Ford Crossflow Marine engine

[SiredR]

Question - do these generally make sense as a rescued item , will it be very worn out or not as thrashed as a car powerplant ? obviously the useage hours will be a factor but in general ??

[v46m4n]

Big factor will be where it's been used. If it's in the sea all that salt water would have corroded it quite severely, even if it was flushed after each use

[finlo]

Sea water does'nt flow around the block marinised engines are cooled via a heat exchanger.

More of a problem would be polished bores from running at fixed revs for prolonged periods.

[finlo]

Sea water does'nt flow around the block marinised engines are cooled via a heat exchanger.

More of a problem would be polished bores from running at fixed revs for prolonged periods.

[HustleRussell]

Would expect it to need it's bores honed, valve seats re-cut, possibly a new camshaft, rockers, springs etc. many many hours at peak torque will have caused accelerated wear (as has already been suggested)

[jith]

finlo said:

Sea water does'nt flow around the block marinised engines are cooled via a heat exchanger.

More of a problem would be polished bores from running at fixed revs for prolonged periods.

Sorry, that's not accurate. Virtually all small car-derived marine power units are raw water cooled up until very recently.

Mercruiser, Volvo Penta, etc, utilised large 4, 6 and 8 cylinder american car and truck engines and simply fitted water cooled exhaust manifolds and water proofed starters and alternators. Despite the exhorbitant cost of these units they need constant maintenance and will not tolerate the slightest neglect.

Later fuel injected engines tend to use heat exchangers and sealed cooling systems, although the exhaust manifolds by their nature still require to be raw water cooled. Using stainless steel for these is a much better option however.

As far as Ford goes, I remember some small ski boats used X flow engines quite successfully. The bigger stuff such as Fairey Huntsmen and Swordsman did use big Ford marine engines with great success, but you are talking serious money when you get into these kinds of boats.

Corrosion is the single biggest problem and can write the engine off. Unfortunately you need a complete strip down to be sure.

J

[S0 What]

TBH it really depends on what block it is ?
711M are allways sought after, if there's an L cast into the block in between the N/S engine mount bolt hole you've just paid for that Broads boating holiday the missus was after and if it's an AX block she may even get a cruise out of it
Is it petrol or diesel ? i assume petrol or you would have stated as it's very rare to find a dieselised marinised Xflow

[tr7v8]

jith said:

finlo said:

Sea water does'nt flow around the block marinised engines are cooled via a heat exchanger.

More of a problem would be polished bores from running at fixed revs for prolonged periods.

Sorry, that's not accurate. Virtually all small car-derived marine power units are raw water cooled up until very recently.

Wrong, having sorted out the VP 130s on my Draco they are freshwater cooled with heat exchangers. As are a lot of engines in that era, certainly VP ones. A lot (most) of Mercruisers are raw water cooled which reflects there american roots.
Most marinised Fords by people like Watermota use freshwater cooling as well. A lot of these have been replaced by the Ford 1600 Escort diesels as they use the same block.

[jith]

tr7v8 said:

jith said:

finlo said:

Sea water does'nt flow around the block marinised engines are cooled via a heat exchanger.

More of a problem would be polished bores from running at fixed revs for prolonged periods.

Sorry, that's not accurate. Virtually all small car-derived marine power units are raw water cooled up until very recently.

Wrong, having sorted out the VP 130s on my Draco they are freshwater cooled with heat exchangers. As are a lot of engines in that era, certainly VP ones. A lot (most) of Mercruisers are raw water cooled which reflects there american roots.
Most marinised Fords by people like Watermota use freshwater cooling as well. A lot of these have been replaced by the Ford 1600 Escort diesels as they use the same block.

Why are there so many idiots on here, yes I do mean you, who are obviously looking for an argument for the sake of it?

What do you mean "wrong"? All the Mercruiser and Volvo units from the 60s until just a few years ago used raw water cooling. Both these manufacturers are the largest suppliers of recreational marine engines in the world: meaning they supplied hundreds of thousands of power units over the past 40 years or so ALL with raw water cooling.

In recreational marine engines heat exchangers were extremely rare up until recently. That is a fact.

J

[V8 FOU]

What he said ^^^

I have owned 3 Watermota engined boats - all raw cooled. All pre x/flow.
Usually an overhaul consists of a hone and rings plus new cam and followers. Most boat engines are run at constant revs and in the case of these, never more than 4000 rpm. Never seen much in the way of valve seat recession either < 4000 rpm you see.
My present boat has 2x Ford Dorsets from 1975. Fresh cooled. Water cooled gearbox, oil cooler and turbo intercooler. wouldn't want sea water through that lot + calorifier....

Edited by V8 FOU on Sunday 2nd June 14:48

[tr7v8]

jith said:

tr7v8 said:

jith said:

finlo said:

Sea water does'nt flow around the block marinised engines are cooled via a heat exchanger.

More of a problem would be polished bores from running at fixed revs for prolonged periods.

Sorry, that's not accurate. Virtually all small car-derived marine power units are raw water cooled up until very recently.

