Starting a retail guitar repair shop
Discussion
At the kind invitation of jeremyc I am starting a new thread about a topic first raised on the 'Gone very quiet' thread.
This is it-
Anyway, if anyone is wondering why I would do such a thing rather than work from a garage/home workshop (which is what I am doing at the moment, through force of circumstances) or work from a trading estate unit (I gave the one I was renting up just before last Christmas, then I will be happy to explain here.
This is it-
singlecoil said:
I'm reading the posts on this thread with much interest, as I'm contemplating renting a shop and starting a guitar repair business. Although the economy isn't doing well right now there's very little serious competition in my field and I would be looking to have a strong mail order element as well.
One of the issues will be insurance, I'll want to be able to offer insured courier pickup and collection of customer guitars and I reckon I will need a policy that will cover that sort of risk (as well as the shop, public liability etc).
I didn't expect to attract any particular interest but it didn't turn out that way One of the issues will be insurance, I'll want to be able to offer insured courier pickup and collection of customer guitars and I reckon I will need a policy that will cover that sort of risk (as well as the shop, public liability etc).
Anyway, if anyone is wondering why I would do such a thing rather than work from a garage/home workshop (which is what I am doing at the moment, through force of circumstances) or work from a trading estate unit (I gave the one I was renting up just before last Christmas, then I will be happy to explain here.
DSLiverpool said:
I had a thought to mention taking space in an established music shop, could be a win win?
It is entirely reasonable to think that, but it's not a good thing from the shop's point of view. Every square inch of most guitar shops will be taken up by products that they sell, and on which they can make quite a good margin. Losing some of that space could cost them quite a lot, and they would want to make that back somehow.They would much prefer you to buy a new guitar than to have your old one fixed.
singlecoil said:
They would much prefer you to buy a new guitar than to have your old one fixed.
Have you done a spreadsheet showing how much throughput and at what hourly rate you're going to need in order to break even? I'd expect the answer to be terrifying.Why would you need the expense of a shop to do guitar repairs? It cries out for "do it at home".
Why are there no tv/hifi repair shops these days?
Why do most bicycle repair shops go bust?
singlecoil said:
DSLiverpool said:
I had a thought to mention taking space in an established music shop, could be a win win?
It is entirely reasonable to think that, but it's not a good thing from the shop's point of view. Every square inch of most guitar shops will be taken up by products that they sell, and on which they can make quite a good margin. Losing some of that space could cost them quite a lot, and they would want to make that back somehow.They would much prefer you to buy a new guitar than to have your old one fixed.
Panamax said:
singlecoil said:
They would much prefer you to buy a new guitar than to have your old one fixed.
Have you done a spreadsheet showing how much throughput and at what hourly rate you're going to need in order to break even? I'd expect the answer to be terrifying.Why would you need the expense of a shop to do guitar repairs? It cries out for "do it at home".
Why are there no tv/hifi repair shops these days?
Why do most bicycle repair shops go bust?
One thing that has cropped up in the past is when I'm dealing with one customer and another one arrives. I need a bit of space to cope with that situation.
I can pretty quickly work out how much I need to earn per day for any given property, so I will of course be bearing that in mind.
The world of guitars is somewhat different to bicycles etc. How much could you sell a bike that was fifty years old (and looked it) for? People pay extra to have their new guitars made to look like that, 'relics' or 'roadworn', they call them.
I replied to your previous post, and suggested working from home, saying that it worked for me (clock repairs) and my next door neighbour ( hairdressing).
I'll add my brother to that. He has, for 40 years, built custom motorbikes and scooters. At one point he employed half a dozen people in an industrial unit. It all got a bit too much, so when he moved house, he started working on his own, from home.
He has a double garage as a workshop, a couple of sheds for a spray booth and storage, and a spare bedroom as an office.
He does a bit of machining, welding/fabrication, and custom airbrushing and spraying. A bit of noise and plenty of paint fumes. Never had a problem with neighbours or the authorities.
