New super car - requires funding

[madibav8]

I have been working on a 200mph luxury super car for 4 years, and am ready to complete the prototype, and put thro final testing ready for production.

However, funding is now required to raise the £250-£300,000 to complete 3 demo units, and go into production.

Has anybody any advice as to business Angels/Investors with a passion for sports cars, or anybody interested in buying 30% @ £10,000/% (could find 30 investers @ 10K each?)

The project shows excellent viablility at a RRP of £64,995/ unit , assuming 100 sales pa by year 3.

See www.madiba.co.uk for rough illustration, but more pics, financial models etc. to interested parties by emailing me on [e-mail].

[Insurance_jon]

how can you sell 30% of the company 30 times

[steviebee]

Suggest you watch The Dragons Den (BBC2, Tuesday's 8.00pm)

Can't work out why, when you need £250k, you're only looking for £10k investment.

Some venture capital companies might take a look but you'd be looking to hand over at least 75% of your business.

Private investors might allow you to keep more but they will be business people first, car nuts second. Thus, you need the following:

• Proof of your engineering credentials
• A viable and realistic business plan
• What is different about the vehicle compared to its competitors

If all you have is a picture and an idea, forget it! The Dragon's Den shows that those who are successful are a very long way down the road to launch than those who just turn up with what they think will be the "next big thing!"

But good luck anyway!

(PS - I don't like the lights!!)

[hugoagogo]

10000$/%

so 10k per percentage point

bargain, do you want cash?

[madibav8]

Insurance_jon said:

how can you sell 30% of the company 30 times

30%@£10,000/% = £300,000. 30 x 1% @ £10,000 /1% = £300,000. Selling equity in 1% bites at a value of £10,000 each might make it easier to raise capital, rather than getting one ivestor to buy the whole 30%. This is only an alternative, although it would be nice to sell shares twice!.

[madibav8]

steviebee said:

Suggest you watch The Dragons Den (BBC2, Tuesday's 8.00pm) Can't work out why, when you need £250k, you're only looking for £10k investment. Some venture capital companies might take a look but you'd be looking to hand over at least 75% of your business. Private investors might allow you to keep more but they will be business people first, car nuts second. Thus, you need the following: • Proof of your engineering credentials • A viable and realistic business plan • What is different about the vehicle compared to its competitors If all you have is a picture and an idea, forget it! The Dragon's Den shows that those who are successful are a very long way down the road to launch than those who just turn up with what they think will be the "next big thing!" But good luck anyway! (PS - I don't like the lights!!)

[madibav8]

steviebee said:

Suggest you watch The Dragons Den (BBC2, Tuesday's 8.00pm) Can't work out why, when you need £250k, you're only looking for £10k investment. Some venture capital companies might take a look but you'd be looking to hand over at least 75% of your business. Private investors might allow you to keep more but they will be business people first, car nuts second. Thus, you need the following: • Proof of your engineering credentials • A viable and realistic business plan • What is different about the vehicle compared to its competitors If all you have is a picture and an idea, forget it! The Dragon's Den shows that those who are successful are a very long way down the road to launch than those who just turn up with what they think will be the "next big thing!" But good luck anyway! (PS - I don't like the lights!!)

Looking for £10,000 per 1% of equity, with 25% - 30% equity avilable.

Dragons Den very entertaining, but anybody making decisions by being bullied on the spot like that should not go into business. Some of the presentation are frightening.

Fortunately, I have a little more data available, including a running car (needs updating - hence the cash requirment.

Head lamps from the celica - picture very rough as nose/lights are superimposed to rest of car. Have more representative pictures, but all show car looking scruffy.

Thanks for the feedback.

[madibav8]

hugoagogo said:

10000$/% so 10k per percentage point bargain, do you want cash?

£10,000 / 1% of equity. 30% will cost £300,000.

Cash is fine...as long as it's not from Nigeria!

[steviebee]

madibav8 said:

steviebee said: Suggest you watch The Dragons Den (BBC2, Tuesday's 8.00pm) Can't work out why, when you need £250k, you're only looking for £10k investment. Some venture capital companies might take a look but you'd be looking to hand over at least 75% of your business. Private investors might allow you to keep more but they will be business people first, car nuts second. Thus, you need the following: • Proof of your engineering credentials • A viable and realistic business plan • What is different about the vehicle compared to its competitors If all you have is a picture and an idea, forget it! The Dragon's Den shows that those who are successful are a very long way down the road to launch than those who just turn up with what they think will be the "next big thing!" But good luck anyway! (PS - I don't like the lights!!) Looking for £10,000 per 1% of equity, with 25% - 30% equity avilable. Dragons Den very entertaining, but anybody making decisions by being bullied on the spot like that should not go into business. Some of the presentation are frightening. Fortunately, I have a little more data available, including a running car (needs updating - hence the cash requirment. Head lamps from the celica - picture very rough as nose/lights are superimposed to rest of car. Have more representative pictures, but all show car looking scruffy. Thanks for the feedback.

