Discussion
I'd welcome any advice from anyone with regard to buying a B&B.
1) where is the best place to search? I'm subscribed to businesses for sale and have been exploring agents who list there but am I missing something obvious?
2) does anyone have experience of running a b&b who could offer insights and things to consider.
3) when making an offer and completing a transaction are there differences to a domestic house purchase?
4) is there any mileage in buying a pub and trading it as a b&b?
Any experience that could be shared very much appreciated.
1) where is the best place to search? I'm subscribed to businesses for sale and have been exploring agents who list there but am I missing something obvious?
2) does anyone have experience of running a b&b who could offer insights and things to consider.
3) when making an offer and completing a transaction are there differences to a domestic house purchase?
4) is there any mileage in buying a pub and trading it as a b&b?
Any experience that could be shared very much appreciated.
A friend used to run one, it seems quite widespread for there to be two sets of books for such businesses to maximise profits as they learned from the person they bought off. They had a business in a small city and a lot of their income was from tradesmen who stayed for weeks doing jobs, good for the business as less laundry then people staying one night and moving on. Getting a good staff member or two who help with the cleaning and breakfasts is ideal as you can have a break for a day or two a week. They used to shut down for a month a year to have a holiday and redecorate.
They made a good amount over the ten years they ran it. I wouldn’t personally want to combine it with running a pub as the hours are too much.
They made a good amount over the ten years they ran it. I wouldn’t personally want to combine it with running a pub as the hours are too much.
Venisonpie said:
I'd welcome any advice from anyone with regard to buying a B&B.
1) where is the best place to search? I'm subscribed to businesses for sale and have been exploring agents who list there but am I missing something obvious?
2) does anyone have experience of running a b&b who could offer insights and things to consider.
3) when making an offer and completing a transaction are there differences to a domestic house purchase?
4) is there any mileage in buying a pub and trading it as a b&b?
Any experience that could be shared very much appreciated.
Are you going to be living there and operating it yourself as a lifestyle business?1) where is the best place to search? I'm subscribed to businesses for sale and have been exploring agents who list there but am I missing something obvious?
2) does anyone have experience of running a b&b who could offer insights and things to consider.
3) when making an offer and completing a transaction are there differences to a domestic house purchase?
4) is there any mileage in buying a pub and trading it as a b&b?
Any experience that could be shared very much appreciated.
We run some serviced apartments, which are not dissimilar but we don't offer breakfast. They are also in a city centre, as opposed to by the side of a picturesque lake somewhere.
The challenges we face are that, at weekends, we are often chocka, whilst we could be empty mid-week.
Our housekeepers earn more than we do. Cleaners are unreliable.
But the biggest single problem is the booking sites, with booking.com being the worst. They are staffed in far-off countries by people working from bedrooms, for whom English is a third or fourth language. They wield a great deal of power over your business. Their business model is such that their profit comes first, guest satisfaction second and the property owner a poor third.
Booking.com owes us quite a lot of money from damage claims which they have never paid. They always agree them and say that the money will be paid by XYZ date, but payment never arrives. Trying to contact anyone who can deal with it is completely impossible, deliberately we suspect.
So, if you're planning to buy a big house somewhere nice, live in it and become a small-time Basil Fawlty it might be ok. But it is a line of business with which we will not be continuing.
Louis Balfour said:
Are you going to be living there and operating it yourself as a lifestyle business?
We run some serviced apartments, which are not dissimilar but we don't offer breakfast. They are also in a city centre, as opposed to by the side of a picturesque lake somewhere.
The challenges we face are that, at weekends, we are often chocka, whilst we could be empty mid-week.
Our housekeepers earn more than we do. Cleaners are unreliable.
But the biggest single problem is the booking sites, with booking.com being the worst. They are staffed in far-off countries by people working from bedrooms, for whom English is a third or fourth language. They wield a great deal of power over your business. Their business model is such that their profit comes first, guest satisfaction second and the property owner a poor third.
Booking.com owes us quite a lot of money from damage claims which they have never paid. They always agree them and say that the money will be paid by XYZ date, but payment never arrives. Trying to contact anyone who can deal with it is completely impossible, deliberately we suspect.
