Couple of questions about mobile phone usage in car park

[ihaveaquestion]

Hi There,

I apologise if this is in the wrong section of this forum, but as a new user it is limiting where I can ask questions.
Now my questions are,

1) if a person were to park at a car park use their phone such as have it in their hand etc.. with their parking break is on but they forgot to turn the engine off before handing the phone, are they breaking the law (hand break was on before handling phone and car is stationary, just forgot to turn off engine)?

2) If a Police car drove past them during the activity in question 1, could they get a penalty notice through the letterbox OR would the Police always stop and handle the issue on the spot?

To the mods: Would you please kindly move this to the correct forum for me. I didn't want to have to wait 14 days to post it in the correct place, I apologise about that.

[babelfish]

ihaveaquestion said:

Hi There,

I apologise if this is in the wrong section of this forum, but as a new user it is limiting where I can ask questions.
Now my questions are,

1) if a person were to park at a car park use their phone such as have it in their hand etc.. with their parking break is on but they forgot to turn the engine off before handing the phone, are they breaking the law (hand break was on before handling phone and car is stationary, just forgot to turn off engine)?

2) If a Police car drove past them during the activity in question 1, could they get a penalty notice through the letterbox OR would the Police always stop and handle the issue on the spot?

To the mods: Would you please kindly move this to the correct forum for me. I didn't want to have to wait 14 days to post it in the correct place, I apologise about that.

If you are safely parked they have no reason to have any interest.

[QJumper]

babelfish said:

If you are safely parked they have no reason to have any interest.

Define "safely parked".

According the Highway Code 2. Parking (239 to 247), it says:

"you MUST switch off the engine, headlights and fog lights".

[dapprman]

QJumper said:

babelfish said:

If you are safely parked they have no reason to have any interest.

Define "safely parked".

According the Highway Code 2. Parking (239 to 247), it says:

"you MUST switch off the engine, headlights and fog lights".

This.

In theory highway code and associated laws apply to private land as well as the road (including your drive and car parks). Certain amount of reality comes down to how the police feel at the time, how much they are being a jobs worth, what has caused them to pay attention to your car and see you on the phone, and if they have approached you, how you have reacted/the conversation between you and them.

[Cat]

dapprman said:

This.

In theory highway code and associated laws apply to private land as well as the road (including your drive and car parks). Certain amount of reality comes down to how the police feel at the time, how much they are being a jobs worth, what has caused them to pay attention to your car and see you on the phone, and if they have approached you, how you have reacted/the conversation between you and them.

Unfortunately not this.

Different road taffic legislation applies to different places, there is no one size fits all answer. Some laws apply to roads, some to roads and other public places, some to public roads, some to public ways etc.

What constitutes each these places depends on a combination of statutory definition and case law.

Mobile phone legislation applies to driving a motor vehicle on a road but not to other public places. It is unlikely that a parking bay in a car park would be considered a road - Griffin v Squires [1958] 3 All ER 468.

Cat

[martinbiz]

dapprman said:

This.

In theory highway code and associated laws apply to private land as well as the road (including your drive and car parks). Certain amount of reality comes down to how the police feel at the time, how much they are being a jobs worth, what has caused them to pay attention to your car and see you on the phone, and if they have approached you, how you have reacted/the conversation between you and them.

Utter B*ll*x

[dapprman]

Cat said:

dapprman said:

This.

In theory highway code and associated laws apply to private land as well as the road (including your drive and car parks). Certain amount of reality comes down to how the police feel at the time, how much they are being a jobs worth, what has caused them to pay attention to your car and see you on the phone, and if they have approached you, how you have reacted/the conversation between you and them.

Unfortunately not this.

Different road taffic legislation applies to different places, there is no one size fits all answer. Some laws apply to roads, some to roads and other public places, some to public roads, some to public ways etc.

What constitutes each these places depends on a combination of statutory definition and case law.

Mobile phone legislation applies to driving a motor vehicle on a road but not to other public places. It is unlikely that a parking bay in a car park would be considered a road - Griffin v Squires [1958] 3 All ER 468.

Cat

However it is likely to be classed a public space - were you part quoting from here ? if so you should include more

said:

What isn’t a road?

All of these places are not roads – but watch out they could still be public places. Don’t forget the law regulates driving on a road or other public place.

