what's wrong with pdk? being as impressed by
Discussion
tried a 991 with a pdk box last week and I can't remember ever being as impressed by a new piece of technology as that. Fabulously quick and smooth changes way faster than any human could do it.
So the question is - why do many enthusiasts OK down on cars with such paddle shift boxes?
So the question is - why do many enthusiasts OK down on cars with such paddle shift boxes?
Totally agree, it's very impressive. It's an amazing piece of kit, launch control is astounding.
The problem is, it's boring. It's too easy. There's no challenge and no real interaction apart from some buttons.
Your grandma could go quickly in it. There is no reward for getting it right.
The problem is, it's boring. It's too easy. There's no challenge and no real interaction apart from some buttons.
Your grandma could go quickly in it. There is no reward for getting it right.
Magic919 said:
I think this forum gives a rather skewed view. Many other brands adopted flappy paddle 'boxes ages ago and people I'd regard as enthusiasts are very happy with them.
+1PDK is awesome. I tried it in a newly new Boxster (not current model) and it was sublime, I can only imagine it has been improved even more since. As for the market, clearly Porsche and others are basing their decisions off of market forces rather than some bizarre anti-manual agenda. I'm sure I read somewhere that over 80% of new Porsches in EU were specced with PDK.
Durzel said:
+1
PDK is awesome. I tried it in a newly new Boxster (not current model) and it was sublime, I can only imagine it has been improved even more since. As for the market, clearly Porsche and others are basing their decisions off of market forces rather than some bizarre anti-manual agenda. I'm sure I read somewhere that over 80% of new Porsches in EU were specced with PDK.
I can't argue with that. I am sure that Porsche is indeed following what the market wants, ie, the target new buyer.PDK is awesome. I tried it in a newly new Boxster (not current model) and it was sublime, I can only imagine it has been improved even more since. As for the market, clearly Porsche and others are basing their decisions off of market forces rather than some bizarre anti-manual agenda. I'm sure I read somewhere that over 80% of new Porsches in EU were specced with PDK.
Thing is, the 911 was always the outsider, a car for an individual. If you continue down the line of trying to please the majority, you end up with a Toyota corolla.
I can't pretend to be an expert on the ins and outs of car manufacturing but I would assume that providing a manual option for their new cars, in addition to PDK which as established sells in very high ratios, involves more than just saying "that gearbox will probably work ok, drop it in there".
There's tooling, training, testing, etc. There's a whole host of R&D involved in ensuring that the manual gearbox can be warrantied for the projected life of the vehicle. It's the same story for PDK of course, but if you know 80%+ of buyers will spec it then it's a no-brainer financially for them.
I'd like there to be a manual option for all the cars for no other reason that more choice is always better than none, but if Porsche are just going to lose money doing it then it's not a good business decision for them. They wouldn't stand to gain anything from doing it besides some "PH cred" that doesn't pay the bills at the end of the day.
There's tooling, training, testing, etc. There's a whole host of R&D involved in ensuring that the manual gearbox can be warrantied for the projected life of the vehicle. It's the same story for PDK of course, but if you know 80%+ of buyers will spec it then it's a no-brainer financially for them.
I'd like there to be a manual option for all the cars for no other reason that more choice is always better than none, but if Porsche are just going to lose money doing it then it's not a good business decision for them. They wouldn't stand to gain anything from doing it besides some "PH cred" that doesn't pay the bills at the end of the day.
mollytherocker said:
Totally agree, it's very impressive. It's an amazing piece of kit, launch control is astounding.
The problem is, it's boring. It's too easy. There's no challenge and no real interaction apart from some buttons.
Your grandma could go quickly in it. There is no reward for getting it right.
I have had a few 911s from 1980 onwards and currently own the latest C2S (with PDK) and I entirely disagree with your viewpoint.The problem is, it's boring. It's too easy. There's no challenge and no real interaction apart from some buttons.
Your grandma could go quickly in it. There is no reward for getting it right.
You might enjoy wrestling with outdated technology. You might derive immense satisfaction from heeling and toeing into every corner. I don't. I enjoy focusing on taking each corner as efficiently as possible and PDK helps with that.
Incidentally, a PDK box still requires manual use of the gearbox to get best results. It's just the clutch that isn't needed.
Perec said:
I have had a few 911s from 1980 onwards and currently own the latest C2S (with PDK) and I entirely disagree with your viewpoint.
You might enjoy wrestling with outdated technology. You might derive immense satisfaction from heeling and toeing into every corner. I don't. I enjoy focusing on taking each corner as efficiently as possible and PDK helps with that.
