Alfa 166 2.0, cost less than £1500 per year to maintain?
Discussion
Apologies for another topic, but I felt the question justified it. Basically in my other topic I have come to the conclusion that a £70 tank will get me approx 350 miles which is OK and the insurance at £700ish fully for me (a 21 year old) is reasonable and £3000 will get me a top condition model. I know Alfas are known to have their reliability issues, I just wondered what any 166 owners can shed on reliability, costs when things go wrong and general maintenance costs etc. I have done my homework to some extent elsewhere on the web and the general option seems to be its better built than a 156, not quite as pretty (which I can't make up my mind about) and that in all engine options (I'm after the 2.0) its a great car. I can only really spend up to £1500 per year keeping it working, is that a realistic figure?
Any help would be appreciated, apologies for sounding like a plank, this will be my first "decent" car and I want to get it right, thanks
Any help would be appreciated, apologies for sounding like a plank, this will be my first "decent" car and I want to get it right, thanks
Twin Spark is fine as long as you look after it so the OP needs to budget (say) £400 for a full belt service every 3 years/36,000 miles. In other years say £250 for a service - assuming mileage of around 20,000 a year. Other thing to include in your sums is tyres and road tax - I presume getting a pre-2001 car will help with the tax?
Yes. Am sure I pay less than that anyway.
As someone said on the other thread, if you are not doing many miles I would not dismiss the V6. You are basically looking at getting the car serviced on a yearly basis rather than a 12K miles basis, so you won't be getting the sort of wear and tear that others get. I expect both would be within your budget.
Lets say I had a 2.0 and got 30mpg rather than the 24mpg I get now. That is 25% better fuel economy. Every time I fill up the tank it costs me 60 quid, so knock 25% off that and it would cost me 48 quid. I commute 150 miles a week, so every 2 weeks I fill up and it costs me another 12 quid vs a 2.0, so I think it is costing me 6 quid per week (~300/yr) for the extra power and to listen to that V6 growl. If you are doing less miles, then the V6 premium will be less for you.
There are very few cars out there, so see what you can find. The 3.0 cars seem to come with more and better toys (auto wipers, cruise control, traction control) that other models may not have. I saw a rather nice 3.0 with 6 speed box when I was looking for mine, but it had a crack in the bumper and worse still for me it was silver with black interior I wanted dark paintwork (ended up with metallic blue) and cream leather interior. I was hoping for a 3l, and was hoping for the wooden steering wheel but am happy with my 2.5 with leather.
At the time I was hoping for a V6 on the grounds that the old V6 design was already being phased out and I wanted to have owned one.
Worst part of the car? For me it is the door handles. The chrome seems to bubble. Didn't even notice on my car until I had owned it a couple of weeks, but have since noticed it on other cars I have seen so it isn't just mine. Shame as the rest of the car is immaculate. I think this is balanced by the fact that the door mirrors are a Maserati part, which amuses me anyway
As for parts, basic service items (plugs, filters etc) seem OK in terms of cost as they are the same as other cars in the range. Only real shock I have had was 700 quid for a new radiator to be fitted due to it being a pig of a job so high labour costs. Thankfully you don't need them at all often.
As someone said on the other thread, if you are not doing many miles I would not dismiss the V6. You are basically looking at getting the car serviced on a yearly basis rather than a 12K miles basis, so you won't be getting the sort of wear and tear that others get. I expect both would be within your budget.
Lets say I had a 2.0 and got 30mpg rather than the 24mpg I get now. That is 25% better fuel economy. Every time I fill up the tank it costs me 60 quid, so knock 25% off that and it would cost me 48 quid. I commute 150 miles a week, so every 2 weeks I fill up and it costs me another 12 quid vs a 2.0, so I think it is costing me 6 quid per week (~300/yr) for the extra power and to listen to that V6 growl. If you are doing less miles, then the V6 premium will be less for you.
There are very few cars out there, so see what you can find. The 3.0 cars seem to come with more and better toys (auto wipers, cruise control, traction control) that other models may not have. I saw a rather nice 3.0 with 6 speed box when I was looking for mine, but it had a crack in the bumper and worse still for me it was silver with black interior
I wanted dark paintwork (ended up with metallic blue) and cream leather interior. I was hoping for a 3l, and was hoping for the wooden steering wheel but am happy with my 2.5 with leather.At the time I was hoping for a V6 on the grounds that the old V6 design was already being phased out and I wanted to have owned one.
Worst part of the car? For me it is the door handles. The chrome seems to bubble. Didn't even notice on my car until I had owned it a couple of weeks, but have since noticed it on other cars I have seen so it isn't just mine. Shame as the rest of the car is immaculate. I think this is balanced by the fact that the door mirrors are a Maserati part, which amuses me anyway
As for parts, basic service items (plugs, filters etc) seem OK in terms of cost as they are the same as other cars in the range. Only real shock I have had was 700 quid for a new radiator to be fitted due to it being a pig of a job so high labour costs. Thankfully you don't need them at all often.
