Discussion
(or LDN as they like to trendily call it)
http://retaildesignblog.net/2012/09/10/rapha-cycle... (pics here)
I'm well aware of Rapha's penchance for pretentiousness. So I was prepared for this mornings experience to be "different"
I had in mind the new Sky Softshell. I liked the pics on the website. It was far more discreet than the old Adidas branded kit. So I could wear it and not feel like the hordes of leisure cyclists in full Sky get-up. Rapha stuff is by definition tailored more fitted so I wanted to try it on first. (Given the £240 price tag)
Opened the ridiculously heavy/sticking door and before I've got both feet inside I'm "greeted" by a sales guy. Irritating, but becoming par for the course these days. First impressions, it's much smaller than the pics make it seem. It's pretty much half coffee shop and half clothing range. There's maybe 4 people having coffee watching Tour of Qatar highlights, and 1 other person browsing in the clothing bit. A cursory walk around the selling area (takes all of 20 seconds) and they have a very limited range of items on display. If that's genuinely everything they currently sell I'm surprised. Find the very small selection of Sky equipment. And they have 3 S/shells on a rail. S, M and Large. Teenager is standing nearby. I ask him if these are the only sizes?
"Yes we have others, what size did you want?"
"Well I'm not sure. Maybe Large. Maybe XL even"
For reference I'm 6'1 and have swimmers shoulders. (Generally Castelli stuff I need XXL) He looks at me standing there in a XL Heavy NorthFace jacket and says "oh Large will be fine" (How he can tell through this jacket I dunno, but I'll bow to his product knowledge at this stage)
So I try on the Large and it's tighter than I would like.
"See it's fine" says boy
"Hmmm I say. Bit tighter than I would like" as I mime my bike position at him
"Nah, it's fine you've still got a bit of space here" (at the bottom of the jacket) "It needs to be tight so it doesn't flap about"
"Yeah, I get that, but I think it's a case of personal preference. A bit larger."
And we have that moment where I look at him expecting him to say "I'll go and get an XL and you can try it to see" Only he doesn't he stands there and just looks at me. And he says nothing. And he continues to stand there in silence and look at me whilst I take it back off. Put it on the hanger and then hang it back on the rail.
I go to the other colour Softshells they do. But again everything is just Small, Med or Large. (Why???) It's patently obvious I'm only looking at the sizes in the jackets, not the actual designs, I want to try on a XL for comparisson. See boy has stopped standing there and is now examining his spots in the mirror on the wall.
I half pull out a Black with pink bits one from the same rail to check the size. Boy appears instantly next to me.
"That's the womens one"
"Oh I see, it was in with the mens ones"
Again silence, just looks at me. I turn and walk towards the door. Greeter guy goes "have a nice day sir" And all I can think is that they've lost a pretty much nailed on sale because neither of them wanted to actually do anything.
I can only assume that their regular customers just pick and pay and for someone to require a little service is outside their training.
Back to Sigma I go then. (they do sell Rapha stuff but are outofstock for the Sky S/S)
http://retaildesignblog.net/2012/09/10/rapha-cycle... (pics here)
I'm well aware of Rapha's penchance for pretentiousness. So I was prepared for this mornings experience to be "different"
I had in mind the new Sky Softshell. I liked the pics on the website. It was far more discreet than the old Adidas branded kit. So I could wear it and not feel like the hordes of leisure cyclists in full Sky get-up. Rapha stuff is by definition tailored more fitted so I wanted to try it on first. (Given the £240 price tag) Opened the ridiculously heavy/sticking door and before I've got both feet inside I'm "greeted" by a sales guy. Irritating, but becoming par for the course these days. First impressions, it's much smaller than the pics make it seem. It's pretty much half coffee shop and half clothing range. There's maybe 4 people having coffee watching Tour of Qatar highlights, and 1 other person browsing in the clothing bit. A cursory walk around the selling area (takes all of 20 seconds) and they have a very limited range of items on display. If that's genuinely everything they currently sell I'm surprised. Find the very small selection of Sky equipment. And they have 3 S/shells on a rail. S, M and Large. Teenager is standing nearby. I ask him if these are the only sizes?
"Yes we have others, what size did you want?"
"Well I'm not sure. Maybe Large. Maybe XL even"
For reference I'm 6'1 and have swimmers shoulders. (Generally Castelli stuff I need XXL) He looks at me standing there in a XL Heavy NorthFace jacket and says "oh Large will be fine" (How he can tell through this jacket I dunno, but I'll bow to his product knowledge at this stage)
So I try on the Large and it's tighter than I would like.
"See it's fine" says boy
"Hmmm I say. Bit tighter than I would like" as I mime my bike position at him
"Nah, it's fine you've still got a bit of space here" (at the bottom of the jacket) "It needs to be tight so it doesn't flap about"
"Yeah, I get that, but I think it's a case of personal preference. A bit larger."
And we have that moment where I look at him expecting him to say "I'll go and get an XL and you can try it to see" Only he doesn't he stands there and just looks at me. And he says nothing. And he continues to stand there in silence and look at me whilst I take it back off. Put it on the hanger and then hang it back on the rail.