Dragons Den is also about good telly! The Women who developed the flower carrier was approached by one of the "Dragons" off-air with a funding proposition and I hear the guy with the helicopetr thing also got some money ......but that clearly made for bland TV!!

I forgot to mention Business Link as a source of funding info. Some are better than others but try your local one and see what they come up with.

[john75]

Having been involved in a Supercar project and having some involvement with one at the moment all I can say is tread carefully.

[madibav8]

steviebee said:

madibav8 said: steviebee said: Suggest you watch The Dragons Den (BBC2, Tuesday's 8.00pm) Can't work out why, when you need £250k, you're only looking for £10k investment. Some venture capital companies might take a look but you'd be looking to hand over at least 75% of your business. Private investors might allow you to keep more but they will be business people first, car nuts second. Thus, you need the following: • Proof of your engineering credentials • A viable and realistic business plan • What is different about the vehicle compared to its competitors If all you have is a picture and an idea, forget it! The Dragon's Den shows that those who are successful are a very long way down the road to launch than those who just turn up with what they think will be the "next big thing!" But good luck anyway! (PS - I don't like the lights!!) Looking for £10,000 per 1% of equity, with 25% - 30% equity avilable. Dragons Den very entertaining, but anybody making decisions by being bullied on the spot like that should not go into business. Some of the presentation are frightening. Fortunately, I have a little more data available, including a running car (needs updating - hence the cash requirment. Head lamps from the celica - picture very rough as nose/lights are superimposed to rest of car. Have more representative pictures, but all show car looking scruffy. Thanks for the feedback. Dragons Den is also about good telly! The Women who developed the flower carrier was approached by one of the "Dragons" off-air with a funding proposition and I hear the guy with the helicopetr thing also got some money ......but that clearly made for bland TV!! I forgot to mention Business Link as a source of funding info. Some are better than others but try your local one and see what they come up with.

Thanks again for your useful advice. This has gone beyond BCC and Business Link, but they were very helpful in getting me to this stage, particularly helping with sponsorship to South Africa to meet suppliers.

We have all the component and supplier deals in place , export incentives agreed ( building in South Africa ), and all marketing /business plans and financial models finalised.

We just need capital to implement the final specification upgrades, complete trials, and off we go. Hmmm....Dragons Den.....I wonder...

[madibav8]

john75 said:

Having been involved in a Supercar project and having some involvement with one at the moment all I can say is tread carefully.

It is such a fine balance, knowing who to trust, and who not to, and I have taken my fair share of leaps of faith. I have met some very dogy charachters over the past 4 years, been made some amasing promises, and met a hell of a lot of dreamers.

Fortunately, the team are very well clued up, and well connected (and respected) so touch wood, we have been very lucky.

I have even considered selling the project on to an existing manufacturer as an 'almost ready to fly'package. It would save them a fortune in R&D!

Would like to talk more if you are interested?

[lanciachris]

Crazy picture. Looks like a 7th gen celica crossbred with a noble and an mr2.

[Martin_S]

Sorry to be pessimistic, but every year there are a dozen new 'supercars' announced which sink without trace.

Make your business plan stack up with sales in single figures, never mind 100 per annum, by year 3 and you might stand a chance - unless you have some seriously big name chassis engineers on board, in which case, to be blunt, you need to invest in a decent professional stylist. I'm with Lanciachris, I'm afraid - the current car looks very disjointed and ungainly.

[mindgam3]

do you have any CAD and CFD models of the aero package and general styling? Any scale models been wind tunnel tested or at least put through CAD wind tunnels?

Whats the V8 based on? What have you modified? Have you dynoed/tested it?

What's your engineering background? Who are you working with? How much of it is individual to your model? Who's part bins are you raiding?

Looks too much like a souped up supra to me :P

>> Edited by mindgam3 on Sunday 23 January 17:52

[toppstuff]

lanciachris said:

Crazy picture. Looks like a 7th gen celica crossbred with a noble and an mr2.

Sorry to be harsh, but on the strength of the design of the car and its presentation on that website, it looks like a hopeless cause.

Ugly car, poorly presented.

Sorry dude, but business Angels won't look at the proposal until it is much better resolved and backed up with some engineering and design integrity.

Look at Noble for an example. Maybe not the best looking car in the world, but possessed of substantial engineering integrity ( Lee Noble was a race car engineer ) which meant that the backers knew that the car would work well. Critical also to the success of Noble is the very well thought -through operating model of the business, which uses South African manufacture of all bodyshells to ensure high quality at a lower unti cost - and so ensures that Noble earn a decent margin on each car sufficient to move forward with new models.

Good luck mate. This task you have taken on is probably one of the most difficult things you could do.

Other new outfits, like Farboud for example, have millions of £ available to them from other succesful businesses the founders own.

