Upgrade time! Need help from the big power guys!

[JBliss]

Hi All

Since my 5 speed Gbox gave up, im biting the bullet and upgrading lots of stuff. I would have searched as i know this has all been covered before, but the bloody search is down!

Im putting in a 6 speed box, with m400 linkage and Tuxman shifter linkage.
What kind of money am i looking at to have the gearbox uprated and cooler unions put on?
What clutch are you guys using? Im looking for something to handle 550bhp ultimately
Is anyone using the fidanza flywheel. If so does anyone have a part number

Now for Turbo stuff!
Since im going for 450bhp first, then 550 after a year or so, what are the thoughts on t28 hybrids vs GT2860rs? I know this is debated alot, But is it worth just doing it once properly and going for the gt28rs?


Thanks for any help!

[Gadgeroonie]

dont forget to fit longer rods / forged pistons / uprated valve springs / ported head / stonger clutch / bigger injectors / bigger intercooler / bigger fuel pump

[sundance002]

JBliss said:

Hi All

Since my 5 speed Gbox gave up, im biting the bullet and upgrading lots of stuff. I would have searched as i know this has all been covered before, but the bloody search is down!

Im putting in a 6 speed box, with m400 linkage and Tuxman shifter linkage.
What kind of money am i looking at to have the gearbox uprated and cooler unions put on?
What clutch are you guys using? Im looking for something to handle 550bhp ultimately
Is anyone using the fidanza flywheel. If so does anyone have a part number

Now for Turbo stuff!
Since im going for 450bhp first, then 550 after a year or so, what are the thoughts on t28 hybrids vs GT2860rs? I know this is debated alot, But is it worth just doing it once properly and going for the gt28rs?


Thanks for any help!

Hi J. iimo 550 is a good place to stop, I ran that power on T28s that were uprated, but also changed valve springs and larger injectors, you will also need fuel pump, Helix clutch worked fine for me and the fly wheel is ok, you will need oil cooler and best to tun with thermostat, Don't expect change out of 15k as you will need to uprate the brakes to, then the IC oil breather it's a long list. The gearbox and cooler mods around 1500 turbos 1000 to uprate the T28s .

[sundance002]

Gadgeroonie said:

dont forget to fit longer rods / forged pistons / uprated valve springs / ported head / stonger clutch / bigger injectors / bigger intercooler / bigger fuel pump

Yep and them

[GTO600]

Julian, if you want to do it all properly then be prepared to spend more than the value of the car as it stands assuming you have a working gearbox!

[951]

JBliss said:

Hi All

Since my 5 speed Gbox gave up, im biting the bullet and upgrading lots of stuff. I would have searched as i know this has all been covered before, but the bloody search is down!

Im putting in a 6 speed box, with m400 linkage and Tuxman shifter linkage.
What kind of money am i looking at to have the gearbox uprated and cooler unions put on?
What clutch are you guys using? Im looking for something to handle 550bhp ultimately
Is anyone using the fidanza flywheel. If so does anyone have a part number

Now for Turbo stuff!
Since im going for 450bhp first, then 550 after a year or so, what are the thoughts on t28 hybrids vs GT2860rs? I know this is debated alot, But is it worth just doing it once properly and going for the gt28rs?

Thanks for any help!

I have the Helix 6 paddle clutch and updated pressure plate - it's great, not too heavy and still nice to drive. Don't forget to renew the slave at the same time.

I also have the fidanza flywheel - that's great too. The correct part no is 186251.

For 550 you will need forged pistons but you don't need longer rods. Also go to HD bearings at the same time.

As for turbos, I don't think you can go wrong with GT2860RS's - even if you don't use all the power potential they are still worth it for the spool up. Much, much better than tweaked T28's. More expensive though.

I'd check the manifolds too...

IMHO do it once, do it right

Regards

Graham

[Gadgeroonie]

graham - where did you get the pistons from ?

[951]

Jetstream - I think they are from Mountune and they work with the original 3/3R Arrow rods.

This is the usual forged upgrade path for a non M400 car, otherwise if you use M400 type pistons you need both pistons and rods, and those longer rods are very expensive so it works out at about double the cost.

