Home wi-fi quandary
Discussion
I know this has been covered here before, but some of the techy stuff is a bit much for me, so apologies if we're going over old ground.
I'm just about at my wits end with my home wi-fi. My connections are constantly dropping,and I find myself re-setting various bits and pieces several times a day. All I want is a basic, straightforward, reliable system that just works. No bells and whistles; a Ford Focus, as opposed to an M5, if you like.
My main problem is that the house is old and rambling. Over three floors, but the footprint extends outwards quite a bit. I currently have a BTHub 5 which serves 1/3 of the property. I have a BT extender connected to the router feeding a Home Hotspot Flex 600 which is constantly needing to be reset. This covers an extra couple of rooms, but the rest of the house is bereft of signal, as are the garages and outbuildings.
Powerline kit doesn't work, as there are at least three separate ring mains. We're fairly rural, and on a good day will just about get 20mbps. Not even heavy users, just the usual Netflix, socials, banking etc etc.
So, what do I need for full, reliable coverage? Simple as possible, and I don't fancy chasing out walls and running cable here, there and everywhere. Can it be done? There must be an easy solution, it can't be unique by any stretch. TIA...and I have no idea what backhaul is, even after Googling it.
I'm just about at my wits end with my home wi-fi. My connections are constantly dropping,and I find myself re-setting various bits and pieces several times a day. All I want is a basic, straightforward, reliable system that just works. No bells and whistles; a Ford Focus, as opposed to an M5, if you like.
My main problem is that the house is old and rambling. Over three floors, but the footprint extends outwards quite a bit. I currently have a BTHub 5 which serves 1/3 of the property. I have a BT extender connected to the router feeding a Home Hotspot Flex 600 which is constantly needing to be reset. This covers an extra couple of rooms, but the rest of the house is bereft of signal, as are the garages and outbuildings.
Powerline kit doesn't work, as there are at least three separate ring mains. We're fairly rural, and on a good day will just about get 20mbps. Not even heavy users, just the usual Netflix, socials, banking etc etc.
So, what do I need for full, reliable coverage? Simple as possible, and I don't fancy chasing out walls and running cable here, there and everywhere. Can it be done? There must be an easy solution, it can't be unique by any stretch. TIA...and I have no idea what backhaul is, even after Googling it.
Sounds like you need a mesh system. Some background and explanation here : https://uk.pcmag.com/wireless-networking/87178/the...
and I'm sure people will chime in with their experiences.
Range extenders (IMO) don’t work well, especially with your layout. Mesh system is your solution. However this depends on your budget. Systems with separate backhaul means you’ll get better speeds but comes at a premium.
I would recommend 3 discs for better coverage with your layout.
I have BT Smarthub 2 with complete WiFi (black discs) which works well but they are not as good as BTs premium WiFi (white discs) which has better hardware.
I believe there is a thread on this topic you may find helpful : https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I would recommend 3 discs for better coverage with your layout.
I have BT Smarthub 2 with complete WiFi (black discs) which works well but they are not as good as BTs premium WiFi (white discs) which has better hardware.
I believe there is a thread on this topic you may find helpful : https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I had the same issues as yourself, tried all kinds of Wi-Fi extenders and ring main extenders to no avail
some one on here recommended the following: DECO TP link system
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-E4-Seamless-...
Its a plug and play mesh system and its so good I've forgot I ever had it installed. Devices swap between each device that its closest to without me even noticing.
I've recommended it to a lot of people since.
some one on here recommended the following: DECO TP link system
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-E4-Seamless-...
Its a plug and play mesh system and its so good I've forgot I ever had it installed. Devices swap between each device that its closest to without me even noticing.
I've recommended it to a lot of people since.
As already said your system is a bit cobbled together with different extenders, the "middle" is probably falling over and affecting all the rest of it.
A decent mesh system would sort, the one already linked is a good system - this is the one I want to put in but got no need to do it as yet so been watching till it dips in price a bit more https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B089NMH2WX/?coliid=I27...
A decent mesh system would sort, the one already linked is a good system - this is the one I want to put in but got no need to do it as yet so been watching till it dips in price a bit more https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B089NMH2WX/?coliid=I27...
AdeTuono said:
.......I have a BT extender connected to the router feeding a Home Hotspot Flex 600 which is constantly needing to be reset ....
.......Powerline kit doesn't work, as there are at least three separate ring mains.