Incidentally, a PDK box still requires manual use of the gearbox to get best results. It's just the clutch that isn't needed.
Actually, it is my understanding that the auto mode is the quickest around a track.You might enjoy wrestling with outdated technology. You might derive immense satisfaction from heeling and toeing into every corner. I don't. I enjoy focusing on taking each corner as efficiently as possible and PDK helps with that.
Incidentally, a PDK box still requires manual use of the gearbox to get best results. It's just the clutch that isn't needed.
What other functions could a computer do faster? Steering perhaps?
mollytherocker said:
Perec said:
I have had a few 911s from 1980 onwards and currently own the latest C2S (with PDK) and I entirely disagree with your viewpoint.
You might enjoy wrestling with outdated technology. You might derive immense satisfaction from heeling and toeing into every corner. I don't. I enjoy focusing on taking each corner as efficiently as possible and PDK helps with that.
Incidentally, a PDK box still requires manual use of the gearbox to get best results. It's just the clutch that isn't needed.
Actually, it is my understanding that the auto mode is the quickest around a track.You might enjoy wrestling with outdated technology. You might derive immense satisfaction from heeling and toeing into every corner. I don't. I enjoy focusing on taking each corner as efficiently as possible and PDK helps with that.
Incidentally, a PDK box still requires manual use of the gearbox to get best results. It's just the clutch that isn't needed.
What other functions could a computer do faster? Steering perhaps?
Until the car is fitted with a camera or ten it won't steer faster than a human.
Having recently driven a PDK 981 Boxster S I can see why people love them, its so easy to use with lightening quick changes and the engine blip on downshifts it truly is an engineering marvel.
The thing that bothers me though is this type of gearbox is being pushed very heavily by the manufacturers as being able to shift ratios faster than a human so therefore it must be better than a manual.
I think this is very cleverly marketed as we all know petrol heads want faster this and faster that with every tenth of a second gained helping in day to day driving, that plus it costs a fair old wedge as an extra that the maker cashes in on too.
Can anyone truthfully say they enjoy driving a PDK equipped car over a manual for pure driving pleasure.
The thing that bothers me though is this type of gearbox is being pushed very heavily by the manufacturers as being able to shift ratios faster than a human so therefore it must be better than a manual.
I think this is very cleverly marketed as we all know petrol heads want faster this and faster that with every tenth of a second gained helping in day to day driving, that plus it costs a fair old wedge as an extra that the maker cashes in on too.
Can anyone truthfully say they enjoy driving a PDK equipped car over a manual for pure driving pleasure.
mollytherocker said:
The problem is, it's boring. It's too easy. There's no challenge and no real interaction apart from some buttons.
Your grandma could go quickly in it. There is no reward for getting it right.
Must be something about Porsche owners. You won't find any 458 owners talking about a lack of involvement or reward.Your grandma could go quickly in it. There is no reward for getting it right.
When I was out driving the Boxster I was on one of my favourite roads that I know very well and came across a car which I needed to overtake...now in my manual Cayman I would be in third gear knowing I could rev it out and pass the car...what happened in the Boxter though took me by surprise it was in sport and manual mode in third gear when I floored it to pass...it instantly dropped a gear and revved out so there I was on the other side of the road the car had ran out of revs so I had to quickly flick the paddle to change up and complete the pass it was all a bit messy...
I don't like the fact it will change down even though it's in manual mode when I need to be in full control of what I want the car to do, sorry all PKD lovers I will never have a car with one of these boxes fitted I need to be able to drive the car with me inputting when the gear changes will happen.
I don't like the fact it will change down even though it's in manual mode when I need to be in full control of what I want the car to do, sorry all PKD lovers I will never have a car with one of these boxes fitted I need to be able to drive the car with me inputting when the gear changes will happen.
Klippie said:
I don't like the fact it will change down even though it's in manual mode when I need to be in full control of what I want the car to do, sorry all PKD lovers I will never have a car with one of these boxes fitted I need to be able to drive the car with me inputting when the gear changes will happen.
No need to be sorry, it's your issue, makes no difference to anyone else.mollytherocker said:
Why would they? There is no manual option, so they have purposely chosen an auto as thats what they want.
They wouldnt have bought it otherwise would they?
No they have bought an auto because if they want a 458 they have no other choice, yet there doesn't seem to be any noise saying 'love the car but wish it was manual'They wouldnt have bought it otherwise would they?
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