VM Pods v Other Boosters
Discussion
Lots of folk will suggest what has worked well for them be it TP-Link Decos, Orbi, Google/Nest, Tenda or eero, however what works well in their home may not in yours so you need to consider your home and what your ideal outcome is before buying anything.
First is what is your home like, size, layout, construction and where is your master socket / router located.
Second do you have any dead/slow spots today than need to be resolved.
What are the drivers, cost, speed, latency ,stability or functionality (parental controls, guest networks etc)
These things will drive what solution to use and where you’d place any mesh nodes.
Another factor is who is your ISP, many now want you to use or force you to use their modem/router/ap boxes and won’t let you use a 3rd party unit, others will let you put their modem/router/ap boxes into modem/pass through mode allowing the use of better router/ap’s and mesh systems.
Depending on your home it maybe that a single higher quality router/ap would suffice and some from TP-Link and Linksys can be upgrade to mesh if you do find they don’t cover the whole home.
Mesh, there are generally three types:
Dual Band – These have two radios in them a 2.4ghz for wifi traffic, a 5ghz one for wifi traffic and also to send the traffic between the satellite nodes and the main/master node connected to your router or modem (the backhaul).
Tri Band – These have three radios in them a 2.4ghz for wifi traffic, a 5ghz one for wifi traffic and a additional 5ghz radio for the backhaul to send the traffic between the satellite nodes and the main/master node connected to your router or modem.
Powerline - These have two radios in them a 2.4ghz for wifi traffic, a 5ghz one for wifi traffic. They use the power connection and your domestic wiring as the backhaul (the performance of these does obviously depend on the state and layout of your ring mains)
Dual Band are often cheaper but offer lower speeds. Tri Band are generally more expensive but offer higher speeds.
In a ideal world you would have your master node centrally in the house to act as a hub and make the satellite units spokes so they can all reach the master, if you chain a number of satellite units together that is where you can see performance hits as the data has to pass through a number of units before getting to the master.
When placing Dual/Tri Band units they have to be close enough to get a strong signal between nodes but not so close that your wifi clients continually hop from node to node, this is more art than science but generally there should be some help in the set-up guides for any system, I try and start as far apart as I can and move satellite nodes closer to the master until I get a stable connection.
Powerline units are more flexible as each unit doesn’t need a strong wifi line to the master as its using the ring main as the backhaul so you can have better placement options to get even coverage over the whole home.
Then there are devices known as accesspoints these can be considered logically as a mesh but connected via ethernet cables back to your router, these are either generally ceiling mounted, fit in wall to a 1g back box or many home fw/router/switch/accesspoint boxes can be configured as a accesspoint.
To confuse things even more many wireless mesh systems can also use ethernet to create a wired connection.
If you look at the minimum spec vm gives you only 30Mb per room as a minimum standard so the question is that sufficient or are you expecting your wifi speeds throughout the house?
If you are looking at line speeds then you need to look at tri-band as a minimum, possibly connecting via Ethernet if that’s a hard requirement.
First is what is your home like, size, layout, construction and where is your master socket / router located.
Second do you have any dead/slow spots today than need to be resolved.
What are the drivers, cost, speed, latency ,stability or functionality (parental controls, guest networks etc)
These things will drive what solution to use and where you’d place any mesh nodes.
Another factor is who is your ISP, many now want you to use or force you to use their modem/router/ap boxes and won’t let you use a 3rd party unit, others will let you put their modem/router/ap boxes into modem/pass through mode allowing the use of better router/ap’s and mesh systems.
Depending on your home it maybe that a single higher quality router/ap would suffice and some from TP-Link and Linksys can be upgrade to mesh if you do find they don’t cover the whole home.
Mesh, there are generally three types:
Dual Band – These have two radios in them a 2.4ghz for wifi traffic, a 5ghz one for wifi traffic and also to send the traffic between the satellite nodes and the main/master node connected to your router or modem (the backhaul).
Tri Band – These have three radios in them a 2.4ghz for wifi traffic, a 5ghz one for wifi traffic and a additional 5ghz radio for the backhaul to send the traffic between the satellite nodes and the main/master node connected to your router or modem.
