Afew issues with my GT3 .....
Discussion
So I've had my 2008 Model year 997 GT3 for 4 months (purchased from OPC Mid Sussex) and done about 1,500 miles in her (now showing 19,600 miles in total) and she is quite lovely!
However, when I first got her home I noticed a few niggles that I wasn't expecting, so I contacted the dealer and made them aware of a couple of small niggles and as the months went on - the list grew.
The list was:
1. The Instrument pack rattles (constantly on rougher roads).
2. Suspension squeaks (after a fast run in warmer weather) or clonks over bigger bumps.
3. Rear brakes squeal when hot.
4. After using either window, they are left smeared in grease.
5. Tailpipe rusting and paint flaking off (not what I expect when buying from a Porsche Dealer)!
6. Windscreen wipers both shot (I discovered this when driving home after picking up the car).
7. Car occasionally hesitates between 2,000 and 3,000 rpm (using a wide throttle opening after a mix of fast running and gentle cruising). I pointed out it probably needs a new MAF.
8. Windscreen seal trapping water on the nearside (I lifted the edge to clean off some polish and a whole load ran out. Does it every time it rains).
9. Geometry check - meant to have been carried out before I collected the car originally as I noticed a slight tendency to pull to the left. I asked for the orginal print out and for it to be rechecked as it felt like the rear needed more toe in for stability at speed.
Last week it went back and to give the salesman, his due - he did a 160 mile round trip to collect the car and brought it back a week later.
In this process I spoke to their service team and they couldn't find any problems with the suspension ("they all clonk sir") or any other aspect of the car, except the wipers that they replaced FOC.
Car retuned with no fuel left in it (perhaps I should have expected that) and all they had done was wash it (badly), replace the wipers, and do a minor oil and filter service that I asked them to do (but didn't stamp the service book in the glovebox) ....
So my questions are:
1. Am I being ludicrously picky or unreasonable?
2. Am I being fobbed off by the dealer?
3. Has anyone got the contact details for Graham Lightfoot, Porsche GB's new GM for "Ownership" so that I can make a complaint?
All thoughts / comments appreciated! MM.
However, when I first got her home I noticed a few niggles that I wasn't expecting, so I contacted the dealer and made them aware of a couple of small niggles and as the months went on - the list grew.
The list was:
1. The Instrument pack rattles (constantly on rougher roads).
2. Suspension squeaks (after a fast run in warmer weather) or clonks over bigger bumps.
3. Rear brakes squeal when hot.
4. After using either window, they are left smeared in grease.
5. Tailpipe rusting and paint flaking off (not what I expect when buying from a Porsche Dealer)!
6. Windscreen wipers both shot (I discovered this when driving home after picking up the car).
7. Car occasionally hesitates between 2,000 and 3,000 rpm (using a wide throttle opening after a mix of fast running and gentle cruising). I pointed out it probably needs a new MAF.
8. Windscreen seal trapping water on the nearside (I lifted the edge to clean off some polish and a whole load ran out. Does it every time it rains).
9. Geometry check - meant to have been carried out before I collected the car originally as I noticed a slight tendency to pull to the left. I asked for the orginal print out and for it to be rechecked as it felt like the rear needed more toe in for stability at speed.
Last week it went back and to give the salesman, his due - he did a 160 mile round trip to collect the car and brought it back a week later.
In this process I spoke to their service team and they couldn't find any problems with the suspension ("they all clonk sir") or any other aspect of the car, except the wipers that they replaced FOC.
Car retuned with no fuel left in it (perhaps I should have expected that) and all they had done was wash it (badly), replace the wipers, and do a minor oil and filter service that I asked them to do (but didn't stamp the service book in the glovebox) ....
So my questions are:
1. Am I being ludicrously picky or unreasonable?
2. Am I being fobbed off by the dealer?
3. Has anyone got the contact details for Graham Lightfoot, Porsche GB's new GM for "Ownership" so that I can make a complaint?
All thoughts / comments appreciated! MM.
