Who Here Works In Finance?

[daveco]

Looking for a bit of advice as I'm entering my final year of my business degree in September and the option is there to go the finance route (I'm a mature student at 29). I want to get out of the print trade as well, as it is and always will be a terrible business.

I've already completed quantitative methods in 2nd year, and finished with a B+ and a GPA of 3.7 (3.45 overall for 2nd year) and was hoping to continue with it, as I have no real interest in the 'general management' and 'accounting' options that are available.

I might intern in risk in JP Morgan next summer though I am again unsure about this. Any words of wisdom greatly appreciated.

[Bolebroke]

If you have the chance to do an internship at JP you should jump at the chance. You do appreciate quite how good they are ? They are a superb institution, with smart traders and a wealth of talented individuals. I spent 15 years working at various banks and was always very impressed with them. If you are serious about finance you will need to get a CV that demonstrates your commitment as well as ability. At 29 years old you are competing against every year's graduates. Don't miss this cahnce ! Good luck.

[daveco]

Bolebroke said:

If you have the chance to do an internship at JP you should jump at the chance. You do appreciate quite how good they are ? They are a superb institution, with smart traders and a wealth of talented individuals. I spent 15 years working at various banks and was always very impressed with them. If you are serious about finance you will need to get a CV that demonstrates your commitment as well as ability. At 29 years old you are competing against every year's graduates. Don't miss this cahnce ! Good luck.

Okay cheers Bolebroke, advice taken on board!

[Chilli]

daveco said:

Okay cheers Bolebroke, advice taken on board!

Good advice above. I've spent 18 years working in Finance for banks in the city, most recently Citi, before moving to Dubai with a similar role. Long story short I was made redundant and now work as Head of Group Finance for a small group of businesses.
What area of Finance floats your boat? Also what's on your cv at present?
Finance stretches to so many different roles, but Treasury has mostly been my field, and it opens so many doors, so I would always recommend it as a varied and interesting position with good progression prospects.

[R8Steve]

Bolebroke said:

If you have the chance to do an internship at JP you should jump at the chance. You do appreciate quite how good they are ? They are a superb institution, with smart traders and a wealth of talented individuals. I spent 15 years working at various banks and was always very impressed with them. If you are serious about finance you will need to get a CV that demonstrates your commitment as well as ability. At 29 years old you are competing against every year's graduates. Don't miss this cahnce ! Good luck.

Couldn't agree more, if you get the chance to work at JP take it, even if it is not in the field you had first thought of going into, the experience and addition to your CV will be invaluable.

[Mankers]

If you want a career in finance, get stuck into risk, it's certainly the biggest growth area in the Swiss wealth manager I work for. It's like cops (risk team) and robbers (front office).

[daveco]

Chilli said:

daveco said:

Okay cheers Bolebroke, advice taken on board!

Good advice above. I've spent 18 years working in Finance for banks in the city, most recently Citi, before moving to Dubai with a similar role. Long story short I was made redundant and now work as Head of Group Finance for a small group of businesses.
What area of Finance floats your boat? Also what's on your cv at present?
Finance stretches to so many different roles, but Treasury has mostly been my field, and it opens so many doors, so I would always recommend it as a varied and interesting position with good progression prospects.

Risk does interest me and so does Investment banking. My CV is fairly straightforward; though I have managed to balance a full time job with a full time degree and have maintained a GPA in the 3.4-3.6 range.
Could you tell me more about Treasury?

[HannsG]

I am a business partner in an investment bank. Risk without doubt is a great area to be in right now...

CIMA qualified and have worked as a financial contoller in industry beforehand. JP Morgan is the holy grail of banking....this is what I keep hearing from my peers in the US who work on Wall Street.

[daveco]

HannsG said:

I am a business partner in an investment bank. Risk without doubt is a great area to be in right now...

CIMA qualified and have worked as a financial contoller in industry beforehand. JP Morgan is the holy grail of banking....this is what I keep hearing from my peers in the US who work on Wall Street.

Cheers Hanns, I visited their Canary Wharf office back in March and was very impressed, not only by the building but by the modesty of the various execs and employees we met. It was worlds away from the "breakfast is for wimps" or "whoever shouts loudest" attitude of Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley.

[kiethton]

Take the JP internship if offered, as others have siad they are a great organisation and very highly regarded. It can only look good on the CV, even if there isn't necessarily a job at the end of it.

Again, risk is a good place to be (or compliance - but more legal) owing to all the new regualtions flooding in and needing ever more people to review any decision being made.

I personally work in Debt/Recovery/Restructuring (was lending prior to nationalisation/special liquidation), but started a few years after the good times finished. I am on the client liason/business side which although far more interesting has far fewer prospects owing to the current state of affairs (or thats what I'm currently finding as I'm trying to move on).