So, if you're planning to buy a big house somewhere nice, live in it and become a small-time Basil Fawlty it might be ok. But it is a line of business with which we will not be continuing.
Thanks for the input. We run some serviced apartments, which are not dissimilar but we don't offer breakfast. They are also in a city centre, as opposed to by the side of a picturesque lake somewhere.
The challenges we face are that, at weekends, we are often chocka, whilst we could be empty mid-week.
Our housekeepers earn more than we do. Cleaners are unreliable.
But the biggest single problem is the booking sites, with booking.com being the worst. They are staffed in far-off countries by people working from bedrooms, for whom English is a third or fourth language. They wield a great deal of power over your business. Their business model is such that their profit comes first, guest satisfaction second and the property owner a poor third.
Booking.com owes us quite a lot of money from damage claims which they have never paid. They always agree them and say that the money will be paid by XYZ date, but payment never arrives. Trying to contact anyone who can deal with it is completely impossible, deliberately we suspect.
So, if you're planning to buy a big house somewhere nice, live in it and become a small-time Basil Fawlty it might be ok. But it is a line of business with which we will not be continuing.
My idea is to live in and offer a very small scale business that allows me to engage in my passions in a semi retirement fashion. My ideal property would be circa 4 letting rooms with a modest owners accommodation located near or within an area of interesting hikes (currently looking Exmoor and the peak district).
I would operate Friday to Monday and offer dinner, bed and breakfast with guided walks. I'd effectively look after small groups for a long weekend and provide a relaxing no stress environment where people can escape life and not have to worry about a thing.
Tuesday to Thursday would be planning and sourcing and anything else that needs attending to.
Target market would be higher end and focus would be on providing a luxury experience including an outdoor release for people who might not otherwise feel so inclined. It's niche and the aim isn't to make a ton of cash - it's just to enjoy a simpler lifestyle.
I currently live in West London with a solid and reasonably well paid job but want to transition over the next few years while I'm fit and able.
Louis Balfour said:
Are you going to be living there and operating it yourself as a lifestyle business?
We run some serviced apartments, which are not dissimilar but we don't offer breakfast. They are also in a city centre, as opposed to by the side of a picturesque lake somewhere.
The challenges we face are that, at weekends, we are often chocka, whilst we could be empty mid-week.
Our housekeepers earn more than we do. Cleaners are unreliable.
But the biggest single problem is the booking sites, with booking.com being the worst. They are staffed in far-off countries by people working from bedrooms, for whom English is a third or fourth language. They wield a great deal of power over your business. Their business model is such that their profit comes first, guest satisfaction second and the property owner a poor third.
Booking.com owes us quite a lot of money from damage claims which they have never paid. They always agree them and say that the money will be paid by XYZ date, but payment never arrives. Trying to contact anyone who can deal with it is completely impossible, deliberately we suspect.
So, if you're planning to buy a big house somewhere nice, live in it and become a small-time Basil Fawlty it might be ok. But it is a line of business with which we will not be continuing.
Agreed. Cleaners are a pain in the arse. Ensure you have a back up option. They're usually lovely people, but their own lives and issues will always take precedence over your business. If you have family, or friends with motivated teenagers who want to earn some money, use them. We run some serviced apartments, which are not dissimilar but we don't offer breakfast. They are also in a city centre, as opposed to by the side of a picturesque lake somewhere.
The challenges we face are that, at weekends, we are often chocka, whilst we could be empty mid-week.
Our housekeepers earn more than we do. Cleaners are unreliable.
But the biggest single problem is the booking sites, with booking.com being the worst. They are staffed in far-off countries by people working from bedrooms, for whom English is a third or fourth language. They wield a great deal of power over your business. Their business model is such that their profit comes first, guest satisfaction second and the property owner a poor third.
Booking.com owes us quite a lot of money from damage claims which they have never paid. They always agree them and say that the money will be paid by XYZ date, but payment never arrives. Trying to contact anyone who can deal with it is completely impossible, deliberately we suspect.