Edited by MadMark911 on Wednesday 31st October 11:21
I have the issue of both windows smearing on both RSs. Also interesting that the sills are wet if the car is left out in the rain with windows closed.
I do get the odd suspension clonk and also a sort of Sproing sound in the steering at very low speed full lock.
No rettles I can think of (both cars bought new,first onme five years old). No rust on exhaust or anywhere else.
Dealer sounds poor to me given your experience.
I do get the odd suspension clonk and also a sort of Sproing sound in the steering at very low speed full lock.
No rettles I can think of (both cars bought new,first onme five years old). No rust on exhaust or anywhere else.
Dealer sounds poor to me given your experience.
GT2 windows get a line of grease when opening and so did my 996 Turbo so assume normal.
If you are getting knocking i would suggest suspension bushes perished most likely on its originals.
Corrosion is certainly a no no on these cars, never know that on a 996 unless its had a replacement in its time and painted by a monkey.
If you are getting knocking i would suggest suspension bushes perished most likely on its originals.
Corrosion is certainly a no no on these cars, never know that on a 996 unless its had a replacement in its time and painted by a monkey.
I had some front suspension squeaks on my 08 GT3. They seemed much worse in the wet. Took it to my opc who fixed it under warranty, top mounts I think they said it was.
My instrument cluster always made a bit of noise, I jammed a tiny piece of black card in near a gap at the top and that shut it up.
Also had streaky windows, I just kept cleaning them and eventually it seemed to go away.
My instrument cluster always made a bit of noise, I jammed a tiny piece of black card in near a gap at the top and that shut it up.
Also had streaky windows, I just kept cleaning them and eventually it seemed to go away.
Mine does all of those things apart from the banging suspension (bushes shot at 4 yrs - 20k miles though?), hesitation and pulling to the left.
I put it down to the crashy nature of the suspension/ stiffness of the car, so it doesn't bother me.
Smearing windows - my C2S did it as well - as said, suspect it is silicone applied to stop the "water repelling" coating on the side glass from squealing against the rubbers.
Yes, you are being too fussy ;-)
I put it down to the crashy nature of the suspension/ stiffness of the car, so it doesn't bother me.
Smearing windows - my C2S did it as well - as said, suspect it is silicone applied to stop the "water repelling" coating on the side glass from squealing against the rubbers.
Yes, you are being too fussy ;-)
Edited by nsm3 on Wednesday 31st October 12:57
Wow - that's some list! Can't believe an OPC let a car like that out of the gate.
> Suspension woes almost certainly top mounts - a common issue, and definitely a warranty fix, as is
> Tailpipe rusting - a straight swap for a new one.
> Instrument cluster - this happens on my '05 C2s and I found it was the steering column rubbing on the underside of the cluster. I jammed a paper napkin in there. Sorted.
> Hesitation - aside from the MAF, could be a faulty potentiometer (electronic throttle)
> Brake squeal - could be that the shims were missed when the pads were replaced (and missed in the 11-point check?!)
Not sure about the others, but the combined total of the above, plus window smears, windscreen seal, return with no fuel and a crap wash et al, would have me fuming at a car only 4 months out of an OPC.
No, you're not being picky - you expect and deserve a high standard of both prep and after sales care given the amount you've stumped up for your POJ.
Go and give them both barrels...
> Suspension woes almost certainly top mounts - a common issue, and definitely a warranty fix, as is
> Tailpipe rusting - a straight swap for a new one.
> Instrument cluster - this happens on my '05 C2s and I found it was the steering column rubbing on the underside of the cluster. I jammed a paper napkin in there. Sorted.
> Hesitation - aside from the MAF, could be a faulty potentiometer (electronic throttle)
> Brake squeal - could be that the shims were missed when the pads were replaced (and missed in the 11-point check?!)
Not sure about the others, but the combined total of the above, plus window smears, windscreen seal, return with no fuel and a crap wash et al, would have me fuming at a car only 4 months out of an OPC.
No, you're not being picky - you expect and deserve a high standard of both prep and after sales care given the amount you've stumped up for your POJ.
Go and give them both barrels...
MadMark911 said:
Thanks all .... 