[R11ysf]

daveco said:

Cheers Hanns, I visited their Canary Wharf office back in March and was very impressed, not only by the building but by the modesty of the various execs and employees we met. It was worlds away from the "breakfast is for wimps" or "whoever shouts loudest" attitude of Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley.

Regardless of whatever you perceive Goldman's attitude to be from the outside, don't knock them, they are exceptional at what they do.

If you can get in any investment bank just do it and then how far you rise will be governed by how good you are.

[daveco]

R11ysf said:

daveco said:

Cheers Hanns, I visited their Canary Wharf office back in March and was very impressed, not only by the building but by the modesty of the various execs and employees we met. It was worlds away from the "breakfast is for wimps" or "whoever shouts loudest" attitude of Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley.

Regardless of whatever you perceive Goldman's attitude to be from the outside, don't knock them, they are exceptional at what they do.

If you can get in any investment bank just do it and then how far you rise will be governed by how good you are.

True, though using the fact they work 16-18 hours a day is not the wisest recruitment tool. I suppose it wouldn't bother me as much if I was 20/21, but I've spent a few years already working crazy hours so it was off-putting.

[Cheib]

R11ysf said:

daveco said:

Cheers Hanns, I visited their Canary Wharf office back in March and was very impressed, not only by the building but by the modesty of the various execs and employees we met. It was worlds away from the "breakfast is for wimps" or "whoever shouts loudest" attitude of Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley.

Regardless of whatever you perceive Goldman's attitude to be from the outside, don't knock them, they are exceptional at what they do.

If you can get in any investment bank just do it and then how far you rise will be governed by how good you are.

And how good at politics you are.....talent will get you so far but these are hugely political institutions. Speaking as someone who worked for investment banks for 20 years....I was utterly clueless as to what was going on around me early in my career.

[HannsG]

Cheib said:

And how good at politics you are.....talent will get you so far but these are hugely political institutions. Speaking as someone who worked for investment banks for 20 years....I was utterly clueless as to what was going on around me early in my career.

100% agree. You have to be a politician...

Talent although recognised only takes you so far. I am still very young in my career in IB, and having worked in Industry for the past five years.

IB is a whole different ball game. There are people who have made arse licking an art form...

Me? I aint to good at playing that game..

Edited by HannsG on Thursday 13th June 14:39

[R11ysf]

Cheib said:

And how good at politics you are.....talent will get you so far but these are hugely political institutions. Speaking as someone who worked for investment banks for 20 years....I was utterly clueless as to what was going on around me early in my career.

Yep, but the ability to get on with people and let your talents be known is a skill in itself. No ability and just an arse licker and you'll be out at the first round of redundancies. Likewise if you excel technically but don't let people know it then you'll also not be safe / progress.

All these things are a game but what I know is the smartest people I know work at Goldman's and the guys I know at JP and Morgan's saw off 6 rounds of redundancies by being good (as well as getting along with people). The guy I worked with before he went to Deutsche who I thought was st got tinned very early on in the cuts and has had to change field.

As the talk of 18 hour days all depends on sector. If you are in M&A or a junior then yes that is where they get the value out of you but once you are 6 years in and in anything market facing then you'll be out the door by 6 if not before.

Cheib what did you do? (genuinely interested )

[Cheib]

Traded Fixed Income/Credit for twenty years....ran a trading desk. Worked for a HF for five years and now working for a "boutique".

I'd disagree that politicians get found out when the times are tough, they don't always....there's a guy I can think of who was known as the Chocolate Teapot....he works at one of the major IB's....I came across him in 2005 and was stunned at his incompetence and he's still there.

If you are good you can do well but ultimately you work in investment banking to get paid and unless you can go into bat for yourself you won't get looked after. As one of my very first bosses said to me "remember every penny in your pocket is a penny out of theirs"

[Buzzz]

Getting into a half decent investment bank is a task and a half these days, both as an experienced hire and also as an entry level grad.

One of the better tried and tested methods is to apply and do and internship. The good candidates on an internship will be offered a place once they graduate if they have demonstrated the skills the bank requires from you in the function you interned at.

As for which area, there are lots of different parts of the bank, take some time to Google to see what you like the sound of. It is long and punishing hours, depending on the department of course.

There's all sorts of stuff:

M&A (long hours, often well into the night and weekends, but high profile stuff, quite technical)

Research (7am starts, you spend your life focusing on a certain sector eg. healthcare)

Sales (again, 7am start, you're selling ideas or products to hedge funds clients)

Compliance (a big area at the moment, probably good to have a legal background, decent hours, but dull work)

Risk (again, quite in focus at the moment, hours not too bad)

[Richieboy3008]

Don't turn your nose up a the less glamorous roles. Show an interest in what other people do. Offer help where possible. Take a look at some of the qualifications here: www.7city.co.uk

Edited by Richieboy3008 on Friday 26th July 11:14