Wrong, having sorted out the VP 130s on my Draco they are freshwater cooled with heat exchangers. As are a lot of engines in that era, certainly VP ones. A lot (most) of Mercruisers are raw water cooled which reflects there american roots.
Most marinised Fords by people like Watermota use freshwater cooling as well. A lot of these have been replaced by the Ford 1600 Escort diesels as they use the same block.

Why are there so many idiots on here, yes I do mean you, who are obviously looking for an argument for the sake of it?

What do you mean "wrong"? All the Mercruiser and Volvo units from the 60s until just a few years ago used raw water cooling. Both these manufacturers are the largest suppliers of recreational marine engines in the world: meaning they supplied hundreds of thousands of power units over the past 40 years or so ALL with raw water cooling.

In recreational marine engines heat exchangers were extremely rare up until recently. That is a fact.

J

Nope as I said my VP131 (not 130s the 130 was a pushrod 60s lump based on the B1800) were freshwater cooled with heat exchangers as are all that era of VP engines. 131 is based on Volvo 240 lump, certainly the 151 & 171 are as well as have worked on both. I wrote an article on using the car water pumps as the freshwater pump as the car ones are £20 or so & the VP part as a genuine one is £500. I also struggled to get the whole lot water tight on both engines on the Draco.

It is the box on the front in this YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&amp...
And pics of the non-existent heat exchanger here
http://www.volvopentashop.com/PSMotorV/en-GB/Detai...

[Sid's Dad]

Lots of river craft (no salt water problems...) use Ford marine engines - such as Freemans, which are lovely cabin cruisers with a keen following and lots of specialist advice at boatyards in the Thames Valley. Try Val Wyatt Marine for some good advice - if they can't tell you whether they make good sense fir non-marine applications, they'll know who can.

[jith]

tr7v8 said:

jith said:

tr7v8 said:

jith said:

finlo said:

Sea water does'nt flow around the block marinised engines are cooled via a heat exchanger.

More of a problem would be polished bores from running at fixed revs for prolonged periods.

Sorry, that's not accurate. Virtually all small car-derived marine power units are raw water cooled up until very recently.

Wrong, having sorted out the VP 130s on my Draco they are freshwater cooled with heat exchangers. As are a lot of engines in that era, certainly VP ones. A lot (most) of Mercruisers are raw water cooled which reflects there american roots.
Most marinised Fords by people like Watermota use freshwater cooling as well. A lot of these have been replaced by the Ford 1600 Escort diesels as they use the same block.

Why are there so many idiots on here, yes I do mean you, who are obviously looking for an argument for the sake of it?

What do you mean "wrong"? All the Mercruiser and Volvo units from the 60s until just a few years ago used raw water cooling. Both these manufacturers are the largest suppliers of recreational marine engines in the world: meaning they supplied hundreds of thousands of power units over the past 40 years or so ALL with raw water cooling.

In recreational marine engines heat exchangers were extremely rare up until recently. That is a fact.

J

Nope as I said my VP131 (not 130s the 130 was a pushrod 60s lump based on the B1800) were freshwater cooled with heat exchangers as are all that era of VP engines. 131 is based on Volvo 240 lump, certainly the 151 & 171 are as well as have worked on both. I wrote an article on using the car water pumps as the freshwater pump as the car ones are £20 or so & the VP part as a genuine one is £500. I also struggled to get the whole lot water tight on both engines on the Draco.

It is the box on the front in this YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&amp...
And pics of the non-existent heat exchanger here
http://www.volvopentashop.com/PSMotorV/en-GB/Detai...

If you'll pardon the pun, you're all at sea with this. If you check out the Volvo parts site you will find that the only sealed cooling system offered by Volvo is on the small 4 cylinder engines. It is offered as an option. On all the 140 and 240 based marine engines I have worked on in vessels, I have never come across one using a heat exchanger. That includes installations in Fjord cruisers, Fletchers and Broom ski boats and cruisers.

The Volvo 3 cylinder turbo diesel auxiliary in my Sigma 365 was also raw water cooled, as is my friend's cruiser with the same engine.

J

[v46m4n]

Ive had 3 ford marine units, ford straight six, ford x flow and ford 3000 V6. all Raw water cooled

[alfaspecial]

I am no expert but one problem might be that a marine engine will have been set up to run at continuous RPM rather than accelerated / decelerated in the way a car engine is used.

'Aeroplane engined' monsters' are often referred to in the media as being powered by a (Spitfire) Rolls-Royce Merlin engine whereas they are in fact usually powered by a (tank) RR Meteor engine for the reason above.

[SiredR]

It's actually only been used on inland waterways and the unit is badged up as a "sea tiger" , it's a 711M block but the head has a lot of fixing holes than the auto ones I'm used to , the issue of constant fixed revs is kind of what I was anticipating , there will be specific ware to the bores/rings as previously mentioned but still well worth having I think.

[crofty1984]

My freeman has a x-flow ford and that's raw water cooled (i.e. no heat exchanger).