As for next steps - well I've given them a chance to put it right - so I won't be going back to that dealership (it's too far away anyway) - I'm going to find someone senior at Porsche GB in Reading (I work in Reading) ....
mark i had all the same issues. pain in the ass getting it sorted but deal direct with the dealer rather than call porsche reading. I wasted sooooo much time speaking to them its totally pointlessAs for next steps - well I've given them a chance to put it right - so I won't be going back to that dealership (it's too far away anyway) - I'm going to find someone senior at Porsche GB in Reading (I work in Reading) ....
911god said:
mark i had all the same issues. pain in the ass getting it sorted but deal direct with the dealer rather than call porsche reading. I wasted sooooo much time speaking to them its totally pointless
Hi 911god - can you elaborate a bit? Who did you speak to in Reading and what were your issues? PM me if you would prefer it. mrdemon said:
most 5 year old GT3's have the same issues, it seems no one is spening the money on them on a refresh after 5 years.
I now see a few in the for sale section which have had 6k+ spent but it's rare on 997's to have had the money spent.
But charging premium money! I now feel as if I've been "fobbed off" by the dealer .... I now see a few in the for sale section which have had 6k+ spent but it's rare on 997's to have had the money spent.
Hmmm - don't know if my stuff is but a few minor niggles (at this stage) - but it's worrying!
I own a 997 C4S but as you are asking a general opinion let me address your list one by one:
1. The Instrument pack rattles (constantly on rougher roads).
-> Can get very annoying indeed, not uncommon, would expect this to be fixed by OPC asap, how easy is it to replicate?
2. Suspension squeaks (after a fast run in warmer weather) or clonks over bigger bumps.
-> Hard to say, depends on how easy it is to replicate to show the OPC techs.
3. Rear brakes squeal when hot.
-> I've often seen GT3s with squealy brakes, normal (ish)?
4. After using either window, they are left smeared in grease.
-> Same on my 997, normal (but annoying).
5. Tailpipe rusting and paint flaking off (not what I expect when buying from a Porsche Dealer)!
-> Didn't you spot this at delivery? Still, if you can show it to OPC then they should replace as part of 'immaculate' presentation, bit trickier now after 4 months though.
6. Windscreen wipers both shot (I discovered this when driving home after picking up the car).
-> Poor, I hope you pointed it out asap? Gives a better slant to 'car not well prepped' angle when discussing some of the other issues.
7. Car occasionally hesitates between 2,000 and 3,000 rpm (using a wide throttle opening after a mix of fast running and gentle cruising). I pointed out it probably needs a new MAF.
-> Again, how easy can you replicate this? Should be warranty work.
8. Windscreen seal trapping water on the nearside (I lifted the edge to clean off some polish and a whole load ran out. Does it every time it rains).
-> Don't quite get whats happening on this one
9. Geometry check - meant to have been carried out before I collected the car originally as I noticed a slight tendency to pull to the left. I asked for the orginal print out and for it to be rechecked as it felt like the rear needed more toe in for stability at speed.
-> Take it to an independent (CoG?) for a proper job. FWIW my 997 was prepared by another OPC in 2010 and when I bought it in 2012 settings were still ok
In this process I spoke to their service team and they couldn't find any problems with the suspension ("they all clonk sir") or any other aspect of the car, except the wipers that they replaced FOC.
Didn't stamp the service book in the glovebox
-> Is this a scheduled service or something extra for your piece of mind? If former then very annoying, if extra then understandable, hope they gave you the receipt at least?
So my questions are:
1. Am I being ludicrously picky or unreasonable?
-> Maybe a bit picky but its understandable given that Porsche trumpet their approved scheme as having cars which are near perfect so its what one comes to expect and is willing to pay a bit more for that service/quality.
2. Am I being fobbed off by the dealer?
-> Yes, although personally I would have taken the car there in person rather than let the salesman do it. I think that to get the best results you have to be there in person being polite yet demanding.
1. The Instrument pack rattles (constantly on rougher roads).
-> Can get very annoying indeed, not uncommon, would expect this to be fixed by OPC asap, how easy is it to replicate?