A car park isn’t a road. Griffin v Squires [1958] 3 All ER 468
A yard serving several houses. Heath v Pearson [1957] Crim LR 195
A campsite isn’t a road. Dunmill v DPP [2004] EWHC 1700

What is a public place?

A car park attached to a pub when the pub is open (but not when it is closed). Sandy v Martin [1974] Crim LR 258
A railway station car park. Brewer v DPP [2004\ EWHC 355
A private field temporarily opened to watch racing. R v Collinson (1931) 23 Cr App R 49
A caravan park. DPP v Vivier [1991] 4 All ER 18
A parking bay off a public highway. Capell v DPP (1991) 155 JP 361
A lane leading from a ferry to the terminal. DPP v Coulman [193] RTR 230
The airside of area of an airport. DPP v Neville (1996) 160 JP 758
A hospital car park. DPP v Greenwood [1997] COD 278

What isn’t a public place?

A car park attached to a pub when the pub is closed. Sandy v Martin [1974] Crim LR 258
A car park at a private club. Pugh v Knipe [1972] RTR 286
A car park for a community centre where only members were authorised to park. Havell v DPP [1993] Crim LR 621
A yard for a small office building used as a car park for the office and its visitors. R v Spence [1999] RTR 353
A car park shared by several businesses with signs telling the public not to park. The driver was not entitled to use the car park. The court found that is was not a public place. Richardson v DPP [2018] EWHC 428 (Admin)
A service road maintained by the 40 properties on the road. Hallett v DPP [2011] EWHC 488 (Admin)

[SS2.]

The mobile phone legislation applies to a road, not 'or other public place'.

[Cat]

dapprman said:

However it is likely to be classed a public space

If the law regarding mobile phone use applied to roads or other public places you would maybe have a point. As it only applies to driving a motor vehicle on a road you don't.

Cat

[Aretnap]

dapprman said:

All of these places are not roads – but watch out they could still be public places. Don’t forget the law regulates driving on a road or other public place.

"The law" does no such thing. Road traffic legislation is made up of many different laws, which have many different scopes.

Some road traffic laws apply to any public place, including car parks which are used by the public (eg the requirement to have insurance, or the requirement not to drive while drunk)

Some road traffic laws apply only on a road which is used by the public, but not to other public places (eg mobile phone laws, and other construction and use offences)

Some road traffic laws apply only on a road which is maintained at public expense, and not to other roads which might be used by the public (eg the requirement to tax your vehicle)

And some road traffic laws just apply, without any particular geographic scope (eg the requirement to update your driving licence details when you change address).

[zarlak]

If the police just drove past without stopping how would they know if the engine was switched on or not?

[Bennet]

Unless there is more than you have let on, there is no way you are going to get into trouble for being on the phone whilst stationary in a car parking space.

[SydneyBridge]

Either way, I would expect the police to stop, have a chat and use their discretion, I think you are worried about nothing

[COM31E]

If they didn't stop and speak to you, I wouldn't be concerned.

[Canon_Fodder]

You often have to pay by phone for parking

[martinbiz]

Canon_Fodder said:

You often have to pay by phone for parking

Have you not read the previous 10 posts and forget the fact that 9 times out of 10 you will be out of your car and at a pay machine to pay by phone

[Canon_Fodder]

martinbiz said:

Have you not read the previous 10 posts and forget the fact that 9 times out of 10 you will be out of your car and at a pay machine to pay by phone

Rubbish.

9 times out of 10 you'll be in a familiar car park, you just sit in your car, open the app, it knows where you are, and you just select the duration and pay.

Edited by Canon_Fodder on Tuesday 3rd May 16:26

[Chuffedmonkey]

I pulled into a little Tesco this evening, I turned the engine off and checked my work emails on my phone before exiting the car. Beside me was a police car which must have pulled up as I was engaged in my emails. Guess what? He was on his phone too waiting for his colleague who went in to little Tesco. Engine running too.

[martinbiz]

martinbiz said:

Canon_Fodder said:

You often have to pay by phone for parking

Have you not read the previous 10 posts and forget the fact that 9 times out of 10 you will be out of your car and at a pay machine to pay by phone

Whatever you say, maybe you go to the same car park a lot, maybe others don't, but as I said read the previous posts, your post and your point, if you have one is irrelevant anyway