Recruitment company law/advise needed
Discussion
Dear all,
I used to work part-time in recruitment so know the basics but am in the middle of a debate on the rules within the industry and can't remember the facts 100%.
Basically, my girlfriend got a job doing temporary assistant work through a local temping agency. The company she's with had a full-time position come available which she quite fancied. The position was advertised and she applied for it (along with a few others), eventually getting the job and has now changed roles in the organisation.
She told me that her boss is about to pay the agency a % of her salary (I'm guessing between £1000-2000) as a fee. I told her to advise her boss that due to the job being advertised and due to her applying like anyone else could have that the agency now have no part of this new arrangement.
It would be nice if I am right on this as the company in question is a local charity and could do with saving the money. It would also be nice as the agency owner is a local knob and doesn't deserve any more money!...So, what happens?
I used to work part-time in recruitment so know the basics but am in the middle of a debate on the rules within the industry and can't remember the facts 100%.
Basically, my girlfriend got a job doing temporary assistant work through a local temping agency. The company she's with had a full-time position come available which she quite fancied. The position was advertised and she applied for it (along with a few others), eventually getting the job and has now changed roles in the organisation.
She told me that her boss is about to pay the agency a % of her salary (I'm guessing between £1000-2000) as a fee. I told her to advise her boss that due to the job being advertised and due to her applying like anyone else could have that the agency now have no part of this new arrangement.
It would be nice if I am right on this as the company in question is a local charity and could do with saving the money. It would also be nice as the agency owner is a local knob and doesn't deserve any more money!...So, what happens?
In legal terms there is not a lot the agency can or will do about some thing like this no matter what is written in the contract between your partner and them. I do however fail to see why the company would want to stiff the agency, as that is what you would be doing in my opinion. The fact that they are a charity and rely on there good name to make money is no reason to go around ripping companies off an neither is the fact that you appear to dislike the agent concerned.
For the 1-2k you will just ensure that that agent will no longer be willing to supply that charity with temps, and both the charity and your gf's name will be mud in certain circles for a short while. Worse case scenario is that they will decide to go to court over it in which case it could cost the charity a hell of a lot more than 1-2k though I doubt that will happen.
Bottom line IMHO (I am a recruitment consultant) is being a charity is no excuse for ripping others off. Had you stated that this agent tried to rip you off etc I would have very different views.
Sam
For the 1-2k you will just ensure that that agent will no longer be willing to supply that charity with temps, and both the charity and your gf's name will be mud in certain circles for a short while. Worse case scenario is that they will decide to go to court over it in which case it could cost the charity a hell of a lot more than 1-2k though I doubt that will happen.
Bottom line IMHO (I am a recruitment consultant) is being a charity is no excuse for ripping others off. Had you stated that this agent tried to rip you off etc I would have very different views.
Sam
Dick Dastardly said:
Dear all,
I used to work part-time in recruitment so know the basics but am in the middle of a debate on the rules within the industry and can't remember the facts 100%.
Basically, my girlfriend got a job doing temporary assistant work through a local temping agency. The company she's with had a full-time position come available which she quite fancied. The position was advertised and she applied for it (along with a few others), eventually getting the job and has now changed roles in the organisation.
She told me that her boss is about to pay the agency a % of her salary (I'm guessing between £1000-2000) as a fee. I told her to advise her boss that due to the job being advertised and due to her applying like anyone else could have that the agency now have no part of this new arrangement.
It would be nice if I am right on this as the company in question is a local charity and could do with saving the money. It would also be nice as the agency owner is a local knob and doesn't deserve any more money!...So, what happens?
If the client has signed up to that as part of the terms and conditions then, tough. However, the %age does not come out of her salary, it should be a fee over and above, the level of fee is set by a percentage of her salary. Unless I've misunderstood you.
I worked as a temp for a telesales agancy and i applied for a job full time with them and got it i was transfered over to there HR system ans had no other dealing with the agency.
Some key facts have to be known
1) did the charity advertise the job through the Recruitment Agency?
2) is there any cause in your gf contract about being emplyed by the company that she was temping for??? This could allow them to charge a fee for the loss of a temp
3) a similar clause could be with the charity when they started using temps and hence if they took a member of staff from the agency to fill a full time position then the charity will have to pay a % to the agency to cover costs
Steve
Some key facts have to be known
1) did the charity advertise the job through the Recruitment Agency?
2) is there any cause in your gf contract about being emplyed by the company that she was temping for??? This could allow them to charge a fee for the loss of a temp
3) a similar clause could be with the charity when they started using temps and hence if they took a member of staff from the agency to fill a full time position then the charity will have to pay a % to the agency to cover costs
Steve
Thanks, that's pretty much what I thought law wise.
I wouldn't say the charity would be ripping the agency off. As far as I can see it's completely reasonlable not to want to pay. If they were lying and keeping her on on her old job then it'd be unfair but seeing as she applied for a different position through an advert and not the agency then why should the charity have to pay agency fees?
I wouldn't say the charity would be ripping the agency off. As far as I can see it's completely reasonlable not to want to pay. If they were lying and keeping her on on her old job then it'd be unfair but seeing as she applied for a different position through an advert and not the agency then why should the charity have to pay agency fees?
XM5ER said:
If the client has signed up to that as part of the terms and conditions then, tough. However, the %age does not come out of her salary, it should be a fee over and above, the level of fee is set by a percentage of her salary. Unless I've misunderstood you.
Sorry if I was confusing, I knew that it'd be paid seperately to her salary
stevieb - I'll look into those areas. Thanks
>> Edited by Dick Dastardly on Tuesday 27th January 15:36
XM5ER said:
If the client has signed up to that as part of the terms and conditions then, tough. However, the %age does not come out of her salary, it should be a fee over and above, the level of fee is set by a percentage of her salary. Unless I've misunderstood you.