Powerline - These have two radios in them a 2.4ghz for wifi traffic, a 5ghz one for wifi traffic. They use the power connection and your domestic wiring as the backhaul (the performance of these does obviously depend on the state and layout of your ring mains)
Dual Band are often cheaper but offer lower speeds. Tri Band are generally more expensive but offer higher speeds.
In a ideal world you would have your master node centrally in the house to act as a hub and make the satellite units spokes so they can all reach the master, if you chain a number of satellite units together that is where you can see performance hits as the data has to pass through a number of units before getting to the master.
When placing Dual/Tri Band units they have to be close enough to get a strong signal between nodes but not so close that your wifi clients continually hop from node to node, this is more art than science but generally there should be some help in the set-up guides for any system, I try and start as far apart as I can and move satellite nodes closer to the master until I get a stable connection.
Powerline units are more flexible as each unit doesn’t need a strong wifi line to the master as its using the ring main as the backhaul so you can have better placement options to get even coverage over the whole home.
Then there are devices known as accesspoints these can be considered logically as a mesh but connected via ethernet cables back to your router, these are either generally ceiling mounted, fit in wall to a 1g back box or many home fw/router/switch/accesspoint boxes can be configured as a accesspoint.
To confuse things even more many wireless mesh systems can also use ethernet to create a wired connection.
If you look at the minimum spec vm gives you only 30Mb per room as a minimum standard so the question is that sufficient or are you expecting your wifi speeds throughout the house?
If you are looking at line speeds then you need to look at tri-band as a minimum, possibly connecting via Ethernet if that’s a hard requirement.
The Captain is very thorough, great advice.
I like to keep things simple, TP Link P9, £150ish for 3 on Amazon, 3 year warranty, simple app to install and control them.
Use the P9’s in AP mode, switch off the wireless on your Virgin hub.
I’ve fitted 15+ sets of these, never had an issue for SO/HO.
Worst case just return them, but I strongly doubt you’ll need to.
I like to keep things simple, TP Link P9, £150ish for 3 on Amazon, 3 year warranty, simple app to install and control them.
Use the P9’s in AP mode, switch off the wireless on your Virgin hub.
I’ve fitted 15+ sets of these, never had an issue for SO/HO.
Worst case just return them, but I strongly doubt you’ll need to.
DirktheDaring said:
The Captain is very thorough, great advice.
I like to keep things simple, TP Link P9, £150ish for 3 on Amazon, 3 year warranty, simple app to install and control them.
Use the P9’s in AP mode, switch off the wireless on your Virgin hub.
I’ve fitted 15+ sets of these, never had an issue for SO/HO.
Worst case just return them, but I strongly doubt you’ll need to.
Hi, I'll go straight to the horses mouth for the questions - are these "powerline" units or wifi repeaters. Or both? I have three of the cheaper TP Link powerline ones as extenders (not wifi) and they have been hit and miss for about three years now.I like to keep things simple, TP Link P9, £150ish for 3 on Amazon, 3 year warranty, simple app to install and control them.
Use the P9’s in AP mode, switch off the wireless on your Virgin hub.
I’ve fitted 15+ sets of these, never had an issue for SO/HO.
Worst case just return them, but I strongly doubt you’ll need to.
I'm imagining these are a whole new kettle of fish?
Edited by cobra kid on Sunday 12th November 17:06
Backhaul is done on the powerline, these units will then daisy chain wirelessly between each other or you can run Ethernet cable to each if you want to.
You’ll have seamless WiFi when you walk between them (there’s only one SSID broadcast, none of those crappy .ext networks) and you can plug straight into each device if needed.
This is a guesthouse that I put 6 units into about 2.5 years ago, it’s a big old house and WiFi is good everywhere.
The elderly owners wanted something they could manage themselves, usually I’d go down the UniFi route on a bigger property, but it’s overkill for them.
I’m not an IT pro like the Captain, I like to dabble and look after a small circle of friends and friends of friends, so you shouldn’t find this too difficult to set up.
You’ll have seamless WiFi when you walk between them (there’s only one SSID broadcast, none of those crappy .ext networks) and you can plug straight into each device if needed.
This is a guesthouse that I put 6 units into about 2.5 years ago, it’s a big old house and WiFi is good everywhere.
