So, this financial mess we're in...

[Megaflow]

So, if I have got this right it goes something like this:

1) Western Governments massively overspend each and every year running up huge debts
2) Politicians too busy looking to get re-elected at the next election than dealing with the long term problem
3) Markets get twitchy at levels of debt and start selling left right and centre
4) Public get nervous about the future and stop spending
5) Tax income falls due to reduced spending
6) Governments borrow more to cover tax shortfall
7) Go to 1...

Does anybody really see where this is going to end.

I was too young to care/be interested during the last recession.

But, this time round, I am really starting to struggle to see where the light at the end of the tunnel is.

[hesnotthemessiah]

All of the above.

Except I guess UK Governments only ever think in four year time plans.

[Ozzie Osmond]

Megaflow said:

Does anybody really see where this is going to end.

Two possibilities IMO. Either,

• An outbreak of common sense (uncomfortable but surviveable), or
• Collapse in the value of money (very nasty all round).

I'm betting on the former because the latter is hopefully unthinkable.

[Megaflow]

It's really starting to bother me to. Something is going to (needs to) happen, just what and how ugly it gets remains to be seen.

PS: Any mod care to correct the typo in the title please...

[tonym911]

Ozzie Osmond said:

Collapse in the corrupting influence of money (very nice all round)

EFA

[thinfourth2]

Megaflow said:

So, if I have got this right it goes something like this:

1) Western Governments massively overspend each and every year running up huge debts
2) Politicians too busy looking to get re-elected at the next election than dealing with the long term problem

Yes a system where we give power crazy self important idiots the worlds biggest creditcard to use to make themselves more important and powerful.

And no one can see why it all went a bit wrong

These idiots were borrowing money like there is no tomorrow to bribe us to vote for them. But for them there is no tomorrow as they bog off to a nice directership or into europe. So we get to pay the bill.

People think democracy is a good idea

Its a st idea

Give me a nice dictator any day of the week. The problem is finding a nice dictator

[tonym911]

Institutions like the EU are the products of pure conceit and a selfish need for individuals to carve their names in history. The only reasons it's being kicked up the road like a dead horse now are pride and a refusal to accept that it's just wrong.

[thinfourth2]

tonym911 said:

Institutions like the EU are the products of pure conceit and a selfish need for individuals to carve their names in history. The only reasons it's being kicked up the road like a dead horse now are pride and a refusal to accept that it's just wrong.

No the reason it keeps going is it gives MEPs more personnel power and money

They don't give a st if we all end up homeless as long as they stay rich and powerful

[derestrictor]

[redacted]

[ujio]

Looking at the markets it could be 09 all over again (or far far worse).

However, some clever people will be keeping their heads whilst everyone else is losing there's.
There is an opportunity here. Question is, when do you time it?!

I'm talking about going long.


EDITS: OOPPPS! posted in wrong thread.

Edited by ujio on Friday 5th August 09:35

[tonym911]

ujio said:

Looking at the markets it could be 09 all over again (or far far worse).

However, some clever people will be keeping their heads whilst everyone else is losing there's.
There is an opportunity here. Question is, when do you time it?!

I'm talking about going long.


EDITS: OOPPPS! posted in wrong thread.

Edited by ujio on Friday 5th August 09:35

You're talking about betting on almost universal misery.

[Caulkhead]

bus pass said:

So, is it a case of run for the hills, or a case of nothing to see here, nothing to worry about?

Meh, I've moved into gold, shotguns and canned food. Ready for the collapse and the coming of the walking dead.

[baz1985]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

In terms of playing with the banking stuff, it's always good to give consideration to when individuals such as Barroso are about to speak!

[tonym911]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

What damage, if any, would it do to abolish stock markets? More to the point, what benefits would stock market abolition bring to ordinary people? Not being subjected to the consequences of disgusting 'gremlin' activity like this seems reason enough on its own. On the pros and cons sheet what really is the reason for its continued existence (other than the obvious one of making money for a tiny percentage of the world's population at the cost of misery for the majority)?

[simonej]

Caulkhead said:

Meh, I've moved into gold, shotguns and canned food. Ready for the collapse and the coming of the walking dead.

People say this, but is it in jest or are there people genuinely stocking up on tinned food, shotguns and shells? I've been fancying a new shotgun for a while and this seems like the perfect way of justifying it...

[JagLover]

bus pass said:

But are we on the cusp of the st really, really hitting the fan in a simular fashion to that of the 1930's?

This is a depression not a recession, and on a worldwide basis the last was indeed the 1930s.

The scale of this depression has been concealed by massive fiscal and monetary stimulus, but now the governments cannot go on borrowing more and more and further monetary stimulus runs the risk of increasing inflation.

This is in contrast to the policy responses of the 1930s. However it should be bourne in mind(given that our memories of the depression come mainly for America) that Britain weathered the 1930s depression rather better than it is doing this one. It is not clear how running such massive deficits is going to return us to sustainable growth anytime soon. Perhaps if the money had been spent on infrastructure projects the story might be different. But just paying to keep public sector non-jobbers working away in their unproductive roles achieves nothing.

[Bluebarge]

tonym911 said:

Institutions like the EU are the products of pure conceit and a selfish need for individuals to carve their names in history. The only reasons it's being kicked up the road like a dead horse now are pride and a refusal to accept that it's just wrong.

Nothing fundamentally wrong with the EU - it's kept Europe at peace for the longest time since the Roman Empire. What's wrong is the half-way house of the Euro - you can't have a single currency without a single fiscal policy; this is why it's going tits.

As for the US, that's the due to the conflict between most Americans' desire for small govt (low taxes) and big spending (huge armed forces, NASA etc) - the 40% gap between govt spending and govt income cannot be bridged by Chinese borrowing forever.

[anonymous-user]

a good outcome would be the rise of a stateless society.

the state has been a good device for the last 500 years but it is time to go now.

[sa_20v]

Use Psychology said:

a good outcome would be the rise of a stateless society.

And that's the likely outcome, a lot more pain for the public sector as government debt measures REALLY kick in - and they have to. The big losers will be those morons who listened too much to the preachings of Robert Peston (a man not without his own agenda) and invested in canned food and guns.

[AJI]

Could all this market crash and soveriegn money troubles be a planned thing?

Could it be something that is paving the way towards a single global currency and a single global 'governmental power'?


One of the theories of the enforcing of a glabal taxation on CO2 was to give power to a few individuals over the entire planet.
Is this plan now seeing 'stage 2'?