So, if you're planning to buy a big house somewhere nice, live in it and become a small-time Basil Fawlty it might be ok. But it is a line of business with which we will not be continuing.
Long term and repeat bookings are your friend. Booking.com etc will eat into your margins with their commission.
I've actually found Booking.com to be pretty good on the support front, but they do make some ludicrous decisions on occasion. I had a guest leave a review score of 3 because the bells of Bath Abbey are too loud and there are seagulls in the city centre....they wouldn't remove the review. I've found Air BnB to be utterly useless at customer support. However, you'll need to use both platforms.
The key thing is customer service. Fawlty Towers worked well because it's what people are used to. I'm always on call, always message the guests a few days before arrival and find out why they're coming and if they need any information. It translates into great reviews and repeat custom.
There's plenty of education programs out there for serviced accommodation, so I'm sure there's a provider for traditional B&B education. Definitely worth investing in a bit of knowledge. Also, networking. Get along to some local property networking groups and get to know local SA providers as they will often be overbooked and have business to pass on in the knowledge that as a trusted contact you'll repeat the favour in the same circumstances.
Be prepared for your mates to start calling you Basil.
Quick edit to say I do Serviced Acommodation, not traditional B&B
Venisonpie said:
I'd welcome any advice from anyone with regard to buying a B&B.
What experience do you have in the hospitality trade? If the answer is "none" then make sure you get some experience before jumping in.The biggest problems are the hours and the people, which can both be significant issues. Then there's the question of seasonality.
The suggestion from someone earlier in this thread of being close to places where guests can get breakfast is a good one.
Many people think they want to run a pub or run a B&B. Most of them quite quickly find out they don't want to be in that business at all.
we have a number of clients who do all sorts of types of booked accommodation- booking.com / Air B&B etc will help you a bit initially but take a big chunk of your income - bear in mind that if everyone is on there it might be more challenging to get bookings than through Google as they will showcase your competitors as alternatives…
best pattern we have found is to start using the booking platforms but in parallel set up your own website snd booking system (software such as Planyo will sync with Air B&B / booking.com etc.) and then work hard on building your own clientele / repeat bookings/ etc. to eventually ditch the platforms and take your own bookings - we have clients who are making £20k+ more per property doing this, but you need to be good at marketing…
best pattern we have found is to start using the booking platforms but in parallel set up your own website snd booking system (software such as Planyo will sync with Air B&B / booking.com etc.) and then work hard on building your own clientele / repeat bookings/ etc. to eventually ditch the platforms and take your own bookings - we have clients who are making £20k+ more per property doing this, but you need to be good at marketing…
I owned an 8 bedroom B&B, pub and restaurant in the Yorkshire dales. Now have a holiday let so I know a bit.
It’s bloody hard work.
Your niche idea I don’t think will work. We tried exactly the same thing. Zero chance of bookings. Where would you advertise?
AirB&B is ok. Booking.com take 17.5% plus VAT.
Don’t bother with evening meals unless you are a very good chef.
Cut breakfast down to continental. It saves loads of time and effort.
I hate the general public now. That started when I was a builder working for them then I really got to hate them at the pub.
It’s bloody hard work.
Your niche idea I don’t think will work. We tried exactly the same thing. Zero chance of bookings. Where would you advertise?
AirB&B is ok. Booking.com take 17.5% plus VAT.
Don’t bother with evening meals unless you are a very good chef.
Cut breakfast down to continental. It saves loads of time and effort.
I hate the general public now. That started when I was a builder working for them then I really got to hate them at the pub.
My wife and I owned one for 3 years in Scarborough. It had 5 bedrooms. As mentioned elsewhere it’s bloody hard work.
We got up to 2nd out of 187 B&Bs in the area on tripadvisor then over night they “changed the algorithm” and we went down to 67th! We didn’t pay for tripadvisor, those at the top do!
Make sure you look into the licenses like PPL/PRS, TV licenses etc for commercial properties, this and booking site fees munch into profit.
It could depend on the clientele or area but the B&Bs around us were racing to the bottom price wise.