The elderly owners wanted something they could manage themselves, usually I’d go down the UniFi route on a bigger property, but it’s overkill for them.
I’m not an IT pro like the Captain, I like to dabble and look after a small circle of friends and friends of friends, so you shouldn’t find this too difficult to set up.
cobra kid said:
Hi, I'll go straight to the horses mouth for the questions - are these "powerline" units or wifi repeaters. Or both? I have three of the cheaper TP Link powerline ones as extenders (not wifi) and they have been hit and miss for about three years now.
I'm imagining these are a whole new kettle of fish?
The question is are they hit & miss because they use powerline or because they use wifi extenders & are generally unreliable, unfortunately only some testing will tell us.I'm imagining these are a whole new kettle of fish?
Edited by cobra kid on Sunday 12th November 17:06
Buy from Amazon & test. Deco the old system, if you can put the router into modem mode, if not ensure the wifi is powered down and old powerline units switched off.
Then test the new system & see, if you get dramatic improvement good, if not it’s likely that powerline capacity is lacking due to noise on the system and a wireless system is a better option.
Don’t forget you can re-use the wifi name & password on the new platform to save changing the credentials on all your devices.
DirktheDaring said:
Backhaul is done on the powerline, these units will then daisy chain wirelessly between each other or you can run Ethernet cable to each if you want to.
You’ll have seamless WiFi when you walk between them (there’s only one SSID broadcast, none of those crappy .ext networks) and you can plug straight into each device if needed.
This is a guesthouse that I put 6 units into about 2.5 years ago, it’s a big old house and WiFi is good everywhere.
The elderly owners wanted something they could manage themselves, usually I’d go down the UniFi route on a bigger property, but it’s overkill for them.
I’m not an IT pro like the Captain, I like to dabble and look after a small circle of friends and friends of friends, so you shouldn’t find this too difficult to set up.
That's excellent thank you. Christchurch eh? Fancy a trip round the corner to Sheffield?You’ll have seamless WiFi when you walk between them (there’s only one SSID broadcast, none of those crappy .ext networks) and you can plug straight into each device if needed.
This is a guesthouse that I put 6 units into about 2.5 years ago, it’s a big old house and WiFi is good everywhere.
The elderly owners wanted something they could manage themselves, usually I’d go down the UniFi route on a bigger property, but it’s overkill for them.
I’m not an IT pro like the Captain, I like to dabble and look after a small circle of friends and friends of friends, so you shouldn’t find this too difficult to set up.
Also, those speeds seem quite low? Is it a slow speed broadband anyway? I'm on the VM125 set up.
Edited by cobra kid on Monday 13th November 07:55
DirktheDaring said:
The Captain is very thorough, great advice.
I like to keep things simple, TP Link P9, £150ish for 3 on Amazon, 3 year warranty, simple app to install and control them.
Use the P9’s in AP mode, switch off the wireless on your Virgin hub.
I’ve fitted 15+ sets of these, never had an issue for SO/HO.
Worst case just return them, but I strongly doubt you’ll need to.
Hi again,I like to keep things simple, TP Link P9, £150ish for 3 on Amazon, 3 year warranty, simple app to install and control them.
Use the P9’s in AP mode, switch off the wireless on your Virgin hub.
I’ve fitted 15+ sets of these, never had an issue for SO/HO.
Worst case just return them, but I strongly doubt you’ll need to.
On your advice, we have a 3 pack of these being delivered today. When I put our VM hub into router mode, can I still connect it wired to the VM box and the telly? Does it simply turn the wifi facility off?
Edited by cobra kid on Tuesday 28th November 07:47
Hi dude, leave the ISP modem/router as it is, except turning off the 2.4 and 5ghz WiFi as you won’t need it.
Set up the first device out of the box, that’ll be the main device, use the Deco app to set them up one by one.
There’ll be a firmware update and out of the box they’ll also be in router mode, use the app to put them into AP mode so you don’t get a double nat situation, you don’t want both devices acting as routers.
Advanced stage,
If your isp modem/router/hub lets you put it into bridge mode you can put the P9’s back into router mode, but that’s not essential, it just gives you a little more control over devices that connect to your network.