Edited by 951 on Thursday 7th June 07:32

[andygtt]

go for the GT25RS's instead of the GT28RS's... adrian has the smaller turbos and they spool up earlier than your current car yet still let the car rev to 8000rpm.

the larger turbos are needed if you want 600bhp.

as for mods... with these turbos, some valve springs, injectors and a cam timing change you should see your 450 target nicely but you will need the stronger box.

Regarding box, 6 speed will be 250, mods to box including LSD will be 1800, fitenza flywheel 300, clutch 800 including mods (uses a different one to 5 speed so all new is required), new engine mounts 200 (I made a couple of mine), starter 250, bearing 250, gearlevel and cables 650 (think tuxmans bits adds 2-300 to this), passenger wishbone (I modified my own).

I've done the 5 speed to 6 speed conversion on my car and actually have quite a few of the parts you need, clutch, bearing, starter, even a lightened stock flywheel... could save you a fortune.

[951]

andygtt said:

go for the GT25RS's instead of the GT28RS's... adrian has the smaller turbos and they spool up earlier than your current car yet still let the car rev to 8000rpm.

the larger turbos are needed if you want 600bhp.

I looked into this when I did mine - I really fancied the idea of the GT25RS's, and if I had stuck to my original 500bhp plan then I'd have gone for them.

However, although they will probably do 550, at that power I was advised they will be working much harder and charge temps will be a fair bit higher.

The GT25RS's will obviously spool a bit faster, but Universal thought there would only be about 200 rpm in it - My GT2860RS's make 1bar of boost at just over 3,000rpm.

[Adrian W]

951 said:

I looked into this when I did mine - I really fancied the idea of the GT25RS's, and if I had stuck to my original 500bhp plan then I'd have gone for them.

However, although they will probably do 550, at that power I was advised they will be working much harder and charge temps will be a fair bit higher.

The GT25RS's will obviously spool a bit faster, but Universal thought there would only be about 200 rpm in it - My GT2860RS's make 1bar of boost at just over 3,000rpm.

Its 500 RPM and they make 585 but! they do have to work much harder

[951]

Adrian W said:

Its 500 RPM and they make 585 but! they do have to work much harder

Ok, so you have 1bar boost at just over 2,500rpm? Nice!

I had to go with Universal's advice - still pleased with the 2860's though.

The other factor I wasn't too sure about was that I expected Yellowshed to be capping the torque lower down anyway so would spooling a bit lower down actually make any difference....still don't know, but happy to have kept some heat out of the engine at full whack.

[andygtt]

peak torque is at around 5500rpm on our cars I think although you can vary that to be higher up the rev range by boost control.

so spooling up early will just give you more power down low at no expense up top if your goal is 550bhp.

take your point about the heat and the 28's being bloody good anyhow... Id def go for the GT's and not even consider the T28's as they are leagues ahead, would make it a different engine... twice the price though!

[951]

Yes, I was just rethinking the lower spool effect and the revs are so low at the minimum that it can't be a problem.

I guess the GT25's may still kick in faster when booted from part throttle at mid-highish revs, but I can't say I've noticed any lag under those conditions with the 2860's either.

No matter which way you go though, the GT's are well worth it IMO.

Adrian, I have heard people describe your power delivery as almost NA like, but I didn't realise you also had 585ish at the top end!

[R0162]

There is only one way to find out...



gt25rs vs gt2860rs..next silverstone track day

[951]

You're just missing you know who, Chris...

[sundance002]

I never had a prob running 550. on 28s atbh the way it was maped was perfect it had no lag and never had a big heat issues,
Had loads of torque from 2000 rpm and still gave 1bar of boost, it blew a hole in my inter cooler, I felt the delivery was smoother on the 28s than the GTRs28, I had .7 actuators with my 28s

[Gadgeroonie]

R0162 said:

There is only one way to find out...



gt25rs vs gt2860rs..next silverstone track day

get them all on a Dyno on the same day !

[Fett]

Gadgeroonie said:

get them all on a Dyno on the same day !

A noble dyno day sounds like a great idea! Would love to know what my standard 3R is actually putting out.

Anybody fancy it? Do you think Track n Road would entertain the idea?

[playalistic]

Fett said:

A noble dyno day sounds like a great idea! Would love to know what my standard 3R is actually putting out.

Anybody fancy it? Do you think Track n Road would entertain the idea?

+1 I'd be up for that, although mine is a little weedy but still