Sandwich Bar - Non vat prices

[Ripley77]

My wife and I are going to be opening a small sandwich/coffee bar very soon!

I've a query regarding sit in and takeaway prices as we won't be vat registered initially.

Is it ok to have separate sit in and takeaway prices? Eg Bacon Roll £2.50 takeaway £3.50 sit in
Egg Mayo Sandwich £3.50 takeaway £4.75 sit in

Reason to cover costs of the sw bar, lighting heat, cleaning the plates etc. More involved for sitting in.

Thank you

Joe

[Eric Mc]

How you arrange your record keeping is up to you. The important thing is that -

1 - it provides you with financial data that is useful to you and the business

2 - the records can be used to put together the necessary statutory data for HMRC and (if a limited company), Companies House

[21TonyK]

From a business perspective you are free to charge your customers whatever and however you see fit for the products or services you provide.

What will determine whether it works or not is what your target market expect, will pay and what their alternative options offer.

Look at the competition.

[Countdown]

Ripley77 said:

My wife and I are going to be opening a small sandwich/coffee bar very soon!

I've a query regarding sit in and takeaway prices as we won't be vat registered initially.

Is it ok to have separate sit in and takeaway prices? Eg Bacon Roll £2.50 takeaway £3.50 sit in
Egg Mayo Sandwich £3.50 takeaway £4.75 sit in

Reason to cover costs of the sw bar, lighting heat, cleaning the plates etc. More involved for sitting in.

Thank you

Joe

Yes you can.

When you configure your cash register / EPOS you will need to have two classifications for each item e.g.

Egg May sandwich - IN = £3.00
Egg Mayo sandwich - OUT- £2.50

[dave123456]

Countdown said:

Ripley77 said:

My wife and I are going to be opening a small sandwich/coffee bar very soon!

I've a query regarding sit in and takeaway prices as we won't be vat registered initially.

Is it ok to have separate sit in and takeaway prices? Eg Bacon Roll £2.50 takeaway £3.50 sit in
Egg Mayo Sandwich £3.50 takeaway £4.75 sit in

Reason to cover costs of the sw bar, lighting heat, cleaning the plates etc. More involved for sitting in.

Thank you

Joe

Yes you can.

When you configure your cash register / EPOS you will need to have two classifications for each item e.g.

Egg May sandwich - IN = £3.00
Egg Mayo sandwich - OUT- £2.50

You’ve just repriced his core lines to make a loss…

[msport123]

Is your predicted turnover really likely to be under £85k p.a? That's only £1600ish a week, which doesn't sound enough turnover to sustain a sandwich shop. I'd imagine your turnover will need to be higher and if so, you might as well register for VAT now as you will then be able to claim back the VAT on your expenses from day 1 too.

As far as how you layout your pricing, no problem with what you propose, but I wouldn't have the gap between eat in and take out to wide. Add 20% to your take out prices to account for the VAT element.

I'm sure you already know this, but if a customer has a hot product but is taking out, VAT on that product still applies.

[21TonyK]

msport123 said:

I'm sure you already know this, but if a customer has a hot product but is taking out, VAT on that product still applies.

Unless of course it is not intended to be eaten while hot. Because we all love a cold takeaway.

#pastytax

[Pent]

TBH around bath/bristol etc seems pretty standard that you are charged to sit in and eat.

[paulrockliffe]

21TonyK said:

Unless of course it is not intended to be eaten while hot. Because we all love a cold takeaway.

#pastytax

There's no VAT on food, there is VAT on catering, the former is more akin to not dying of starvation, the later akin to receiving a service.

It isn't so much a tax on pasties, it's a clarification on where that dividing line lies that the Government felt was necessary as a result of the absolute shenanigans that the trade was getting up to.

[msport123]

21TonyK said:

Unless of course it is not intended to be eaten while hot. Because we all love a cold takeaway.

#pastytax

Yes the great pasty debacle!

Not intended to be eaten while hot is the choice of the consumer.

If the intention of the seller is to sell a hot product at point of order then VAT applies.

Greggs did a great job of whipping up a public frenzy and the revenue backed off . Still doesn't make any sense to me how you could have a piping hot pasty and no VAT applies! The grey area is if you purchase the pasty from the same batch 30 minutes later it will be luke warm. The intention of the seller at point of order is not to sell a 'hot' product, it could be piping hot or luke warm at point of order.

[jonsp]

21TonyK said:

Unless of course it is not intended to be eaten while hot. Because we all love a cold takeaway.

#pastytax

Or do what Greggs do. Take a tray of whatever out of a very hot oven and put them out to cool.

Before they've gone cold they'll have sold the whole tray, so customer gets a warm whatever but there's no VAT.

Compare to a small baker who bakes a tray in the morning then offers the customer the option of heating them up at point of sale. So they have to charge 20% VAT.

[21TonyK]

msport123 said:

21TonyK said:

Unless of course it is not intended to be eaten while hot. Because we all love a cold takeaway.

#pastytax

Yes the great pasty debacle!

Not intended to be eaten while hot is the choice of the consumer.

If the intention of the seller is to sell a hot product at point of order then VAT applies.

Greggs did a great job of whipping up a public frenzy and the revenue backed off . Still doesn't make any sense to me how you could have a piping hot pasty and no VAT applies! The grey area is if you purchase the pasty from the same batch 30 minutes later it will be luke warm. The intention of the seller at point of order is not to sell a 'hot' product, it could be piping hot or luke warm at point of order.

ISTR (and I may be wrong) but was it the case VAT was not levied on takeaway food hot or cold? Long time since I was in the food game B2C but there was always a fiddle on the go with competitors either loading one type of sale or another. Even one who claimed he had three businesses, a bar, restaurant and takeaway all under one roof.