I go to the other colour Softshells they do. But again everything is just Small, Med or Large. (Why???) It's patently obvious I'm only looking at the sizes in the jackets, not the actual designs, I want to try on a XL for comparisson. See boy has stopped standing there and is now examining his spots in the mirror on the wall.
I half pull out a Black with pink bits one from the same rail to check the size. Boy appears instantly next to me."That's the womens one"
"Oh I see, it was in with the mens ones"
Again silence, just looks at me. I turn and walk towards the door. Greeter guy goes "have a nice day sir" And all I can think is that they've lost a pretty much nailed on sale because neither of them wanted to actually do anything.
I can only assume that their regular customers just pick and pay and for someone to require a little service is outside their training. Back to Sigma I go then. (they do sell Rapha stuff but are outofstock for the Sky S/S)
Edited by Rich_W on Saturday 9th February 16:27
I've been in several times on trips to London, each time the staff have been friendly, happy to chat - being Scottish they were keen to ask more and very engaging. Spent a bit too much time browsing they were happy to accommodate me asking for the 'bigger' sizes even although I'd said it would be for a future web purchase.
I like it there, good cycling vibe, good food & drink and a chance to 'perv' at the weird & wonderful world of London cyclists.
Interestingly Sigma left me cold, obviously a very good shop but lacking the 'engagement' factor for me.
I like it there, good cycling vibe, good food & drink and a chance to 'perv' at the weird & wonderful world of London cyclists.
Interestingly Sigma left me cold, obviously a very good shop but lacking the 'engagement' factor for me.
Lose some weight? 
As you say it is smaller than the pics make it look, however there is stuff tucked all over the place, under the tables etc. It's pretty much their whole product line on display, whereas when you go into other shops they will have loads of different brands so lots of space required.
As you say it is smaller than the pics make it look, however there is stuff tucked all over the place, under the tables etc. It's pretty much their whole product line on display, whereas when you go into other shops they will have loads of different brands so lots of space required.
Only thing I've ever bought in there is the wonderful Rapha Ventoux shaving cream aside from far too many coffees & fig rolls. Top tip if you take sugar in coffee, don't put it in a Rapha coffee, the milk they use for their latte's is the best tasting milk I've ever tasted, sugar would ruin it.
Benmac said:
Did you ask to try an XL?
No. And I'm sure you'll suggest I should have if I wanted to actually buy it.But I think (and I may be wrong) that at this price point. If that sales kid wants the commission for the transaction, he has to work a bit harder than he did. They work harder in Currys to sell you the extended warranty and all the other nonsense you don't want on a £300 Laptop. They work harder in a JD Sports if you want a size 11.
I'm not precious about expecting top dollar service everywhere I go, but the complete lack of interest (and by default Rapha as a brand, given this was their flagship store in an expensive part of London) irritated me to the point where I wasn't going to go out of my way to help them. By contrast 10 mins later I was in Covent Garden buying a product that cost me £22. But before purchase I had tried 5-6 of this brands other equivilents to see which was the right one for me. The staff were interested in my purchase but not pushy.
It DOES matter. The classic, if you don't want my money I'll take it elsewhere
Assos and a decent lbs is the way forward!!!
Bought a new pair of bib's, a HuBu jacket and thermal base last weekend, ended up arguing (in a lighthearted way) with the shop owner about the size I needed. I felt I needed large, he countered I needed medium as once I was on the bars they would fit perfectly. Took his advice and hate to admit that he was 100% correct.
Also quaffed a coffee and some carrot cake during the buying process, and managed to get the lot cheaper than I could find it online.
Great thing about an lbs that is staffed and run by the owner is the service!
Bought a new pair of bib's, a HuBu jacket and thermal base last weekend, ended up arguing (in a lighthearted way) with the shop owner about the size I needed. I felt I needed large, he countered I needed medium as once I was on the bars they would fit perfectly. Took his advice and hate to admit that he was 100% correct.
Also quaffed a coffee and some carrot cake during the buying process, and managed to get the lot cheaper than I could find it online.
Great thing about an lbs that is staffed and run by the owner is the service!
MadDad said:
Assos and a decent lbs is the way forward!!!
Bought a new pair of bib's, a HuBu jacket and thermal base last weekend, ended up arguing (in a lighthearted way) with the shop owner about the size I needed. I felt I needed large, he countered I needed medium as once I was on the bars they would fit perfectly. Took his advice and hate to admit that he was 100% correct.
Also quaffed a coffee and some carrot cake during the buying process, and managed to get the lot cheaper than I could find it online.
Great thing about an lbs that is staffed and run by the owner is the service!
Sounds like you are in 'the gang', a LBS can be fantastic, especially if you are blessed with one with a vast selection, more often than not when I pay them a visit, find they have a selection of mediocre, overpriced brands and I end up resorting to the usual online suspects.Bought a new pair of bib's, a HuBu jacket and thermal base last weekend, ended up arguing (in a lighthearted way) with the shop owner about the size I needed. I felt I needed large, he countered I needed medium as once I was on the bars they would fit perfectly. Took his advice and hate to admit that he was 100% correct.