FWIW .... BT's Home Hotspot Flex 600 is a Powerline device........Powerline kit doesn't work, as there are at least three separate ring mains.
The later Powerline kit works happily across mulitple Consumer Units, so if everything is the same side of a single meter Powerline should be fine.
The TP-Link Powerline kit is very good and definitely does work across Consumer Units.
BT Mesh discs are a reasonable Mesh solution as long as they can get a decent signal between them, saying that they can also be a right royal PITA. I'm on my second set of BT Mesh discs and the later "Premium" one's are much better than the original Whole Home (White one's).
I'm sorely tempted though to dump the BT mesh in favour of the TP-link Deco X50, although at them moment the Premium System is stable.
I use TP Link powerline and the latest versions have added OneMesh compatibility so they'll use the Powerline network for backhaul duties.
To put it simply .... backhaul is the way the Mesh connects back to the router (or more accurately the disc connected to the router).
Depending on how thick your walls are you may need both Powerline and a Mesh if you want to avoid running cables.
I'd try the TP-Link Powerline kit first, specifically these:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Passthrough-Confi...
You can add more devices if you need to, and they'll work with a TP-Link Mesh system should you decide to go that way.
mesh,
I have the 'middle' 'whole home' BT Disks. (only ones available at the time , they now have a mini and a more powerful set.
https://shop.bt.com/category/networking,network-de...
The only thing to be aware of is those that replace your router. Your router is actually a Router and Modem combined. The modem talks to the internet (outside world) your router controls the network within the house.
The BT' ones and I think the tenda ones, just piggy back your existing router (put a lan cable from router to first disk) and create its own wifi network. The only techy bit is it is usually advisable to switch of the wifi on the router to avoid conflicts.
If you replace the router bit of the router (google ones), then you have to switch your router into bridge mode (modem only). My router at the time of purchase didnt support bridge mode hence I got the BT disks.
they are easy to set up, plug and play with an App, and mine have been rock solid for about 4 years now.
you can even get refurbed ones if you want cheaper still. I got a refurbed one for my wifes 'office in the conservatory and its been fine.
I have the 'middle' 'whole home' BT Disks. (only ones available at the time , they now have a mini and a more powerful set.
https://shop.bt.com/category/networking,network-de...
The only thing to be aware of is those that replace your router. Your router is actually a Router and Modem combined. The modem talks to the internet (outside world) your router controls the network within the house.
The BT' ones and I think the tenda ones, just piggy back your existing router (put a lan cable from router to first disk) and create its own wifi network. The only techy bit is it is usually advisable to switch of the wifi on the router to avoid conflicts.
If you replace the router bit of the router (google ones), then you have to switch your router into bridge mode (modem only). My router at the time of purchase didnt support bridge mode hence I got the BT disks.
they are easy to set up, plug and play with an App, and mine have been rock solid for about 4 years now.
you can even get refurbed ones if you want cheaper still. I got a refurbed one for my wifes 'office in the conservatory and its been fine.
JSP440 said:
I had the same issues as yourself, tried all kinds of Wi-Fi extenders and ring main extenders to no avail
some one on here recommended the following: DECO TP link system
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-E4-Seamless-...
Its a plug and play mesh system and its so good I've forgot I ever had it installed. Devices swap between each device that its closest to without me even noticing.
I've recommended it to a lot of people since.
Not that it will affect the op, as BB slow there…some one on here recommended the following: DECO TP link system
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-E4-Seamless-...
Its a plug and play mesh system and its so good I've forgot I ever had it installed. Devices swap between each device that its closest to without me even noticing.
I've recommended it to a lot of people since.
But the E4 spec is very misleading. The ethernet port is 100mbps, so that is the best you’ll get around the house. It’s well hidden in their info.
"Please note if the Deco model is a product with 100Mbps Ethernet ports, the maximum speed of the Deco system is 100Mbps only".
The more expensive S4 is 1G ethernet I recall.
When I had E4 my 200mbps BB was only 100 on the E4
I sold it & replaced with S4. Now 200mbps around the house.
As most folk have said mesh is certainly one option, another as noted is newer powerline units which often can be used as a mesh system too.
Given the description of your home (& assuming many of the internal walls are brick/block/stone) you might need a number of mesh nodes if you go with wireless backhaul mesh (that’s a wireless connection between mesh nodes, rather than wired or powerline interconnects).
