GTV grinding noise...
Discussion
Taxi time today, the GTV developed a pretty terminal sounding grind on the way back from the station last night... so, I'm looking for some thoughts on what it might be.
1999 GTV V6 with 16" wheels, all standard.
Grinding is at road wheel speed/frequency.
Louder on overrun and will go away under braking pretty much.
Seems to be coming from front passenger side, but doesn't sound as far over as caliper/wheel interference.
Not a constant grind, but a pulsing metal on metal sound, can be felt through the gear stick rather than the steering.
Can also be felt though the clutch pedal, but I think that's just vibration transferring through the floor.
Clutch travel is a bit notchy, has been for ages, and initially I thought it maybe clutch/DMF failure, but that would be at engine frequency.
Thinking back, the grinding maybe have been preceded by a clonk from underneath, and it certainly got louder on the journey home, all 19 careful miles of it.
So, the likely candidates are:
Brake caliper movement.
Brake cover/back plate touching the disc.
Inner CV joint disintegrating, or the drive shaft failing in some manner.
Diff bearings (less likely I hope)
Not had a chance to take a look as I got back at 10pm, and I'm already on the train back to London.
Likely to get it RAC'd to my favoured Alfa man, in the hope he has a loan car I can collect today (bit cheeky but worth asking!) but wondered if anyone had any thoughts on what it might be.... I find it's best to think of all the things it could be and pick the most expensive, it is the Alfa way
1999 GTV V6 with 16" wheels, all standard.
Grinding is at road wheel speed/frequency.
Louder on overrun and will go away under braking pretty much.
Seems to be coming from front passenger side, but doesn't sound as far over as caliper/wheel interference.
Not a constant grind, but a pulsing metal on metal sound, can be felt through the gear stick rather than the steering.
Can also be felt though the clutch pedal, but I think that's just vibration transferring through the floor.
Clutch travel is a bit notchy, has been for ages, and initially I thought it maybe clutch/DMF failure, but that would be at engine frequency.
Thinking back, the grinding maybe have been preceded by a clonk from underneath, and it certainly got louder on the journey home, all 19 careful miles of it.
So, the likely candidates are:
Brake caliper movement.
Brake cover/back plate touching the disc.
Inner CV joint disintegrating, or the drive shaft failing in some manner.
Diff bearings (less likely I hope)
Not had a chance to take a look as I got back at 10pm, and I'm already on the train back to London.
Likely to get it RAC'd to my favoured Alfa man, in the hope he has a loan car I can collect today (bit cheeky but worth asking!) but wondered if anyone had any thoughts on what it might be.... I find it's best to think of all the things it could be and pick the most expensive, it is the Alfa way
RAC recovery coming this evening to deposit the GTV with the specialist - he said it sounded like something drive shaft related, which seems reasonable, so should be up on the ramp tomorrow with any luck.
Now just need to get the train to collect the in-laws other car, so I can get to work tomorrow.
Now just need to get the train to collect the in-laws other car, so I can get to work tomorrow.
Alfa man has had a quick look, good going considering he's busy - bad sounds traced to the diff area, so maybe the diff, maybe a bearing, or just something loose... will find out on Monday.
An opportunity for a Q2 upgrade could be calling, although if he's got a decent 2nd hand one in the workshop (and it is in fact the diff that's gone) I'll probably just go for that and save the cash for the exhaust system!
An opportunity for a Q2 upgrade could be calling, although if he's got a decent 2nd hand one in the workshop (and it is in fact the diff that's gone) I'll probably just go for that and save the cash for the exhaust system!
...and the winner is: The diff - one of the planetary gears is breaking up. Common-ish fault apparently, and can easily progress to the whole lot going pop and dropping the contents of the gearbox on the road, so just as well I RAC'd it to the garage!
Side stepped a Q2 conversion, although it would of course be nice, I'm not looking for lap-time gains and it's rare to unsettle it mid-corner, or spin up an inside wheel, even on a wet roundabout (of course you can, but only if you try to!).
So, Alfa man has a spare diff, from a low mileage car, which he's going to put in this week.
Grateful as I am for the loan of my old 1.9 DCi Laguna, back off the in-laws, we'd be a bit stuck otherwise... I'd forgotten how much I despised it!
That feeling I can cope with, however it must have known, and has thrown on the spanner of doom, especially for me. Check Emissions it says, my wallet is twitching already, I'll see what fault codes it has stored later in the week!
Side stepped a Q2 conversion, although it would of course be nice, I'm not looking for lap-time gains and it's rare to unsettle it mid-corner, or spin up an inside wheel, even on a wet roundabout (of course you can, but only if you try to!).
So, Alfa man has a spare diff, from a low mileage car, which he's going to put in this week.
