Job offer retracted, advice!
Discussion
Short version:
Applied for a job (electrical engineer in a huge manufacturing plant), got through 2 interview stages and received an email to say i was successful. Was advised to hand in my notice at my current job and start new one in just under 4 weeks. Was also told that i had to undergo a medical/drug test but that that wouldn't affect me being offered the job.
Underwent the medical a week ago yesterday. This morning i get a call to say that they are withdrawing the job offer. Company Dr has decided that my lung tests weren't good enough and that i would have to wear a respirator whenever i worked in certain areas of the plant and that long term use of a respirator could in itself cause me lung issues. I have very mild asthma and have since i was 8, advised them of this several time's even before the medical but was told it wouldn't be a concern. Very rarely have any asthma issues and don't normally even carry my inhaler.
The woman from HR was apologetic but when i explained that i had effectively quit my job and that my replacement was due to start this Monday and work alongside me for my last 2 weeks the best she said she could do was send a letter to my employer explaining what had happened.
I asked her to clarify with the Dr and company director that made the final decision what exactly had been discussed and their thoughts on what had happened and email me back with what they said. Also asked why i couldn't have done a medical before i quit my existing job and was told it would be discrimination if they ruled me out due to my asthma before they offered me the job.
Not sure what I'm after other than advice on whether or not this is standard practice and maybe if there is anything i can do about it. I've been in my current job about 8 years so I'm a bit out of touch with recruitment procedures.
I haven't signed any contracts or anything so i guess they are well within their rights to do this, i just feel put out that they can potentially leave people unemployed and high and dry with just an apology. I'm also not expecting them to change their minds, don't think i would like to work there now after all this debacle!
Applied for a job (electrical engineer in a huge manufacturing plant), got through 2 interview stages and received an email to say i was successful. Was advised to hand in my notice at my current job and start new one in just under 4 weeks. Was also told that i had to undergo a medical/drug test but that that wouldn't affect me being offered the job.
Underwent the medical a week ago yesterday. This morning i get a call to say that they are withdrawing the job offer. Company Dr has decided that my lung tests weren't good enough and that i would have to wear a respirator whenever i worked in certain areas of the plant and that long term use of a respirator could in itself cause me lung issues. I have very mild asthma and have since i was 8, advised them of this several time's even before the medical but was told it wouldn't be a concern. Very rarely have any asthma issues and don't normally even carry my inhaler.
The woman from HR was apologetic but when i explained that i had effectively quit my job and that my replacement was due to start this Monday and work alongside me for my last 2 weeks the best she said she could do was send a letter to my employer explaining what had happened.
I asked her to clarify with the Dr and company director that made the final decision what exactly had been discussed and their thoughts on what had happened and email me back with what they said. Also asked why i couldn't have done a medical before i quit my existing job and was told it would be discrimination if they ruled me out due to my asthma before they offered me the job.
Not sure what I'm after other than advice on whether or not this is standard practice and maybe if there is anything i can do about it. I've been in my current job about 8 years so I'm a bit out of touch with recruitment procedures.
I haven't signed any contracts or anything so i guess they are well within their rights to do this, i just feel put out that they can potentially leave people unemployed and high and dry with just an apology. I'm also not expecting them to change their minds, don't think i would like to work there now after all this debacle!
You contractual claim would be limited to damages equivalent to the notice period in the offered job. Whether you have a contract depends on the terms of the correspondence between you and the putative new employer. A contract does not have to be a bit of paper with "contract" written on it. If the offer of employment was conditional on medical clearance, you have no contract.
You might have a claim for disability discrimination on the basis of failure to make reasonable adjustments to accommodate your asthma, but there are two problems with this. The first is that controlled asthma may not qualify as a disability, because of the lack of substantial impairment of day to day functions. The second is that, if the employer has medical advice that the adjustment might be bad for your health, then it would probably not be a reasonable adjustment.
You might have a claim for disability discrimination on the basis of failure to make reasonable adjustments to accommodate your asthma, but there are two problems with this. The first is that controlled asthma may not qualify as a disability, because of the lack of substantial impairment of day to day functions. The second is that, if the employer has medical advice that the adjustment might be bad for your health, then it would probably not be a reasonable adjustment.
Thanks for the advice!
I'm not after damages or anything as I'm not really out of pocket other than petrol money and 3 days annual leave. The job is 100 odd miles away and i would be relocating my family. I had presumed that i would sign the contract on the day i started as i did in my current job as it wasn't worth the round trip just to sign paperwork. Was also told before the medical that they would post me out info regarding the offer but this never arrived. Correspondence is the 2 letters asking me to go to the 1st and 2nd interviews and the email in which i was offered the job, stating that i would have to undergo a medical but that regardless of the outcome the job was mine.
I get on okay with my boss as I've been there quite a while. We are pretty busy at the moment and it's no understatement to say that i thought he was going to hug me when i asked if i could stay on! That's why I'm put out rather than hopping mad, I'm just not impressed at how I've been treated.
As a cheeky after thought, could i at least hit them for 3 round trips worth of super unleaded for my Impreza???
I'm not after damages or anything as I'm not really out of pocket other than petrol money and 3 days annual leave. The job is 100 odd miles away and i would be relocating my family. I had presumed that i would sign the contract on the day i started as i did in my current job as it wasn't worth the round trip just to sign paperwork. Was also told before the medical that they would post me out info regarding the offer but this never arrived. Correspondence is the 2 letters asking me to go to the 1st and 2nd interviews and the email in which i was offered the job, stating that i would have to undergo a medical but that regardless of the outcome the job was mine.