Think the advert was in local rag and hence she applied. and agency charging fee to the charity.
Sounds odd. There might be some money due the agency, but if I've understood what you've described, it doesn't seem likely that it should be calced on the basis of her current salary and certainly shouldn't be deducted from it.
She was provided by the temp agency to fill some role at the charity. She then applied for a DIFFERENT job at the charity. Is that correct?
If so, the agency might conceivably be due some early severance payment from the charity, but I would have thought that that was unlikely. There may have been a non-solicitation clause in the contract btwn the agency and the charity to stop them poaching staff, but again I wouldn't think that was typical either.
Perhaps the non-solicitation clause entitles the agency to a % of salary for some fixed period if a temp is poached? That might well be considered a fair arrangement.
She was provided by the temp agency to fill some role at the charity. She then applied for a DIFFERENT job at the charity. Is that correct?
If so, the agency might conceivably be due some early severance payment from the charity, but I would have thought that that was unlikely. There may have been a non-solicitation clause in the contract btwn the agency and the charity to stop them poaching staff, but again I wouldn't think that was typical either.
Perhaps the non-solicitation clause entitles the agency to a % of salary for some fixed period if a temp is poached? That might well be considered a fair arrangement.
ATG said:
She was provided by the temp agency to fill some role at the charity. She then applied for a DIFFERENT job at the charity. Is that correct?
spot on
ATG said:
Perhaps the non-solicitation clause entitles the agency to a % of salary for some fixed period if a temp is poached? That might well be considered a fair arrangement.
I think the best advice I can give her boss is to check the contract for any clauses and meet with the agency manager to talk it through.
It just seemed a bit of an unusual scenario to me so I wondered what the PH business guru's had on the subject. Cheers everyone!
DD,
E-,ail me off line and i can send you a fairly Standard TOB (Terms of Business) for 200 from a fairly large (read: the biggest worldwide) High street if you want something to compare to.
To answer your initial Question, i Think it is fairly common these days that if you want to deal with clients on an ongoing basis you treat them with a fair amount of respect.
Depending on the relationship with the Client, and in my experience if i were supplying your GF into the vacancy that that they were recruiting for i would charge a fee for her going permanent, although how you go about charging that fee is what determines good service to a poor service.
Justin
E-,ail me off line and i can send you a fairly Standard TOB (Terms of Business) for 200 from a fairly large (read: the biggest worldwide) High street if you want something to compare to.
To answer your initial Question, i Think it is fairly common these days that if you want to deal with clients on an ongoing basis you treat them with a fair amount of respect.
Depending on the relationship with the Client, and in my experience if i were supplying your GF into the vacancy that that they were recruiting for i would charge a fee for her going permanent, although how you go about charging that fee is what determines good service to a poor service.
Justin
Check the original temping contract from the agency. If there is a non-solicitation clause in it (basically a clause that says that if you become an employee of the client then the agency gets a fee) then the client is legally and morally bound to honour it.
If they want to breach this contract then that is their perogative to do so, but the agency would be well within their rights to refuse to deal with them again.
(I am not a lawyer, but being a freelancer and fighting to stay outside IR35 have made me a competent layman
)
Edit: And there I was feeling all proud of myself for using the term "non-solicitation clause" and then found that someone has used it already.
Edit2: Non-solitication clauses are absolutely standard in my line of work. It's usually to stop my company from dealing directly with the client and cutting the agent out of the loop, but in the old pre-IR35 days it was to prevent you (personally) from becoming an employee of your client.
>> Edited by JonRB on Tuesday 27th January 21:34
If they want to breach this contract then that is their perogative to do so, but the agency would be well within their rights to refuse to deal with them again.
(I am not a lawyer, but being a freelancer and fighting to stay outside IR35 have made me a competent layman
) Edit: And there I was feeling all proud of myself for using the term "non-solicitation clause" and then found that someone has used it already.
Edit2: Non-solitication clauses are absolutely standard in my line of work. It's usually to stop my company from dealing directly with the client and cutting the agent out of the loop, but in the old pre-IR35 days it was to prevent you (personally) from becoming an employee of your client.
>> Edited by JonRB on Tuesday 27th January 21:34
The agency is well within its rights to charge a fee to the company for the position.
The agreement between the 2 means that your girlfriend has been 'introduced' by the agency. It is standard practice for an agency agreement to include a clause where, even if a candidate stops temping for a company, that candidate cannot work for said company for at least 3 months without an introduction fee being charged.
What can be done:
Most contracts are negotiable. Firstly, if the company gives the agency lots of business, I would attempt to either get the agency to drop the bill totally or significantly reduce it, in order for them to maintain that company's business. Or negotiate a 'temp to perm' fee as your girlfriend had already worked there for some time.
It's always worth reminding an agency that there is a lot of other ones out there who want the placements.
You can email me if you have any questions. I can send standard terms of business (for both client and candidate) and refer you to a website that might be able to help. Yes I'm in the recruitment business.
The agreement between the 2 means that your girlfriend has been 'introduced' by the agency. It is standard practice for an agency agreement to include a clause where, even if a candidate stops temping for a company, that candidate cannot work for said company for at least 3 months without an introduction fee being charged.
What can be done:
Most contracts are negotiable. Firstly, if the company gives the agency lots of business, I would attempt to either get the agency to drop the bill totally or significantly reduce it, in order for them to maintain that company's business. Or negotiate a 'temp to perm' fee as your girlfriend had already worked there for some time.
It's always worth reminding an agency that there is a lot of other ones out there who want the placements.
You can email me if you have any questions. I can send standard terms of business (for both client and candidate) and refer you to a website that might be able to help. Yes I'm in the recruitment business.
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