Ferrari's Dominance
Discussion
So Ferrari wrapped up their SIXTH CONSECUTIVE constructors championship in Hungary which got me thinking...
I was a massive Ferrari fan in the early/mid nineties in the days of Alesi, Berger and V12 Scarlet-painted racing cars. All I ever wanted was for Ferrari to win again...Berger's win at Hockenheim '94 and particularly Alesi's one and only victory at Montreal '95 were truly wonderful occasions.
Now admittedly I was never a Schumacher fan but I always respected his talent (and still do). However I think that in becoming competitive Ferrari have lost some of what made them different from the rest.
Cars that aren't truly red, V10s like everyone else, its more the FIAT works team badged as Ferrari than the Scuderia i knew and loved. Instead of passion there seems to be steely determination
Anybody else got a similar (or different) view?
I was a massive Ferrari fan in the early/mid nineties in the days of Alesi, Berger and V12 Scarlet-painted racing cars. All I ever wanted was for Ferrari to win again...Berger's win at Hockenheim '94 and particularly Alesi's one and only victory at Montreal '95 were truly wonderful occasions.
Now admittedly I was never a Schumacher fan but I always respected his talent (and still do). However I think that in becoming competitive Ferrari have lost some of what made them different from the rest.
Cars that aren't truly red, V10s like everyone else, its more the FIAT works team badged as Ferrari than the Scuderia i knew and loved. Instead of passion there seems to be steely determination
Anybody else got a similar (or different) view?
Eric Mc said:
Agree.
Passion and incompetence is far more interesting than success and efficiency.
lol thats one way of putting it
Its just that in those days the teams had identity.
Ferrari = Bright red screaming V12s
Williams = Distinctive Renault V10s
Benetton = Raised Nose and Growling Ford V8s.
...well in '94 anyway...
And with the drivers thrown in with their own personalities, it made actual teams and entities to affiliate with.
Today i just feel that to be a Williams supporter is to wear a blue cap, to be a Ferrari one its a red cap. And if it wasn't for that we wouldn't know the difference
agree up to a point and I'm obviously a long term Ferrari fan (ever since I saw a 250GTO on the cover of a magazine as the Le Mans winner)
I miss the V12s but have read somewhere that the FIA won't allow Ferrari or Toyota to develop them due to the cost but I think if your company makes them then why not ?
Ferrari have always been the sleeping giant and now that they seem to have their act together everyone is squawking that the racing is boring..well not from where I stand
I think the dominance comes from stability, and that is team stability, not driver stability. If you look at the team they have all been there fro some time but most of the others are relatively new, so MS and RB could go to BAR and not be half as successful.
McLaren are the odd team out here as I see their team as stable but they have the wrong engine manufacturer (just look at how many engines KR has killed in the last few years) and their chassis have fallen by the wayside trying for that elusive innovation that will leap Ferrari.
Williams have 2 drivers destroying the good work of the engineers.
Renault are the next WCs for my money if Ferrari fall off the podium
BAR are only just putting together a team that isn't influenced by that idiot JV and are showing the benefit for it with the extra money.
Of course I would like to see Webber do well next year but think it will take at least a year for Williams to come good and some team spirit to return
I miss the V12s but have read somewhere that the FIA won't allow Ferrari or Toyota to develop them due to the cost but I think if your company makes them then why not ?
Ferrari have always been the sleeping giant and now that they seem to have their act together everyone is squawking that the racing is boring..well not from where I stand
I think the dominance comes from stability, and that is team stability, not driver stability. If you look at the team they have all been there fro some time but most of the others are relatively new, so MS and RB could go to BAR and not be half as successful.
McLaren are the odd team out here as I see their team as stable but they have the wrong engine manufacturer (just look at how many engines KR has killed in the last few years) and their chassis have fallen by the wayside trying for that elusive innovation that will leap Ferrari.
Williams have 2 drivers destroying the good work of the engineers.
Renault are the next WCs for my money if Ferrari fall off the podium
BAR are only just putting together a team that isn't influenced by that idiot JV and are showing the benefit for it with the extra money.
Of course I would like to see Webber do well next year but think it will take at least a year for Williams to come good and some team spirit to return
i agree to some of what your saying, but the spectacle, whoever you support has diminished considerably.I think this is a true statement as theres not normally smoke without fire....at present there are huge numbers of people,including Mr Ecclestone, moaning at the lack of racing.Time will tell, and if the same sort of thing happens next season one thing is guarenteed, it isn't going to do F1 and motorsport any good,only harm.I for one would like to see drastic changes, if only to save the whole thing, any changes....just address the complaints......pleeease.
308gt4 said:
I miss the V12s but have read somewhere that the FIA won't allow Ferrari or Toyota to develop them due to the cost but I think if your company makes them then why not ?
I think it was a rule put decided funnily enough by the engine manufacturers to protect their investments.
When they started getting close to the optimum output from the V10, Ferrari and Toyota started conisdering V12s, it looked as is you could get more from them easier than from eeking out the last dregs from a 3.0 V10 so they were investigating and I think the engine suppliers didn't want to have to start over again and spend money on a V12.
Therefore a rule was rushed through to permit only 3.0 V10s. Which stinks in my book. At one point the late Harvey Poselthwaite made the point that a V8 could have put out decent power with loads of flexibility if engine manufacturers had put the time and money into them they had put into the v10s.
It was just another area for differnce in performances. V8s good on twisty tracks, V12s on fast tracks. Another thing that doesn't help overtaking
Eric Mc said:
H16
Oh for such variety again
Ah the BRM H16!
Never a success but i just love the fact that they *tried* it. Apparantly Tony Rudd used to rue the fact he didn't go for a V12 instead, wonderiing if the DFV would have been such a success if he had!
and the old BRM V16. What a wonderful noise, the revs they were pulling with that in the 50's is impressive IMHO.
just realised the H16 is a prime example of "passion and incompetence"
>> Edited by jimmyc412t2 on Tuesday 17th August 10:31
I don't think F1 has lost it's passion as such, as it still has the following, if not more in numbers, as it has before.
All that has happened, is that is has moved with the times, and with technology.
This proves, as stated before, that stability within the teams helps the team to win. Steady development and progress with dedicated individuals, has led to the total package that is Ferrari, to dominate.
I still think it's in the interest of the other teams to buck up their ideas, than slate Ferrari at the job they're doing. Let's face it, they're in the business to win, and winning is what they're doing.
All IMHO of course
All that has happened, is that is has moved with the times, and with technology.
This proves, as stated before, that stability within the teams helps the team to win. Steady development and progress with dedicated individuals, has led to the total package that is Ferrari, to dominate.
I still think it's in the interest of the other teams to buck up their ideas, than slate Ferrari at the job they're doing. Let's face it, they're in the business to win, and winning is what they're doing.
All IMHO of course
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