars straight line and lap performance gain over the old car.
The Chasis - the bit that connects the driver to the road surface - feels more mid engined than 911. It requires a more Ferrari type of driving style. Off brakes turn in and a trail to the apex. The rear wheel steer, the active diff and the forward movement of the centre of gravity combine to make a car that needs no coaxing from the driver.
Did I like it? Well it's a car that will VERy capably travell extremely quickly. Now I understand the context of Walter's comments.
If the Stepford wives company made cars, it would have made the 911GT3 before Porsche did.
Steering is pretty good to be honest. Not as good as pre electric versions but ultimate feedback s
Is not required to drive the car quickly. The engine is very good - I hear the purists groan - . Time will tell If its track work builett proff but it feels strong and responsive. Don't get the noise valve thing personally.
The gearbox is very quick and - from driving the car and experiencing fist hand the relitave speed of the 997 cup over the 996 - accounts for a lot of the cars straight line and lap performance gain over the old car.
The Chasis - the bit that connects the driver to the road surface - feels more mid engined than 911. It requires a more Ferrari type of driving style. Off brakes turn in and a trail to the apex. The rear wheel steer, the active diff and the forward movement of the centre of gravity combine to make a car that needs no coaxing from the driver.
Did I like it? Well it's a car that will VERy capably travell extremely quickly. Now I understand the context of Walter's comments.
If the Stepford wives company made cars, it would have made the 911GT3 before Porsche did.
Steve Rance said:
Had a drive in the new 991 GT3 a few days ago. Will post up more detail when I have a minute. I post purely from a driving perspective
Steering is pretty good to be honest. Not as good as pre electric versions but ultimate feedback s
Is not required to drive the car quickly. The engine is very good - I hear the purists groan - . Time will tell If its track work builett proff but it feels strong and responsive. Don't get the noise valve thing personally.
The gearbox is very quick and - from driving the car and experiencing fist hand the relitave speed of the 997 cup over the 996 - accounts for a lot of the cars straight line and lap performance gain over the old car.
The Chasis - the bit that connects the driver to the road surface - feels more mid engined than 911. It requires a more Ferrari type of driving style. Off brakes turn in and a trail to the apex. The rear wheel steer, the active diff and the forward movement of the centre of gravity combine to make a car that needs no coaxing from the driver.
Did I like it? Well it's a car that will VERy capably travell extremely quickly. Now I understand the context of Walter's comments.
If the Stepford wives company made cars, it would have made the 911GT3 before Porsche did.
Would be interested to read the more detailed review, especially coming from a non owner so possibly less prone to positive bias on the car... In particular, how the car compared in terms of general feedback and 'feeling connected' for lack of a better word to the 7.2 gt3/gt3rs. cheers.Steering is pretty good to be honest. Not as good as pre electric versions but ultimate feedback s
Is not required to drive the car quickly. The engine is very good - I hear the purists groan - . Time will tell If its track work builett proff but it feels strong and responsive. Don't get the noise valve thing personally.
The gearbox is very quick and - from driving the car and experiencing fist hand the relitave speed of the 997 cup over the 996 - accounts for a lot of the cars straight line and lap performance gain over the old car.
The Chasis - the bit that connects the driver to the road surface - feels more mid engined than 911. It requires a more Ferrari type of driving style. Off brakes turn in and a trail to the apex. The rear wheel steer, the active diff and the forward movement of the centre of gravity combine to make a car that needs no coaxing from the driver.
Did I like it? Well it's a car that will VERy capably travell extremely quickly. Now I understand the context of Walter's comments.
If the Stepford wives company made cars, it would have made the 911GT3 before Porsche did.
isaldiri said:
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Would be interested to read the more detailed review, especially coming from a non owner so possibly less prone to positive bias on the car... In particular, how the car compared in terms of general feedback and 'feeling connected' for lack of a better word to the 7.2 gt3/gt3rs. cheers.
I think Steve has made his feelings quite clear on modern technology, so an unbiased view is. unlikely, I knew exactly what I was going to read before opening the post.Would be interested to read the more detailed review, especially coming from a non owner so possibly less prone to positive bias on the car... In particular, how the car compared in terms of general feedback and 'feeling connected' for lack of a better word to the 7.2 gt3/gt3rs. cheers.
Steve's not wrong he just looks for something in a car that he will never find in a modern 'supercar' the world has moved on, and whether that is wrong or right its a personal decision but Porsche cant stand still whilst all its peers trounce its lap times it doesnt sell cars!
interestingly I read in Car magazine about the up coming Civic Type R due in 2015 and that will be manual gearbox, and the head of development said that was because it is more fun, and they aim to set the fastest FWD ring time with it, so I guess the two arent mutually exclusive.
Pete Stout of excellence mag shares the same view as Steve incidentally.
He posted on Rennlist having driven the 991 GT3 on the road rather than on track I think. To summise, he thinks it has a better chassis, more sure footed, more mid engine like balance like the aero fiats and faster shifting where it makes up time on the 4.0. But the lack of a third pedal and the manual interaction is a deal killer for him. Guess he is old skool as well.
991 Gt3, great car, just not if you crave the interaction of the 3rd pedal.
I strangely look forward to a direct compare with the Nismo GTR on track.
He posted on Rennlist having driven the 991 GT3 on the road rather than on track I think. To summise, he thinks it has a better chassis, more sure footed, more mid engine like balance like the aero fiats and faster shifting where it makes up time on the 4.0. But the lack of a third pedal and the manual interaction is a deal killer for him. Guess he is old skool as well.
991 Gt3, great car, just not if you crave the interaction of the 3rd pedal.
I strangely look forward to a direct compare with the Nismo GTR on track.