[mindgam3]

Noble is probably the worst person to compare... he does everything without the aid of CFD or CAD, all with his previous knowledge... to be honest he's lucky he's got as far as he has, he had to physically drive his car to the autocar(?) HQ and wouldnt leave before they tested and reviewed it as no one would take him seriously.... just as well they found it to be an amazing car

But the noble is in about the same price bracket as this... along with TVR's and 911's.... I dont see much hope to be honest

[madibav8]

mindgam3 said:

do you have any CAD and CFD models of the aero package and general styling? Any scale models been wind tunnel tested or at least put through CAD wind tunnels? Whats the V8 based on? What have you modified? Have you dynoed/tested it? What's your engineering background? Who are you working with? How much of it is individual to your model? Who's part bins are you raiding? Looks too much like a souped up supra to me :P Very pertinant ( and intelligent ) questions. The early shape (flatter nose, lower roof line), did go through model wind tunnel testing up to 230 mph with slight nose lifting. Nose changed to current shape with no lifting, no wing required. The project was 'inherited', and as such we have to carry out some reverse engineering to get onto CAD, so we can finalise venturi floorpan design, and produce moulds and componant integration templates. 12 cars were built for customers before I got involved (and 15 of forerunner design), all of which had quality issues, and I was originally a customer, but straight away started a complete redesign and component selection process. Your'e right about parts being borrowed, just like Aston, TVR, Noble, Jaguar et al, my remit in selection being that EVERY part must be available world wide, off the shelf from a major manufacturer, with at least a 9 year shelf life. We have used Ford, VW/Audi, PSA and GM.+ our own interior trimming to hide some of the origination and blend them together. The dial faces are our own design, but with off the shelf dials. The enigine is a Chevy 350" (5.7ltr)which has been developed by a racing engine company in the USA, with standard ACdelco/GM componant upgrades (no gas flowing or specialist profiling involved,not even CNC) just off the shelf upgrades. It is fuel injected, and emmission friendly to Euro 5 levels; developes 450 bhp at 6,000 rpm, 450ft/lb at 4700 rpm (380 at 2500 rpm). Each engine is delivered with a dyno report. Car weighs 1000kg max. (this gives 460 bhp/tonne - Ferrari 360 has about 300bhp / tonne). This supplier builds engines up to 2,500 bhp for drag racers/power boats, and is one of the most sophisticated builders in the USA, having chryogenic chambers, and ceramic coaters (we don't use either). The whole philosphy of the car is KISS, in an attempt to keep maintainance costs down to Ford Focus levels, but performance in the 200mph supercar league, all for less than £65,000. The chassis has been through finite strees analysis, and is one of the most straight forward designs I have seen (nothing like Lee's Ultima chassis!). This project startd in in Cape Town (before Lee got out to Port Elizabeth), and for the same reasons it will stay there; low overheads, exchange rates, export incentives, language, RHD home market, and great testing facilities at Kilarny race track. My background is marketing, and as a client, I could see the potential, if it was engineered correctly, and more attention was taken in making the driver feel he was driving something very special, but very practical in supercar terms. One minute golf clubs in boot, the next, one could attaned a track day, pump up the tyres, don a helmet, and cream the so called specialist cars. Supported by original production assistant with intimate knowledge of original design who will head up prodcution as he would have wished originally. Also on board,the world motorsport sales manager of major componant supplier to all F1, WRC and NASCAR teams. Had his own UK company building and selling a kit car, very popular on the race track. Expert in chassis, suspension and fluid engineering. Final member of team from SA, consultant responsible for prototype development for many VW/ Rover componants. Email me on [e-mail], and I'll send some better pictures. I had no intetntion of putting up a web site, but an unanounced article in an SA web mag forced me to throw it up quickly. This has all been done on a shoe string. We know the car goes, I've taken the early model (300 bhp) around Kilarny, and compared to my esprit turbo and 944 turbo, it makes a mockery of performance handling, but drives like a purring tiger on the road..Awesome. >> Edited by mindgam3 on Sunday 23 January 17:52

[madibav8]

toppstuff said:

lanciachris said: Crazy picture. Looks like a 7th gen celica crossbred with a noble and an mr2. Sorry to be harsh, but on the strength of the design of the car and its presentation on that website, it looks like a hopeless cause. Ugly car, poorly presented. Sorry dude, but business Angels won't look at the proposal until it is much better resolved and backed up with some engineering and design integrity. Look at Noble for an example. Maybe not the best looking car in the world, but possessed of substantial engineering integrity ( Lee Noble was a race car engineer ) which meant that the backers knew that the car would work well. Critical also to the success of Noble is the very well thought -through operating model of the business, which uses South African manufacture of all bodyshells to ensure high quality at a lower unti cost - and so ensures that Noble earn a decent margin on each car sufficient to move forward with new models. Good luck mate. This task you have taken on is probably one of the most difficult things you could do. Other new outfits, like Farboud for example, have millions of £ available to them from other succesful businesses the founders own. Thanks for the feedback, I'm getting quite thick skinned nowadays... see reply to Mindgram 3.