Discussion
Mmm... wonder why they've done it in the shape of a baseball bat? 
www.qxl.com/cgi-bin/qxlhome.cgi/EN/QXLRicardo/PR/Q1013858195/_32719946
www.qxl.com/cgi-bin/qxlhome.cgi/EN/QXLRicardo/PR/Q1013858195/_32719946
quote:
If you attack, sorry defend your property, where do you stand in the law's eyes?
Agreed, Not sure on this one, a friend did aki-do (think thats the correct spelling) and was told if he got broken into to use a broom for defence instead of the wooden or metal weapons. I think a baseball bat could be classed as a weapon.
The way that the burgular is now protected and even given money to pursue a lawsuit against you (unbelievable
) I think you have to be very careful.Defend your property the best way..... if you're gonna do it, do it right. Knock em out completely, then get them the hell away from your house and dump the body, preferably with a lead weight attached.....
Then go home and report a break-in the next day (you were out at the time), then forget about it.
Then go home and report a break-in the next day (you were out at the time), then forget about it.
quote:
If you attack, sorry defend your property, where do you stand in the law's eyes?
Agreed, Not sure on this one, a friend did aki-do (think thats the correct spelling) and was told if he got broken into to use a broom for defence instead of the wooden or metal weapons. I think a baseball bat could be classed as a weapon.
The way that the burgular is now protected and even given money to pursue a lawsuit against you (unbelievable
) I think you have to be very careful. Section 3 Criminal law act 1967 states
A person may use such force as is reasonable in the circumstances in the prevention of crime, or in effecting or assisting in the lawful arrest of offenders or suspected offenders or of persons unlawfully at large.
This covers
1) preventing crime
2) defending yourself or another
3) protecting property.
The court are the body that decide whether the degree of force used was reasonable in the circumstances.
If you mistakenly believe that you are about to be attacked, the belief itself does not have to be 'reasonable' Case law states that if you had a mistaken belief that you were about to be attacke and it was not infact the case but you use force to protect yourself from the perceived attack, you will qualify for a defence under this Act.
(This was case law stated when the attackers were actually Police and bailiffs, where the defendant had no knowledge of who they were and used force to defend himself)
A baseball bat is in itself not an offensive weapon.
Offensive weapons are described in the statute and cover things like knuckle dusters, flick knives, stillettos and many of the martial art type weapons.
Sect 1(4) Prevention of Crime act 1953 covers what is an offensive weapon.
This is any article made or ADAPTED for causing injury to the person.
Weapons adapted for causing injury can be anything. This is when the baseball bat can fit into the offence. The adaption can be the circumstances in which you are carrying it and it is the intention of the use that it will be put to that is important.
THERE IS A DEFENCE TO CARRYING AN OFFENSIVE WEAPON.
This is that the defendant may show that he had 'good reason' or lawful authority to have it in a public place.
'Good reason' can include self defence. But this will be decided by the court on the balance of probabilities.
I hope this clears the ambiguity up
Kenny Noe (of M25 road rage killing fame) got off a murder charge several years earlier when he stabbed an unarmed copper to death multiple times in his garden while the copper was carrying out survilance. He claimed self defence in court even though he stabbed the copper with a kitchen knife that he took out of the glove box of his car, and the copper had stood up and identified himself as a police officer. In mitigation it was claimed the copper was dressed in black and wearing a balaclarver (sp?) and that Kenny had been so startled he lashed out. He was aquitted of all charges !!!!!!!!!!!
>> Edited by mel on Monday 8th July 19:12
>> Edited by mel on Monday 8th July 19:12
quote:
A person may use such force as is reasonable in the circumstances in the prevention of crime, or in effecting or assisting in the lawful arrest of offenders or suspected offenders or of persons unlawfully at large.
This covers
1) preventing crime
2) defending yourself or another
3) protecting property.
A baseball bat is in itself not an offensive weapon.
So why do your colleagues get so uptight when a law abiding person carries a baseball bat in his car for defence against car-jacking?? And then ALWAYS calls it an offensive weapon??? and I'm not talking about people with souped max-power dustbins and reversed baseballcaps who get stopped, but 50+ year olds driving decent cars who then get seriously hassled ?????
Could always take it on holiday here
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/scotland/newsid_2117000/2117275.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/scotland/newsid_2117000/2117275.stm
quote:
So why do your colleagues get so uptight when a law abiding person carries a baseball bat in his car for defence against car-jacking?? And then ALWAYS calls it an offensive weapon??? and I'm not talking about people with souped max-power dustbins and reversed baseballcaps who get stopped, but 50+ year olds driving decent cars who then get seriously hassled ?????
Probably because if you have told them what you have it for it immediately falls into the category of offensive weapon by your intent.
However as stated you can still do this as the statute says 'has with him in a public place without lawful authority or REASONABLE EXCUSE'
To have it with you as a response to a generic attack will not qualify for that defence. But if you know of a specific threat towards you from someone that you may have upset, then that would qualify, even if your belief iin itself was not reasonable.
Best to keep it in the car and if questioned as to why its there, then it is for teaching your 4 year old grandson the merits of baseball and a fit and healthy life. Have to go now as I am late for the Kids school Sports day and maybe I might take my baseball bat with me.
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