Steve Rance said:
The Chasis - the bit that connects the driver to the road surface - feels more mid engined than 911. It requires a more Ferrari type of driving style. Off brakes turn in and a trail to the apex. The rear wheel steer, the active diff and the forward movement of the centre of gravity combine to make a car that needs no coaxing from the driver.
Welcome back Steve. Was wondering if you'd given up. Thanks for posting on the 991.Your comment above is the key one for me. Sounds like the inherent 911 traits have been dialled out. This is a shame but I guess that's progress.
AndyBrew said:
I think Steve has made his feelings quite clear on modern technology, so an unbiased view is. unlikely, I knew exactly what I was going to read before opening the post.
Steve's not wrong he just looks for something in a car that he will never find in a modern 'supercar' the world has moved on, and whether that is wrong or right its a personal decision but Porsche cant stand still whilst all its peers trounce its lap times it doesnt sell cars!
interestingly I read in Car magazine about the up coming Civic Type R due in 2015 and that will be manual gearbox, and the head of development said that was because it is more fun, and they aim to set the fastest FWD ring time with it, so I guess the two arent mutually exclusive.
Well, there is the subjective view about what he thinks of modern tech in a car which doesn't preclude an objective view on the car's difference to the 7.2 gt3 though, especially given pasm on the 7.2 car Steve's not wrong he just looks for something in a car that he will never find in a modern 'supercar' the world has moved on, and whether that is wrong or right its a personal decision but Porsche cant stand still whilst all its peers trounce its lap times it doesnt sell cars!
interestingly I read in Car magazine about the up coming Civic Type R due in 2015 and that will be manual gearbox, and the head of development said that was because it is more fun, and they aim to set the fastest FWD ring time with it, so I guess the two arent mutually exclusive.
You do quite neatly summarise the issue with a lot of modern performance cars though with the bit about lap times selling cars though...
mrdemon said:
was it involving enough ? , or were you thinking about what you can cook for dinner later.
All these new cars are amazing machines, just less to do, which sort of ruins your hobby.
It's an awesome car though and looks great.
Come on now mr D, Off the internet please as I need some help with the cooking. The sprouts (I know these are your favourite) need putting on to boil, and the potatoes need turning.All these new cars are amazing machines, just less to do, which sort of ruins your hobby.
It's an awesome car though and looks great.
X
mrsdemon said:
mrdemon said:
was it involving enough ? , or were you thinking about what you can cook for dinner later.
All these new cars are amazing machines, just less to do, which sort of ruins your hobby.
It's an awesome car though and looks great.
Come on now mr D, Off the internet please as I need some help with the cooking. The sprouts (I know these are your favourite) need putting on to boil, and the potatoes need turning.All these new cars are amazing machines, just less to do, which sort of ruins your hobby.
It's an awesome car though and looks great.
X
I see our husbands are at it again on the other thread!
mrdemon said:
was it involving enough ? , or were you thinking about what you can cook for dinner later.
All these new cars are amazing machines, just less to do, which sort of ruins your hobby.
It's an awesome car though and looks great.
In terms of feel, for me there is substantially less feel than a 997GT3 which when judged by the same yardstick is very close to the 996. The 991 is all about readily accessible speed. If that is what you are looking for its a brilliant car. It is not a finely honed driving tool. In this respect, it is the active nature of the Chasis and not the gear box that filters the feel away. The feel is very much like a very fast C2S. All these new cars are amazing machines, just less to do, which sort of ruins your hobby.
It's an awesome car though and looks great.
Very accessible, very fast and to me very dull.
Steve Rance said:
In terms of feel, for me there is substantially less feel than a 997GT3 which when judged by the same yardstick is very close to the 996. The 991 is all about readily accessible speed. If that is what you are looking for its a brilliant car. It is not a finely honed driving tool. In this respect, it is the active nature of the Chasis and not the gear box that filters the feel away. The feel is very much like a very fast C2S.
Very accessible, very fast and to me very dull.
Morning Steve, hope you had a good Christmas. Sorry, I did get your last email, but failed to respond. Glad you've decided The Lunatics shouldn't be give free rein. Very accessible, very fast and to me very dull.
Have to agree with your comments about the modern chassis being "too capable", add in the lack of input/skill needed to change gear and the resulting lack of interaction betwixt driver and machine and it all starts to get rather dull (from a driving perspective).
Steve Rance said:
mrdemon said:
was it involving enough ? , or were you thinking about what you can cook for dinner later.
All these new cars are amazing machines, just less to do, which sort of ruins your hobby.
It's an awesome car though and looks great.
In terms of feel, for me there is substantially less feel than a 997GT3 which when judged by the same yardstick is very close to the 996. The 991 is all about readily accessible speed. If that is what you are looking for its a brilliant car. It is not a finely honed driving tool. In this respect, it is the active nature of the Chasis and not the gear box that filters the feel away. The feel is very much like a very fast C2S. All these new cars are amazing machines, just less to do, which sort of ruins your hobby.
It's an awesome car though and looks great.
Very accessible, very fast and to me very dull.
I for one would be putting my money into a 996/997 if I was in the market for a GT3.
Edited by Trev450 on Friday 27th December 12:45
Harris_I said:
Slightly tangentially, what do you think of modern active diffs? I used to drive an Audi RS5 regularly on track and found the ediff infuriating. It really spoiled the car because it seemed to be making its mind up mid-corner.
This is a VERY pertinent question. I think calibration is really quite important so the driver consistently knows where the limit of traction ends and oversteer begins every time, and you're not caught out.
They're getting better but I stated in another thread that I believe they're more a safety device for 2wd cars than a way of adjusting balance mid-corner.
Again, I think the mechanical diffs in old Porsches were fairly consistent but then 911's have a LOT of traction to begin with and I wasn't really sliding the car around!
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