Another thought prompted by sitting in a line of traffic for 20 mins:
The clutch on the manual V6 is not much fun for this. It is heavy, and my leg hurt. Thankfully for me I don't find myself in this situation very often. If your town mileage is stop-start, then the 2.0 clutch should be way lighter (my previous runabout was a 2.0 164 and that was fine). If I did a lot of this, I would probably swap the car to one with the auto box V6 (albeit again at a fuel economy penalty).
The clutch on the manual V6 is not much fun for this. It is heavy, and my leg hurt. Thankfully for me I don't find myself in this situation very often. If your town mileage is stop-start, then the 2.0 clutch should be way lighter (my previous runabout was a 2.0 164 and that was fine). If I did a lot of this, I would probably swap the car to one with the auto box V6 (albeit again at a fuel economy penalty).
I know what you mean about the clutch however
I cycle alot. I think the OP said he did to. so i don't think the clutch should be a problem. sometimes I'm lazy in the town and use the torque of the engine to start from second gear.
I don't see why you want an Alfa for the city? the T-spak will get you about 25mpg and the V6 about 20-23 These are engines that don't like beening cold.
All Alfas have rubbish turning circles.
when I take my 166 out of the city I feel its like somebody stretching after being stuck in a enclosed space for a long time.
however I feel my Puma suffers from Agoraphobia!
I cycle alot. I think the OP said he did to. so i don't think the clutch should be a problem. sometimes I'm lazy in the town and use the torque of the engine to start from second gear.
I don't see why you want an Alfa for the city? the T-spak will get you about 25mpg and the V6 about 20-23 These are engines that don't like beening cold.
All Alfas have rubbish turning circles.
when I take my 166 out of the city I feel its like somebody stretching after being stuck in a enclosed space for a long time.
however I feel my Puma suffers from Agoraphobia!
Amusingly I used to cycle a lot as well
My point was that owning an Alfa should be fun, and whilst I have no doubt that Sparks could cope with the heavy clutch I don't see how it would ever be fun.
V6 versions tend to have worse turning circles than the straight 4 as well.
Shame to lose the noise and the chrome pipes on the engine (both of which are an unending source of grins) but perhaps the 2.0 is a better car in this case?
Heck, they are all nice cars and we are kind of fiddling in the details here
My point was that owning an Alfa should be fun, and whilst I have no doubt that Sparks could cope with the heavy clutch I don't see how it would ever be fun.
V6 versions tend to have worse turning circles than the straight 4 as well.
Shame to lose the noise and the chrome pipes on the engine (both of which are an unending source of grins) but perhaps the 2.0 is a better car in this case?
Heck, they are all nice cars and we are kind of fiddling in the details here
I live 10 minutes away from the Dorset countryside, there are some great roads out there, trust me I can have fun
I'd say that 70% of my driving is done around town, the rest is out on longer journeys in the countryside, up to London etc.
The V6 sounds nice but it would cost me over £1000 to insure due to my age, whereas the 2.0 costs only £600-£700
I'd say that 70% of my driving is done around town, the rest is out on longer journeys in the countryside, up to London etc.
The V6 sounds nice but it would cost me over £1000 to insure due to my age, whereas the 2.0 costs only £600-£700
Edited by sparks87 on Thursday 3rd July 11:15
If I started with a 2.0 with my current 3 years no claims, in a year or two when I have more no claims I could upgrade to the bigger engine for a cheaper premium, but hopefully by then I could get a used 159
I just really don't want to be on a £1000+ policy again for a car especially seeing that I will be paying monthly. When I first passed nearly 4 years ago I had a 1.1 Fiesta and seriously the cheapest I could get it insured -and I looked everywhere- was £1400. I don't think I could justify that again, even for a car like an Alfa.
The small difference between the V6 Alfa running costs and 2.0 are pretty impressive though, if I could insure it at a good price I'd get the 2.5.
I just really don't want to be on a £1000+ policy again for a car especially seeing that I will be paying monthly. When I first passed nearly 4 years ago I had a 1.1 Fiesta and seriously the cheapest I could get it insured -and I looked everywhere- was £1400. I don't think I could justify that again, even for a car like an Alfa.
The small difference between the V6 Alfa running costs and 2.0 are pretty impressive though, if I could insure it at a good price I'd get the 2.5.
I have a 156 V6, not a 166, so don't know if that makes a difference with regards to the clutch, but being a laydeeeeeee I don't have any issues with a heavy clutch (just a heavy right foot....).
I too do around 7k a year mileage and have no issues with fuel economy etc.
£1500 sounds like a reasonable amount to be prepared to spend just in case - it should be less though.
How old are you if you don't mind me asking? (sorry if it's on here and I missed it) I'm 29 and have full NCB, but for me and MOH as a named driver, with Business Class also, costs £250!
I'm with Sky Insurance, and I also am a paid up member of a car club (although not an Alfa one) that gets some discount.
I too do around 7k a year mileage and have no issues with fuel economy etc.
£1500 sounds like a reasonable amount to be prepared to spend just in case - it should be less though.
How old are you if you don't mind me asking? (sorry if it's on here and I missed it) I'm 29 and have full NCB, but for me and MOH as a named driver, with Business Class also, costs £250!