All in though we did it. We did OK at it, but the joy of working back in the real world and getting a regular wage and paid holidays is lovely!
We got up to 2nd out of 187 B&Bs in the area on tripadvisor then over night they “changed the algorithm” and we went down to 67th! We didn’t pay for tripadvisor, those at the top do!
Make sure you look into the licenses like PPL/PRS, TV licenses etc for commercial properties, this and booking site fees munch into profit.
It could depend on the clientele or area but the B&Bs around us were racing to the bottom price wise.
All in though we did it. We did OK at it, but the joy of working back in the real world and getting a regular wage and paid holidays is lovely!
akirk said:
or you enjoy hosting people in your home?
a good B&B is not a down-market hotel, it is a professional hosting in someone's house...
I think this is the key for me, I love to feed and entertain people. A B&B can be many things and there's the opportunity to provide something that is beyond a nights sleep and a fry up. a good B&B is not a down-market hotel, it is a professional hosting in someone's house...
I also conduct guided walks for work colleagues at weekends which have gone down really well, turning all of this into a lifestyle business would mean I never work again since they're the things I do anyway. I also like people and have worked in customer and stakeholder facing environments for over 30 years - dealing the general public doesn't faze me. I fully understand that it's not for everyone however and appreciate some of the more challenging insights provided - all things to bear in mind.
akirk said:
Hitch said:
I've never got the dream of buying a B&B. You're basically signing up to clean and cook for people who can't afford a hotel.
or you enjoy hosting people in your home?a good B&B is not a down-market hotel, it is a professional hosting in someone's house...
I stayed in a super B&B in Florence last night, for a short business trip. It was on the first floor of an old apartment building. There is a sort of reception, but it is mostly self check-in. There is one member of staff, who does the change-overs, reception and breakfast. The quality was superb, and far better than many Italian hotels I’ve stayed in. But because they don’t have hotel overheads it is cheap. The owner lives elsewhere and does everything by WhatsApp.
In fact a good B&B I would say is better than a so-so hotel. If you don’t need a bar, communal seating and full hotel services, a B&B can offer more spacious and better accommodation as a value proposition.
Louis Balfour said:
It doesn’t have to be the host’s home.
I stayed in a super B&B in Florence last night, for a short business trip. It was on the first floor of an old apartment building. There is a sort of reception, but it is mostly self check-in. There is one member of staff, who does the change-overs, reception and breakfast. The quality was superb, and far better than many Italian hotels I’ve stayed in. But because they don’t have hotel overheads it is cheap. The owner lives elsewhere and does everything by WhatsApp.
In fact a good B&B I would say is better than a so-so hotel. If you don’t need a bar, communal seating and full hotel services, a B&B can offer more spacious and better accommodation as a value proposition.
And this is another way of doing things, I stayed in a similar place in Porto recently. It was booked to a price as I was on the lash for 2 days and just needed somewhere to crash - no need on this occasion for a fancy hotel.I stayed in a super B&B in Florence last night, for a short business trip. It was on the first floor of an old apartment building. There is a sort of reception, but it is mostly self check-in. There is one member of staff, who does the change-overs, reception and breakfast. The quality was superb, and far better than many Italian hotels I’ve stayed in. But because they don’t have hotel overheads it is cheap. The owner lives elsewhere and does everything by WhatsApp.
In fact a good B&B I would say is better than a so-so hotel. If you don’t need a bar, communal seating and full hotel services, a B&B can offer more spacious and better accommodation as a value proposition.
lrdisco said:
I owned an 8 bedroom B&B, pub and restaurant in the Yorkshire dales. Now have a holiday let so I know a bit.
It’s bloody hard work.
Your niche idea I don’t think will work. We tried exactly the same thing. Zero chance of bookings. Where would you advertise?
All businesses are bloody hard work to begin with. It’s bloody hard work.
Your niche idea I don’t think will work. We tried exactly the same thing. Zero chance of bookings. Where would you advertise?
When starting a business no more Weekends many hours and a lot of stress. Reward comes later.
Edited by NickZ24 on Wednesday 29th November 23:10
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