Used 2016 c350e high miler... bad idea?

[119]

Looking for an estate car and the market seems to be flooded with diesels, which, for barely 50 miles a week is unlikely to be trouble free motoring so am trying to avoid those.

So with that, started looking at petrol alternatives around the budget of 7-8k and a few of these have popped up albeit with 120k plus miles on them.

I note that they had starter issues but due to the age an mileage on them I am assuming they have been replaced with the updated version.

That aside does anyone have any experience of them with these sort of miles on?

Anything to be wary of as it seems to be a lot of car for the money!

[raspy]

I got rid of mine around 60k miles, partly because I didn't trust the reliability of the hybrid system once the official 6 year/60k factory hybrid warranty ran out.

You could argue that because there are so many for sale that have done 100k miles and up, then the hybrid system is more durable and reliable than one would think, but I didn't want to take that chance myself (at least not compared to Toyota durability and reliability of hybrids)

I had no issues apart from a new thermostat and some minor corroded wiring on the air suspension.

No change in electric range even at 6 years old. Car was lovely to drive on electric, but battery didn't last very long (as low as 3 miles in winter/up to 9-10 in summer) but obviously it always would have some battery left at any time, to provide electrical assistance when more acceleration needed.

I would "lose" 1 mile of range just driving from my driveway up to the end of the road (400ft) and the 2 litre petrol engine fitted to the car was rather thirsty.

Like any MB with airmatic, make sure it's ok before you purchase it.

[Dewi 2]

119 said:

Looking for an estate car and the market seems to be flooded with diesels, which, for barely 50 miles a week is unlikely to be trouble free motoring so am trying to avoid those.

So with that, started looking at petrol alternatives around the budget of 7-8k and a few of these have popped up albeit with 120k plus miles on them.

The worrying part for me, is that little letter e after the 350.
Presumably the car is a plug-in hybrid.

Some white ago, I had assumed that if a high voltage battery failed, it would not be a problem because there is a perfectly good petrol engine under the bonnet. In other words, carry on driving petrol only.
Apparently not. It seems with M-Bs, that the petrol and hybrid systems work in conjunction. Perfect harmony.

When high voltage battery failure occurs, the choice appears to be, either pay about £20,000 for a replacement battery to be fitted, or have a garden ornament. At least being an estate, it might be handy as a garden tools store.

[raspy]

Dewi 2 said:

The worrying part for me, is that little letter e after the 350.
Presumably the car is a plug-in hybrid.

Some white ago, I had assumed that if a high voltage battery failed, it would not be a problem because there is a perfectly good petrol engine under the bonnet. In other words, carry on driving petrol only.
Apparently not. It seems with M-Bs, that the petrol and hybrid systems work in conjunction. Perfect harmony.

When high voltage battery failure occurs, the choice appears to be, either pay about £20,000 for a replacement battery to be fitted, or have a garden ornament. At least being an estate, it might be handy as a garden tools store.

Or get a used battery fitted. They are much cheaper than a brand new one from MB.

[Dewi 2]

raspy said:

Or get a used battery fitted. They are much cheaper than a brand new one from MB.

For me, that would introduce a huge risk.
Impossible to know whether a second hand main lithium battery, might contain a faulty cell.

I do also wonder what view an insurance company might take.
They seem to be very nervous about lithium batteries. When an EV has been carelessly driven over a high kerb, denting the battery casing, even almost new vehicles have been written off by insurers.

That example of accidental damage could not happen to a Mercedes-Benz PHEV, because the battery is not located below the floor, but it does reveal insurers concerns about the risk of subsequent fires.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/a...

[TarquinMX5]

Dewi 2 said:

119 said:

Looking for an estate car and the market seems to be flooded with diesels, which, for barely 50 miles a week is unlikely to be trouble free motoring so am trying to avoid those.

So with that, started looking at petrol alternatives around the budget of 7-8k and a few of these have popped up albeit with 120k plus miles on them.

The worrying part for me, is that little letter e after the 350.
Presumably the car is a plug-in hybrid.

Some white ago, I had assumed that if a high voltage battery failed, it would not be a problem because there is a perfectly good petrol engine under the bonnet. In other words, carry on driving petrol only.
Apparently not. It seems with M-Bs, that the petrol and hybrid systems work in conjunction. Perfect harmony.

It's not just MB unfortunately; as far as I can see they're all the same, and many cars which I've previously thought were 'only' petrol now turn out to be mild hybrids.

[Dewi 2]

TarquinMX5 said:

It's not just MB unfortunately; as far as I can see they're all the same, and many cars which I've previously thought were 'only' petrol now turn out to be mild hybrids.