Also quaffed a coffee and some carrot cake during the buying process, and managed to get the lot cheaper than I could find it online.
Great thing about an lbs that is staffed and run by the owner is the service!
Condor Cycles but in my small Northern town would be just perfect!
I felt similarly to the OP about the Rapha store when I happened to pay a visit a few months ago - I wasn't trying anything on, but felt much more like an exercise in branding rather than somewhere where any serious cycling enthusiast would want to spend any time. Sigma on the other hand has an excellent stock of most cycling-related items and helpful staff.
Note that I've only heard good things about Rapha's gear, but by George, you do pay for it
Note that I've only heard good things about Rapha's gear, but by George, you do pay for it
When did you go in? I only reopened this week and the pics are pre-refurb. Unless the refurb was too subtle for me.
Sounds like you got a bit unlucky. I have to say Rapha sizing is like a lot of things on the high street, sizing based on 12 year old boys. I really wanted to treat myself to a pair of Rapha's cycling jeans a few weeks ago but they were just too damn small. A thigh rather than waist issue, honest. I found the same issue in every other shop I went to so not just a Rapha thing.
I've always enjoyed the experience in Rapha - always looks over, rather than under-staffed which is nice. I spent a lot of time there a few months ago, drinking coffee and watching the Vuelta.
When I bought a soft-shell jacket last month they didn't have my size in stock but did say they had stock available online, so ordered it there and then. It arrived, beautifully packaged, a couple of days later.
Hope your experience was an isolated one.
Sounds like you got a bit unlucky. I have to say Rapha sizing is like a lot of things on the high street, sizing based on 12 year old boys. I really wanted to treat myself to a pair of Rapha's cycling jeans a few weeks ago but they were just too damn small. A thigh rather than waist issue, honest. I found the same issue in every other shop I went to so not just a Rapha thing.
I've always enjoyed the experience in Rapha - always looks over, rather than under-staffed which is nice. I spent a lot of time there a few months ago, drinking coffee and watching the Vuelta.
When I bought a soft-shell jacket last month they didn't have my size in stock but did say they had stock available online, so ordered it there and then. It arrived, beautifully packaged, a couple of days later.
Hope your experience was an isolated one.
Hackney said:
When did you go in? It only reopened this week and the pics are pre-refurb. Unless the refurb was too subtle for me.
Sounds like you got a bit unlucky. I have to say Rapha sizing is like a lot of things on the high street, sizing based on 12 year old boys. I really wanted to treat myself to a pair of Rapha's cycling jeans a few weeks ago but they were just too damn small. A thigh rather than waist issue, honest. I found the same issue in every other shop I went to so not just a Rapha thing.
I've always enjoyed the experience in Rapha - always looks over, rather than under-staffed which is nice. I spent a lot of time there a few months ago, drinking coffee and watching the Vuelta.
When I bought a soft-shell jacket last month they didn't have my size in stock but did say they had stock available online, so ordered it there and then. It arrived, beautifully packaged, a couple of days later.
Hope your experience was an isolated one.
Yesterday morning. About 09:45ish. The "refurb" is fairly subtle compared to those pics. The car has gone from the corner and the tables are different in the cafe part. The shelves/rails look the same though. I'd never been in there before, so can't comment fully. Others may spot smaller details that I missed. I didn't even go in the coffee shop area. I do expect a flagship store to have ALL sizes available on the shelf though at all times. If Boss or Levis or Nike can do it in their shops. Why not a relatively small bike clothing shop (sorry bike cycle club Sounds like you got a bit unlucky. I have to say Rapha sizing is like a lot of things on the high street, sizing based on 12 year old boys. I really wanted to treat myself to a pair of Rapha's cycling jeans a few weeks ago but they were just too damn small. A thigh rather than waist issue, honest. I found the same issue in every other shop I went to so not just a Rapha thing.
I've always enjoyed the experience in Rapha - always looks over, rather than under-staffed which is nice. I spent a lot of time there a few months ago, drinking coffee and watching the Vuelta.
When I bought a soft-shell jacket last month they didn't have my size in stock but did say they had stock available online, so ordered it there and then. It arrived, beautifully packaged, a couple of days later.
Hope your experience was an isolated one.
)RE sizing. I'm not worried that they want everything to come up small. I really could care less if I have to have XXXXL so it fits properly. No one I know thinks I'm anything other than slim. Albeit with slightly broad shoulders. So it all seems a bit 'marketting' to make things in children sizes. As you say other brands are just as guilty. My Castelli bib tights are XXL. (34" waist!) God knows how the American market works???
I actually contemplated emailing the link to this thread to Rapha. But I really can't be bothered. It's not going to get me back into that shop again. And depending on what their competitors like Assos etc offer. It probably will be the last time I try on a Rapha product. I guess I'm just disappointed/frustrated rather than angry with them.
Like in so many other aspects of life. Trying to support the British companies is such hard going, you give up.
Edited by Rich_W on Sunday 10th February 13:11
MattDell said:
Magic919 said:
I'd have probably asked them to get the item in the size I wanted.
Agreed.Also, a lot of shops these days will only display S, M, L of each style and re-stock immediately after a sale.
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