Grateful as I am for the loan of my old 1.9 DCi Laguna, back off the in-laws, we'd be a bit stuck otherwise... I'd forgotten how much I despised it!
That feeling I can cope with, however it must have known, and has thrown on the spanner of doom, especially for me. Check Emissions it says, my wallet is twitching already, I'll see what fault codes it has stored later in the week!
Small update from the Alfa man, turns out not only are the planetary gears breaking up, but so is the pinion, bits of it missing - and guess where they end up - yep, in the gearbox.
Balls
So, that's the gearbox out and apart as well then, while they're there it would be worth a check of the clutch as well, given how many hours it takes to get in there, it'd be daft not to replace it if well worn.
Now, thinking back, it did have wheel bearing howl, and I'm aware the GTV has funny noise transference, so things sound like they're in one place but aren't - I wonder if in fact it wasn't the rear wheel bearings, but the diff giving up, in which case it's been going for a while. Certainly sounded like wheel bearings anyway...
...once finally back together we'll see what noises remain!
Balls
So, that's the gearbox out and apart as well then, while they're there it would be worth a check of the clutch as well, given how many hours it takes to get in there, it'd be daft not to replace it if well worn.
Now, thinking back, it did have wheel bearing howl, and I'm aware the GTV has funny noise transference, so things sound like they're in one place but aren't - I wonder if in fact it wasn't the rear wheel bearings, but the diff giving up, in which case it's been going for a while. Certainly sounded like wheel bearings anyway...
...once finally back together we'll see what noises remain!
The GTV lives!
Should be able to collect it tomorrow hopefully, although they finished it off yesterday. Not confirmed the total bill yet... hardly going to be small though, mind you, heck of a lot of work was needed, so here goes:
Replaced Differential (2nd hand one)
Replaced Pinion
New Clutch
New Clutch Release Bearing
New/Replacement Gearbox Input Shaft (the release bearing ate it)
Much cleaning and some gearbox oil.
Somewhat outside of my driveway fixing of a weekend capabilities just at the moment that lot... let's hope that's it for a while now (yes, exhaust system that means you..!)
Should be able to collect it tomorrow hopefully, although they finished it off yesterday. Not confirmed the total bill yet... hardly going to be small though, mind you, heck of a lot of work was needed, so here goes:
Replaced Differential (2nd hand one)
Replaced Pinion
New Clutch
New Clutch Release Bearing
New/Replacement Gearbox Input Shaft (the release bearing ate it)
Much cleaning and some gearbox oil.
Somewhat outside of my driveway fixing of a weekend capabilities just at the moment that lot... let's hope that's it for a while now (yes, exhaust system that means you..!)
Back in one piece:
Some of the many broken parts... you can just about make out the missing section of pinion gear, the end of the gear selector (in the foreground) has worn away as well.
The release bearing was very oval and squashed, which would explain the crunchy clutch pedal action I've had in it for a year or two..! The bearings in the diff were proper growlers too - basically there were lots of shagged parts(!)
So now, it drives rather nicely - smooth progressive clutch pedal action, and the gearchange is smooth and direct. No unusual noises from up front either. Turns out one of the rear wheel bearings is going, so that still howls a bit - I can do that in the dark/rain on my drive though!
Good to be back in a proper engined car, rather than that diesel Laguna!
A worthwhile mention as well for some quality spannering by Rusper Alfa www.rusperalfaromeo.com
(They're actually in Faygate, which makes it easy to catch a train there too!)
Some of the many broken parts... you can just about make out the missing section of pinion gear, the end of the gear selector (in the foreground) has worn away as well.
The release bearing was very oval and squashed, which would explain the crunchy clutch pedal action I've had in it for a year or two..! The bearings in the diff were proper growlers too - basically there were lots of shagged parts(!)
So now, it drives rather nicely - smooth progressive clutch pedal action, and the gearchange is smooth and direct. No unusual noises from up front either. Turns out one of the rear wheel bearings is going, so that still howls a bit - I can do that in the dark/rain on my drive though!
Good to be back in a proper engined car, rather than that diesel Laguna!
A worthwhile mention as well for some quality spannering by Rusper Alfa www.rusperalfaromeo.com
(They're actually in Faygate, which makes it easy to catch a train there too!)
Although a good opportunity to fit one (along with a GTA flywheel) I don't really need either of them and can find plenty of things I really should be spending £500 on 
A 6spd box with taller top gear, a strut brace, and a suitably vocal stainless exhaust system with a set of manifolds would fall into that category as well...!
A 6spd box with taller top gear, a strut brace, and a suitably vocal stainless exhaust system with a set of manifolds would fall into that category as well...!
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