If you think about the wifi signal from any device as ripples in a flat pond from throwing in a stone (let’s disregard walls atm) the farther they travel the weaker they get, now imagine two stones being thrown too far apart & the ripples never meet. The key is getting the nodes close enough for a good backhaul link but not so close as you have too many both from a service & cost perspective.
Mesh with wired / powerline backhaul is less concerned with this due to the different interconnect medium.
It would be useful to see a sketch of the floor plan with the incoming bt point & any particularly thick walls / problem areas.
Lastly always buy any new kit from a vendor with a good return policy in case the solution doesn’t perform as expected.
Given the description of your home (& assuming many of the internal walls are brick/block/stone) you might need a number of mesh nodes if you go with wireless backhaul mesh (that’s a wireless connection between mesh nodes, rather than wired or powerline interconnects).
If you think about the wifi signal from any device as ripples in a flat pond from throwing in a stone (let’s disregard walls atm) the farther they travel the weaker they get, now imagine two stones being thrown too far apart & the ripples never meet. The key is getting the nodes close enough for a good backhaul link but not so close as you have too many both from a service & cost perspective.
Mesh with wired / powerline backhaul is less concerned with this due to the different interconnect medium.
It would be useful to see a sketch of the floor plan with the incoming bt point & any particularly thick walls / problem areas.
Lastly always buy any new kit from a vendor with a good return policy in case the solution doesn’t perform as expected.
James6112 said:
JSP440 said:
I had the same issues as yourself, tried all kinds of Wi-Fi extenders and ring main extenders to no avail
some one on here recommended the following: DECO TP link system
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-E4-Seamless-...
Its a plug and play mesh system and its so good I've forgot I ever had it installed. Devices swap between each device that its closest to without me even noticing.
I've recommended it to a lot of people since.
Not that it will affect the op, as BB slow there…some one on here recommended the following: DECO TP link system
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-E4-Seamless-...
Its a plug and play mesh system and its so good I've forgot I ever had it installed. Devices swap between each device that its closest to without me even noticing.
I've recommended it to a lot of people since.
But the E4 spec is very misleading. The ethernet port is 100mbps, so that is the best you’ll get around the house. It’s well hidden in their info.
"Please note if the Deco model is a product with 100Mbps Ethernet ports, the maximum speed of the Deco system is 100Mbps only".
The more expensive S4 is 1G ethernet I recall.
When I had E4 my 200mbps BB was only 100 on the E4
I sold it & replaced with S4. Now 200mbps around the house.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Deco-M4-Seamless-Coverage...
The newer S4 setup is also very well reviewed and is a similar price
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-S4-3-pack-Be...
I would go for either the M4 or the S4 in reality most people wont notice the difference between the two.
camel_landy said:
Mesh...
I use Netgear Orbi, which are as simple as a very simple thing to setup & configure. I've installed several of them and once installed, I've never really had to touch them.
For the price of the Netgear Orbi, I should hope it would set itself up, then go out and start a business, make millions for me, buy me a sprawling property on my own island, or at least a superyacht. It should put my children through private school, provide me with sound financial advice and it should drop me off at the pub and pick me up when I'm done. It should also call up Virgin Media and complain by itself when my internet goes down. Which it does with annoying regularity.I use Netgear Orbi, which are as simple as a very simple thing to setup & configure. I've installed several of them and once installed, I've never really had to touch them.
AdeTuono said:
Well that's pretty unanimous; mesh it is. Who'd have thought it was that simple? Must have taken my finger off the pulse there.
Thanks all...
Mesh is not a silver bullet ... there are some warnings in the threads posted above.Thanks all...
Best to buy from Amazon as their return policy is second to none.
JSP440 said:
I had the same issues as yourself, tried all kinds of Wi-Fi extenders and ring main extenders to no avail
some one on here recommended the following: DECO TP link system
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-E4-Seamless-...
Its a plug and play mesh system and its so good I've forgot I ever had it installed. Devices swap between each device that its closest to without me even noticing.
I've recommended it to a lot of people since.
That's exactly what I have, in what sounds like a very similar property to the OP. It works well, and I've been able to add a couple of nodes including a backwired one to the garage at the bottom of the garden so now I can watch youtube videos of how to do car stuff before I fsome one on here recommended the following: DECO TP link system
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-Deco-E4-Seamless-...
Its a plug and play mesh system and its so good I've forgot I ever had it installed. Devices swap between each device that its closest to without me even noticing.