2. Suspension squeaks (after a fast run in warmer weather) or clonks over bigger bumps.
-> Hard to say, depends on how easy it is to replicate to show the OPC techs.
3. Rear brakes squeal when hot.
-> I've often seen GT3s with squealy brakes, normal (ish)?
4. After using either window, they are left smeared in grease.
-> Same on my 997, normal (but annoying).
5. Tailpipe rusting and paint flaking off (not what I expect when buying from a Porsche Dealer)!
-> Didn't you spot this at delivery? Still, if you can show it to OPC then they should replace as part of 'immaculate' presentation, bit trickier now after 4 months though.
6. Windscreen wipers both shot (I discovered this when driving home after picking up the car).
-> Poor, I hope you pointed it out asap? Gives a better slant to 'car not well prepped' angle when discussing some of the other issues.
7. Car occasionally hesitates between 2,000 and 3,000 rpm (using a wide throttle opening after a mix of fast running and gentle cruising). I pointed out it probably needs a new MAF.
-> Again, how easy can you replicate this? Should be warranty work.
8. Windscreen seal trapping water on the nearside (I lifted the edge to clean off some polish and a whole load ran out. Does it every time it rains).
-> Don't quite get whats happening on this one
9. Geometry check - meant to have been carried out before I collected the car originally as I noticed a slight tendency to pull to the left. I asked for the orginal print out and for it to be rechecked as it felt like the rear needed more toe in for stability at speed.
-> Take it to an independent (CoG?) for a proper job. FWIW my 997 was prepared by another OPC in 2010 and when I bought it in 2012 settings were still ok
In this process I spoke to their service team and they couldn't find any problems with the suspension ("they all clonk sir") or any other aspect of the car, except the wipers that they replaced FOC.
Didn't stamp the service book in the glovebox
-> Is this a scheduled service or something extra for your piece of mind? If former then very annoying, if extra then understandable, hope they gave you the receipt at least?
So my questions are:
1. Am I being ludicrously picky or unreasonable?
-> Maybe a bit picky but its understandable given that Porsche trumpet their approved scheme as having cars which are near perfect so its what one comes to expect and is willing to pay a bit more for that service/quality.
2. Am I being fobbed off by the dealer?
-> Yes, although personally I would have taken the car there in person rather than let the salesman do it. I think that to get the best results you have to be there in person being polite yet demanding.
911god said:
mark i had all the same issues. pain in the ass getting it sorted but deal direct with the dealer rather than call porsche reading. I wasted sooooo much time speaking to them its totally pointless
Agreed +1.Porsche GB are as much use as a chocolate fire guard.
From experience, Mid Sussex have always been pretty good but if its a PITA, ask if you can take it to one of their other dealerships... from memory Solihull, Silverstone, Edinburgh....
Good luck getting it sorted, but it doesn't sound like anything too much out of the ordinary for a GT3 to be honest.
MadMark911 said:
Windscreen seal trapping water on the nearside (I lifted the edge to clean off some polish and a whole load ran out. Does it every time it rains).
I can offer you help with this, at least cast a professional eye on it. I get out and about - happy to pass by one day on my travels. mrdemon said:
most 5 year old GT3's have the same issues, it seems no one is spening the money on them on a refresh after 5 years.
I now see a few in the for sale section which have had 6k+ spent but it's rare on 997's to have had the money spent.
I recon the problem is that as service schedules are every 2yrs on 997's as opposed to yearly on 996's the cars have now suffered badly as a result and at 5/6yrs old they need sorting.I now see a few in the for sale section which have had 6k+ spent but it's rare on 997's to have had the money spent.
All most would have done is spent minimum on them at an opc who with all due respect are not specialists on gt3's so they won't dedicate extra time on a car that is made to be tracked and has been.
I suspect gt3's to most opc's are not really what they want to be seeing.
Fat stockbroker with turbo/cayenne/Panamera etc is far easier to deal with and won't ask any questions. If you were an opc with tons of natural business what would you chose.
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