I'm with Sky Insurance, and I also am a paid up member of a car club (although not an Alfa one) that gets some discount.
bint said:
I have a 156 V6, not a 166, so don't know if that makes a difference with regards to the clutch, but being a laydeeeeeee I don't have any issues with a heavy clutch (just a heavy right foot....).
The clutch seems very variable between models. The 166 has a dual mass clutch, so quite a different construction to others in the range.The 3.0 12v (from a 164) in my kit car is certainly a way lighter clutch than the 2.5 in my 166.
bint said:
I have a 156 V6, not a 166, so don't know if that makes a difference with regards to the clutch, but being a laydeeeeeee I don't have any issues with a heavy clutch (just a heavy right foot....).
I too do around 7k a year mileage and have no issues with fuel economy etc.
£1500 sounds like a reasonable amount to be prepared to spend just in case - it should be less though.
How old are you if you don't mind me asking? (sorry if it's on here and I missed it) I'm 29 and have full NCB, but for me and MOH as a named driver, with Business Class also, costs £250!
I'm with Sky Insurance, and I also am a paid up member of a car club (although not an Alfa one) that gets some discount.
I'm 21. Insurance is about £650, I used confused.com.I too do around 7k a year mileage and have no issues with fuel economy etc.
£1500 sounds like a reasonable amount to be prepared to spend just in case - it should be less though.
How old are you if you don't mind me asking? (sorry if it's on here and I missed it) I'm 29 and have full NCB, but for me and MOH as a named driver, with Business Class also, costs £250!
I'm with Sky Insurance, and I also am a paid up member of a car club (although not an Alfa one) that gets some discount.
Hi, I own a 3.0v6 sportronic and I'm very pleased with it.
I think your maintence budget of £1500 is way too high. If you go for a a car that has a full service history and the all important cambelt change then I think you will have just to pay general maintainance plus a bit extra to fix the odd glitch/problem.
When I bought mine I phoned a few alfa specialists to find the main issues. Rads are a common weakpoint but are not expensive to replace.
There are also lots of parts available on internet from cars that are being broken. This can be a very easy and inexpensive way of sorting things out. For example, my front fog light was hit by a stone and was cracked. I bought the part of a car the same age of ebay for £20 then paid my local alfa specialist £25 to fit - easy!
If you are looking for a car, I'd definetely recommend looking for a car with the audio DSP system upgrade - excellent quality IMO that knocks the socks off the standard equipment fit on new BMWs and Mercedes I've owned.
Cheers, Ed.
I think your maintence budget of £1500 is way too high. If you go for a a car that has a full service history and the all important cambelt change then I think you will have just to pay general maintainance plus a bit extra to fix the odd glitch/problem.
When I bought mine I phoned a few alfa specialists to find the main issues. Rads are a common weakpoint but are not expensive to replace.
There are also lots of parts available on internet from cars that are being broken. This can be a very easy and inexpensive way of sorting things out. For example, my front fog light was hit by a stone and was cracked. I bought the part of a car the same age of ebay for £20 then paid my local alfa specialist £25 to fit - easy!
If you are looking for a car, I'd definetely recommend looking for a car with the audio DSP system upgrade - excellent quality IMO that knocks the socks off the standard equipment fit on new BMWs and Mercedes I've owned.
Cheers, Ed.
Forgot to mention that if you are interested in all things alfa 166 there is a very informative and helpful bunch of owners here
http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-164-and-166/
http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-164-and-166/
My car required about 500 quids worth of rear suspension rebuild at ~60K miles, so it does wear but not outrageously.
Service interval is 12K miles or 12 months.
My dad has an Omega 2.6 V6 estate which is newer and lower mileage than my Alfa, but to me the Omega interior feels really cheap in comparison. I also know someone who sold his 166 V6 and bought a Laguna to get better mpg, but he said whilst he liked the better fuel economy the 166 was the nicest car he ever drove.
I presume at that yearly mileage most is motorways? I can get 30mpg and a cruising range of 400 miles on the motorway in my 2.5, the trip computer says I should get 420 miles but I always run out of motorways first and go back to town driving so I don't know
The 2.0 should be way way better mpg anyway, and the lighter engine should be easier on tyres & suspension too.
Word of warning: I asked the wife to sit in a 166 at a local garage to decide if the car was an option or if she hated the interior. After that I don't think she would have let me choose anything else
Service interval is 12K miles or 12 months.
My dad has an Omega 2.6 V6 estate which is newer and lower mileage than my Alfa, but to me the Omega interior feels really cheap in comparison. I also know someone who sold his 166 V6 and bought a Laguna to get better mpg, but he said whilst he liked the better fuel economy the 166 was the nicest car he ever drove.
I presume at that yearly mileage most is motorways? I can get 30mpg and a cruising range of 400 miles on the motorway in my 2.5, the trip computer says I should get 420 miles but I always run out of motorways first and go back to town driving so I don't know
The 2.0 should be way way better mpg anyway, and the lighter engine should be easier on tyres & suspension too.
Word of warning: I asked the wife to sit in a 166 at a local garage to decide if the car was an option or if she hated the interior. After that I don't think she would have let me choose anything else
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