As for shops, a local-ish clockmaker is renting premises for £700 a month, plus rates, utilities, etc. Plenty of space for him to work, but parking is a nightmare, and the overheads means he's working one week a month just to pay the bills.
Another one seems to be making a go of it with a shop, but I think his rent is stupidly low - edge of town premises with limited passing trade, up north.
All the clock repair shops that I've known of in the South and Southwest seemed to have closed down. Rent is a killer, and passing trade is a mixed blessing for a one man business. Nothing worse than timewasters and dreamers popping in while you are trying to get some paying work done.
I'll add my brother to that. He has, for 40 years, built custom motorbikes and scooters. At one point he employed half a dozen people in an industrial unit. It all got a bit too much, so when he moved house, he started working on his own, from home.
He has a double garage as a workshop, a couple of sheds for a spray booth and storage, and a spare bedroom as an office.
He does a bit of machining, welding/fabrication, and custom airbrushing and spraying. A bit of noise and plenty of paint fumes. Never had a problem with neighbours or the authorities.
As for shops, a local-ish clockmaker is renting premises for £700 a month, plus rates, utilities, etc. Plenty of space for him to work, but parking is a nightmare, and the overheads means he's working one week a month just to pay the bills.
Another one seems to be making a go of it with a shop, but I think his rent is stupidly low - edge of town premises with limited passing trade, up north.
All the clock repair shops that I've known of in the South and Southwest seemed to have closed down. Rent is a killer, and passing trade is a mixed blessing for a one man business. Nothing worse than timewasters and dreamers popping in while you are trying to get some paying work done.
clockworks said:
...He does a bit of machining, welding/fabrication, and custom airbrushing and spraying. A bit of noise and plenty of paint fumes. Never had a problem with neighbours or the authorities...
I'm glad to hear it.But the risk of falling foul of the planning authorities isn't the only reason. I have an insulated workshop space inside my garage at the moment, and it simply isn't big enough. So if I'm going to take this where I think it can go I have to get somewhere that is big enough. Which means a trading estate unit, a workshop on a farm, or a shop. I don't want to have to pay for, or heat, more than 500 sq ft and I don't want the high ceiling typically found in normal units. I've had that before and all the expensive heat goes up in the roof where it does me no good.
Believe me, I've looked, and looked hard. I've combed through EG Property link where most commercial premises are listed, and the costs really aren't that much less than a shop, and sometimes they're even more expensive.
As mentioned previously, I've done all the different options and the one that worked best was the shop. I think it can work again. I get that working from home is the best option for you but I don't think it's the best for me.
singlecoil said:
Which means a trading estate unit, a workshop on a farm, or a shop.
The first two make some sense, but is a shop (which implies 'High Street') going to be cheaper? I suspect not. A shop is for people to walk in and out of easily but you're already talking about couriers and insurance. If they have to post it to you you can be anywhere.BTW insurance cover of £1,000 with DHL is £50.
I think you might struggle to find a shop, particularly if you you are doing noisy and messy work. You might fall foul of the planning use granted for a typical retail shop?
I can't imagine many landlords would want to rent a retail unit for someone to use as a workshop. Whilst there are many examples out there like that with bike repairs etc, that seems a much smaller and quieter process than machinery and power tools needed to make and repair guitars.
Kind of screaming out for a unit on a farm or a 'Maker's space' type place.
I don't think a high street presence would be necessarily advantageous for something quite niche. I'm not sure passing trade is going to be a big thing for guitar repairs and sales.
Loads of farm diversification going on at the moment, think that would be a good place to look. Tend to be a bit no-frills, but you'll get more space for your money and will get parking/van space for couriers etc.
I can't imagine many landlords would want to rent a retail unit for someone to use as a workshop. Whilst there are many examples out there like that with bike repairs etc, that seems a much smaller and quieter process than machinery and power tools needed to make and repair guitars.
Kind of screaming out for a unit on a farm or a 'Maker's space' type place.