I get on okay with my boss as I've been there quite a while. We are pretty busy at the moment and it's no understatement to say that i thought he was going to hug me when i asked if i could stay on! That's why I'm put out rather than hopping mad, I'm just not impressed at how I've been treated.
As a cheeky after thought, could i at least hit them for 3 round trips worth of super unleaded for my Impreza???
If you are advised to hand in your notice in return for a job to start in 4 weeks and you do so then I am pretty sure there must be a contract. Of course there is nothing to prevent the employer giving notice from the start date or paying in lieu of notice. if you can return to your old job then your legal position is not important although a request for a goodwill payment for your expenses can't do any harm.
Zeeky said:
a request for a goodwill payment for your expenses can't do any harm.
That's what I'll hit them with!Doubt I'd have much luck taking a global company with a multi billion dollar turnover to court, especially when i haven't really lost out.
Next time I'll make sure I've signed contracts before handing in my notice, a lesson learned. Although i better stay put for a while as a way of saying thanks to my boss for taking me back!
Will post up more when i hear back from them, thanks for all the advice.
Paulm4 said:
We are pretty busy at the moment and it's no understatement to say that i thought he was going to hug me when i asked if i could stay on!
You are very fortunate with this outcome. You will learn to be more careful next time and not hand in your notice until you have an unconditional offer or a contract.There is nothing more for you to do other than count your blessings.
Breadvan72 said:
The first is that controlled asthma may not qualify as a disability, because of the lack of substantial impairment of day to day functions. The second is that, if the employer has medical advice that the adjustment might be bad for your health, then it would probably not be a reasonable adjustment.
Unlike Breadvan72, ianal but I've nevertheless been reading up on the Equality Act recently; it seems to be much more oriented in favour of whoever has the 'protected characteristic' than DDA used to be, and that was scary enough. I think the OPs asthma might well qualify as a disability under the new act, but he should seek advice on that because under the new law things don't appear to be as cut and dried as they used to be. Get this: you don't actually need to be disabled in the slightest bit to be covered by the Disability Discrimination elements of the act - it is enough if somebody incorrectly assumed you to be disabled and discriminated against you on that basis. Similarly, if you were on a social outing and somewhere refused you service because you had a disabled person in your party, you would be covered and you could claim damages.
Another interesting point is that there's no defence allowed for not making a reasonable adjustment - so if a suitable respirator exists or the building could be modified to make it less dusty (for example), the only question would be whether it would be reasonable for them to do it and the court would decide that, not the employer. Unless it was really enormously expensive, I imagine it would be reasonable.
The act has also created some interesting 'Question and Answer' forms that could possibly be used to put the fear of God into the employer, because both the questions and answers are admissible as evidence.
Might be worth a chat with the helpdesk at the Equality & Human Rights Commission; they'll be able to tell you what best to do.
Eggman said:
The act has also created some interesting 'Question and Answer' forms that could possibly be used to put the fear of God into the employer, because both the questions and answers are admissible as evidence.
Might be worth a chat with the helpdesk at the Equality & Human Rights Commission; they'll be able to tell you what best to do.
And there we have it, all that is wrong with our culture of entitlement. The OP resigned with no contract in place and within an hour we're sending him off to find out about his ooman rights and advising threatening the employer with legal action. Good grief. Might be worth a chat with the helpdesk at the Equality & Human Rights Commission; they'll be able to tell you what best to do.
Paulm4 said:
We are pretty busy at the moment and it's no understatement to say that i thought he was going to hug me when i asked if i could stay on!
you've just used your "free fail"Do not, what ever you do f
k them about again.(and I think you owe them big time for keeping your disloyal ass and if they say jump from this point forward you need to ask "how high, for how long, and is there anything you would like me to do whilst i'm up here...?")
scdan4 said:
you've just used your "free fail"
Do not, what ever you do fk them about again.
(and I think you owe them big time for keeping your disloyal ass and if they say jump from this point forward you need to ask "how high, for how long, and is there anything you would like me to do whilst i'm up here...?")
Lol, i explained when i gave my notice that i was leaving to relocate rather than jumping ship for an extra 20p/hour or whatever. I've otherwise been a good employee and done many things above and beyond the call of duty so i was really hoping they would keep me!Do not, what ever you do f
k them about again.(and I think you owe them big time for keeping your disloyal ass and if they say jump from this point forward you need to ask "how high, for how long, and is there anything you would like me to do whilst i'm up here...?")
Would there be any downsides to posting the contents of the email they sent, with names etc deleted?
What your new 'nearly' employer has done leaves them in a very poor position. The medical is usually a require,net of the company health scheme so I am guessing their insurance company wouldn't insure you or they wanted a very high premium.
This has probably never happened to them before. As to whether under the equality act they could or should have made 'reasonable adjustment' could only be discovered by tribunal. I don't think you want to go there...expensive and probably not worth it.
I would ask for your expenses, yes for sure.
if you do want to go further, then seek real legal advice, and start with a data disclosure request for all the information they have on file including the interview notes and the medical report.
This has probably never happened to them before. As to whether under the equality act they could or should have made 'reasonable adjustment' could only be discovered by tribunal. I don't think you want to go there...expensive and probably not worth it.
I would ask for your expenses, yes for sure.
if you do want to go further, then seek real legal advice, and start with a data disclosure request for all the information they have on file including the interview notes and the medical report.
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