I've recommended it to a lot of people since.
k it up 
sgrimshaw said:
AdeTuono said:
Well that's pretty unanimous; mesh it is. Who'd have thought it was that simple? Must have taken my finger off the pulse there.
Thanks all...
Mesh is not a silver bullet ... there are some warnings in the threads posted above.Thanks all...
Best to buy from Amazon as their return policy is second to none.
AdeTuono said:
I know this has been covered here before, but some of the techy stuff is a bit much for me, so apologies if we're going over old ground.
I'm just about at my wits end with my home wi-fi. My connections are constantly dropping,and I find myself re-setting various bits and pieces several times a day. All I want is a basic, straightforward, reliable system that just works. No bells and whistles; a Ford Focus, as opposed to an M5, if you like.
My main problem is that the house is old and rambling. Over three floors, but the footprint extends outwards quite a bit. I currently have a BTHub 5 which serves 1/3 of the property. I have a BT extender connected to the router feeding a Home Hotspot Flex 600 which is constantly needing to be reset. This covers an extra couple of rooms, but the rest of the house is bereft of signal, as are the garages and outbuildings.
Powerline kit doesn't work, as there are at least three separate ring mains. We're fairly rural, and on a good day will just about get 20mbps. Not even heavy users, just the usual Netflix, socials, banking etc etc.
So, what do I need for full, reliable coverage? Simple as possible, and I don't fancy chasing out walls and running cable here, there and everywhere. Can it be done? There must be an easy solution, it can't be unique by any stretch. TIA...and I have no idea what backhaul is, even after Googling it.
You're actually asking quite a lot, if you're only gaining 'a couple of rooms' from a Wifi extender.I'm just about at my wits end with my home wi-fi. My connections are constantly dropping,and I find myself re-setting various bits and pieces several times a day. All I want is a basic, straightforward, reliable system that just works. No bells and whistles; a Ford Focus, as opposed to an M5, if you like.
My main problem is that the house is old and rambling. Over three floors, but the footprint extends outwards quite a bit. I currently have a BTHub 5 which serves 1/3 of the property. I have a BT extender connected to the router feeding a Home Hotspot Flex 600 which is constantly needing to be reset. This covers an extra couple of rooms, but the rest of the house is bereft of signal, as are the garages and outbuildings.
Powerline kit doesn't work, as there are at least three separate ring mains. We're fairly rural, and on a good day will just about get 20mbps. Not even heavy users, just the usual Netflix, socials, banking etc etc.
So, what do I need for full, reliable coverage? Simple as possible, and I don't fancy chasing out walls and running cable here, there and everywhere. Can it be done? There must be an easy solution, it can't be unique by any stretch. TIA...and I have no idea what backhaul is, even after Googling it.
A mesh system only seems to offer a limited range per unit. So you chain 3 units together, each will cover at best a similar area to your router.
The main difference between mesh and extenders is that mesh uses different channels between mesh units, so the inter-unit traffic ('backhaul') isn't using up the capacity of the channels the user sees, as happens with wifi extenders.
If it's possible to run any ethernet cables, that's worth looking at.
A second router can help enormously.
It might be worth just trying a second router on a temporary ethernet cable.
It's cheap to try, cable is cheap and there are millions of unemployed routers sat in cupboards.
I've run cables outdoors before now to get signals around a 'difficult' house.
I would start by taking a laptop, plugging it into the router/modem and running Fast.com. That gives you the ADSL speed.
Then repeat right next to the router, you should get the same speed.
If the Wifi isn't keeping up with your slow ADSL close to the router, you've got a sick router or an interference problem or maybe a sick laptop/other device.
If the speed doesn't drop off in a sensible way as you go from room to room away from the router, you may get a clue as to the real problem.
One of my previous ISPs gave me a router than was really not very good. Losing that and using a D-Link one was a huge improvement.
If you've already got powerline boxes, maybe it's worth using those strategically, like maybe for the TV, if you can't run ethernet to the TV.
Getting the TV off the wifi means the TV has the best chance of seeing the interweb, and the wifi is less loaded for anyone else in the house.
Sometimes 'wifi problems' are not ordinary range/attenuation issues, but protocol errors like two devices trying to have the same address or some weird stuff to do with IPV6 which I didn't really understand. Turn most things off and see if that helps?
Some routers offer the chance to have a second 'network', with a different name and password. Putting key devices (i.e. mine) on the second network can help.
Also check the router settings, make sure it's not mysteriously set to 5GHz only or something!
Trying different channel numbers can help in cases of interference.
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