I think I have managed to at least get some understanding about all this electric stuff, in particular the Mercedes-Benz mild hybrid system.
The longevity of the various electric systems was important to me, because of continuing to use each of my cars for a long time (M-B CLK 320 for 24 years).

For me, that ruled out an EV and PHEV, they won't be usable for 24 years.

The Mercedes-Benz mild hybrid system (W213 facelift) works brilliantly. The battery is modest size and only 48 volts (cannot move the car) so replaceent is far less expensive than an EV or PHEV.
Some of these systems involve drive belts, but the M-B electric motor is positioned between the engine and the transmission. It can therefore directly rotate the crankshaft. The motor's purpose is to replace the starter motor and alternator, in addition provide power to fill- in for 'turbo lag'.

When starting the engine, there is an uncanny sense of no sound or feeling. The engine is just suddenly running.
The instant and smooth engine starting, makes the Stop/Start system unintrusive and comfortable to just leave switched on.
However, after a while it occurred to me that at the initial moment when an engine starts, there will not be any oil pressure. Thousands of additional engine starts is perhaps not good for the longevity of IC engines, so I now switch off the system.

Two odd points;
The DVLA class the fuel type as 'Hybrid Electric (Clean).
At MoT no emissions test is needed.

It is simply powered by the petrol engine. Fuel consumption is impressive though. On a long journey, my CLK 320 was about 35 mpg, the E200 is about 45 mpg and the performance figures of the two cars are almost identical. There are very few petrol E Class cars in the UK. Diesel is still more popular.

Hope that might reduce your concerns about mild hybrids, but I have only described the M-B type of mild hybrid.

Edited by Dewi 2 on Thursday 17th July 14:23

[TarquinMX5]

Thanks. Slightly off topic but I was stuck in a queue of traffic recently, immediately behind what looked to be a brand new electric Hyundai which looked to have a silver coloured 'casing' under the floor and clearly visible between the suspension arms. I assumed that it was the battery pack but it looked quite vulnerable, no doubt good for weight distribution but less so for protection from damage.

[Dewi 2]

TarquinMX5 said:

Thanks. Slightly off topic but I was stuck in a queue of traffic recently, immediately behind what looked to be a brand new electric Hyundai which looked to have a silver coloured 'casing' under the floor and clearly visible between the suspension arms. I assumed that it was the battery pack but it looked quite vulnerable, no doubt good for weight distribution but less so for protection from damage.

You are correct.
An underfloor EV battery pack can be yet one more EV drawback.

Accidentally dent a battery pack, say driving over a high kerb, and insurance companies go into worry mode.
Might any individual cells have been damaged? Is the lithium battery now at risk of catching fire ?
They play safe and have written off almost new cars. Cost passed through to EV policyholders.

If any product is good, desirable and in demand, why would it need government subsidies?

[rswift]

I bought one of these, 2 years ago as a stop gap after my "Trusty" LPG Landrover failed to proceed...

It had 165k on the clock, now has closer to 200k, and has been faultless. I had all 4 wheel bearings replaced and kept on top of oil/filter changes etc. But what a great car, 0-60 is just under the speed of the AMG V8 version, as you have the 2 Litre Turbo engine with electric assistance. No issues re teh batter or Hybrid system, a bit of preventative maintenance re the PTC heater connections. Previous owner had put a starter motor on it.

It's fast and comfortable, does between 45 and 50 MPG, or 14 miles of Electrical range for school runs etc. If you don't plug it in, it works in a similar fashion to a Prius, so you still get a benefit.

When I first got it, Parking in London was free .... and it was £0 road tax. Sadly the parking privilege has gone, and it now costs £20 to tax it.

I've subsequently changed to a quarter of a million miles Tesla Model S, and my wife has been running around in the Mercedes after her lease car went back.....but value for morey they're hard to beat.

I have no interest in driving a smelly and over complicated diesel !

[MustangGT]

rswift said:

I have no interest in driving a smelly and over complicated diesel !

I had to laugh - 'over complicated diesel' when comparing it to a PHEV.

[Simon_GH]

I suspect it won’t be long before an independent battery specialist could fit a replacement generic battery which is far superior to the original MB fitment for a fraction of the cost.

[rswift]

MustangGT said:

rswift said:

I have no interest in driving a smelly and over complicated diesel !

I had to laugh - 'over complicated diesel' when comparing it to a PHEV.

It's a fair point, the last Diesel I owned was a 1985 Citroen CX, which didn't have a DPF/EGR/Ad Blue etc, but modern diesels running on the margins, skinny timing chains, wet belts etc/long service intervals, mechanics dream as mostly will need some sort of repair eventually. A Hybrid, petrol engine/electric motor....its only how they talk to each other makes it complex, but there are a growing number of independents out there who do understand Hybrids & Electric cars. it's only complicated if you don't understand it !