I put 3x P9’s in for my neighbours at the weekend, from start to finish it was about 45 minutes which included the firmware updates and Googling their ISP modem/router/hub password to switch off the WiFi.
Set up the first device out of the box, that’ll be the main device, use the Deco app to set them up one by one.
There’ll be a firmware update and out of the box they’ll also be in router mode, use the app to put them into AP mode so you don’t get a double nat situation, you don’t want both devices acting as routers.
Advanced stage,
If your isp modem/router/hub lets you put it into bridge mode you can put the P9’s back into router mode, but that’s not essential, it just gives you a little more control over devices that connect to your network.
I put 3x P9’s in for my neighbours at the weekend, from start to finish it was about 45 minutes which included the firmware updates and Googling their ISP modem/router/hub password to switch off the WiFi.
cobra kid said:
That's excellent thank you. Christchurch eh? Fancy a trip round the corner to Sheffield?
Also, those speeds seem quite low? Is it a slow speed broadband anyway? I'm on the VM125 set up.
Sorry missed this, the guest house is empty, that’s probably just some backhaul chatter.Also, those speeds seem quite low? Is it a slow speed broadband anyway? I'm on the VM125 set up.
Edited by cobra kid on Monday 13th November 07:55
DirktheDaring said:
Hi dude, leave the ISP modem/router as it is, except turning off the 2.4 and 5ghz WiFi as you won’t need it.
Set up the first device out of the box, that’ll be the main device, use the Deco app to set them up one by one.
There’ll be a firmware update and out of the box they’ll also be in router mode, use the app to put them into AP mode so you don’t get a double nat situation, you don’t want both devices acting as routers.
Advanced stage,
If your isp modem/router/hub lets you put it into bridge mode you can put the P9’s back into router mode, but that’s not essential, it just gives you a little more control over devices that connect to your network.
I put 3x P9’s in for my neighbours at the weekend, from start to finish it was about 45 minutes which included the firmware updates and Googling their ISP modem/router/hub password to switch off the WiFi.
Thanks for that. I'm quite happy with the setting up. It was more that I didn't want to lose the two outputs from the VM router that are currently in use. So simply turn the wifi off and I should be ok.Set up the first device out of the box, that’ll be the main device, use the Deco app to set them up one by one.
There’ll be a firmware update and out of the box they’ll also be in router mode, use the app to put them into AP mode so you don’t get a double nat situation, you don’t want both devices acting as routers.
Advanced stage,
If your isp modem/router/hub lets you put it into bridge mode you can put the P9’s back into router mode, but that’s not essential, it just gives you a little more control over devices that connect to your network.
I put 3x P9’s in for my neighbours at the weekend, from start to finish it was about 45 minutes which included the firmware updates and Googling their ISP modem/router/hub password to switch off the WiFi.
Thanks for you help. Fingers crossed!
Get a little 5 port switch, unplug one of your hub connections, plug the switch into the now spare port and whatever you unplugged from the hub into the new switch.
NETGEAR 5 Port Gigabit Network Switch (GS105) - Ethernet Splitter - Ethernet Switch - Ethernet Hub - Plug-and-Play - Silent Operation - Desktop or Wall Mount https://amzn.eu/d/5nmakO4
NETGEAR 5 Port Gigabit Network Switch (GS105) - Ethernet Splitter - Ethernet Switch - Ethernet Hub - Plug-and-Play - Silent Operation - Desktop or Wall Mount https://amzn.eu/d/5nmakO4
DirktheDaring said:
Get a little 5 port switch, unplug one of your hub connections, plug the switch into the now spare port and whatever you unplugged from the hub into the new switch.
NETGEAR 5 Port Gigabit Network Switch (GS105) - Ethernet Splitter - Ethernet Switch - Ethernet Hub - Plug-and-Play - Silent Operation - Desktop or Wall Mount https://amzn.eu/d/5nmakO4
What I mean is that I have a couple of spare sockets on the back of the Hub but now that it is in modem mode, they don't work. NETGEAR 5 Port Gigabit Network Switch (GS105) - Ethernet Splitter - Ethernet Switch - Ethernet Hub - Plug-and-Play - Silent Operation - Desktop or Wall Mount https://amzn.eu/d/5nmakO4
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