I don't think a high street presence would be necessarily advantageous for something quite niche. I'm not sure passing trade is going to be a big thing for guitar repairs and sales.
Loads of farm diversification going on at the moment, think that would be a good place to look. Tend to be a bit no-frills, but you'll get more space for your money and will get parking/van space for couriers etc.
This is getting tedious.
Can we restrict the discussion to retail shops please. I've already explained why I don't want (another) trading estate unit. Or a shed, garage or, by extension, a Portakabin.
I already know a lot about the subject, have experienced it in various forms, and have been thinking about it for a long time.
Can we restrict the discussion to retail shops please. I've already explained why I don't want (another) trading estate unit. Or a shed, garage or, by extension, a Portakabin.
I already know a lot about the subject, have experienced it in various forms, and have been thinking about it for a long time.
It would be helpful if you stood still. You started off in the other thread by saying you're starting a guitar repair business, Enough of us know that to be a workshop/shed thing, hence why you got a lot of noise about wanting an expensive industrial unit/retail space which is over the top for what you yourself stated you were planning.
Now it's wanting to make stuff, with lathes & spraying, talk about moving the goal posts! I feel this thread is not for soliciting advice but self justification, it's the impression created. I hope you do it & make a go of things but a little more straight dealing & less defensiveness will be your best business partner - no one here wants you to fail & there are a lot of experienced folk willing to be tapped up for advice foc. Up to you to leverage them
Now it's wanting to make stuff, with lathes & spraying, talk about moving the goal posts! I feel this thread is not for soliciting advice but self justification, it's the impression created. I hope you do it & make a go of things but a little more straight dealing & less defensiveness will be your best business partner - no one here wants you to fail & there are a lot of experienced folk willing to be tapped up for advice foc. Up to you to leverage them
Sorry if I missed it... whereabouts are you?
If you're doing anything overly noisy / smelly, etc - a high street shop unit won't likely work. Depends on who the landlord is and proximity to neighbouring units etc.
Rural land owners often pop up units for just this type of business. Any type of workshop would work.
The guitar guy doing similar to what you've suggested (bar the noisy stuff) - and in a high street location is Sam in Chester. Have a look at what he's doing and see if anything translates:
https://instagram.com/samsguitars
If you're doing anything overly noisy / smelly, etc - a high street shop unit won't likely work. Depends on who the landlord is and proximity to neighbouring units etc.
Rural land owners often pop up units for just this type of business. Any type of workshop would work.
The guitar guy doing similar to what you've suggested (bar the noisy stuff) - and in a high street location is Sam in Chester. Have a look at what he's doing and see if anything translates:
https://instagram.com/samsguitars
President Merkin said:
It would be helpful if you stood still. You started off in the other thread by saying you're starting a guitar repair business, Enough of us know that to be a workshop/shed thing, hence why you got a lot of noise about wanting an expensive industrial unit/retail space which is over the top for what you yourself stated you were planning.
Now it's wanting to make stuff, with lathes & spraying, talk about moving the goal posts! I feel this thread is not for soliciting advice but self justification, it's the impression created. I hope you do it & make a go of things but a little more straight dealing & less defensiveness will be your best business partner - no one here wants you to fail & there are a lot of experienced folk willing to be tapped up for advice foc. Up to you to leverage them
Well said. Sorry but I won't be investing.Now it's wanting to make stuff, with lathes & spraying, talk about moving the goal posts! I feel this thread is not for soliciting advice but self justification, it's the impression created. I hope you do it & make a go of things but a little more straight dealing & less defensiveness will be your best business partner - no one here wants you to fail & there are a lot of experienced folk willing to be tapped up for advice foc. Up to you to leverage them
vdn said:
That appears to be a guitar shop. My plan is for a guitar repair shop.Shows you didn't look passed first appearance. He's a known repairer... that's a major part of it. He often restores and sells guitars yes.
LINK: https://samsguitars.com/about/
Good luck.
LINK: https://samsguitars.com/about/
Good luck.
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