Discussion
With starting up an online retail store, I am going to be in need of a constant supply of decent boxes. Any advice on where to get good boxes for cheap and in bulk? The size of a football in most cases.
I realise that I can get them free if I go asking around and it might be a good option but on an ongoing basis; it might not be ideal. Any tips appreciated.
I realise that I can get them free if I go asking around and it might be a good option but on an ongoing basis; it might not be ideal. Any tips appreciated.
AH - I found this where it seems the question was answered: http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Corrugated is one of the classic leverage markets, mind you as a customer you need to be attractive to the supplier to play this game.
What will make you attractive to the potential supply base?
To the manufacturers it is all about volume, volume and more volume!!
They want to be able to run their corrugator for extended periods with the same specification papers, their machines that then cut the corrugated paper to make the "box" takes about 30/40minutes to change specification and then will cut several boxes out of one sheet (like cutting out tart cases from a rolled out sheet of pastry) so it can produce a lot of boxes very quickly so they want larger volumes to make the the change worthwhile.
The other considerations are the cost of formes (pastry cutter) and stereos (artwork) these cost c£750 for a pair.
The issue with buying large quantities is that corrgutaged deteriates in quality the longer it is in the atmosphere, so if it is important to have the protective or strength properties then you'll need to consider either where you store them or the initial papers used (inner, outer and fluting) to give these during the forecasted life expectancy of the box.
If you're looking at relatively low quantities it might be worth investigating what "standard" boxes the suppliers already produce and then using a self adhesive label to mark them up, this might need a compromise on the shape and size so you will need to consider internal packing as well so that your product doesn't rattle around inside the box.
HTH
god I miss my old packaging days - sad but true
What will make you attractive to the potential supply base?
To the manufacturers it is all about volume, volume and more volume!!
They want to be able to run their corrugator for extended periods with the same specification papers, their machines that then cut the corrugated paper to make the "box" takes about 30/40minutes to change specification and then will cut several boxes out of one sheet (like cutting out tart cases from a rolled out sheet of pastry) so it can produce a lot of boxes very quickly so they want larger volumes to make the the change worthwhile.
The other considerations are the cost of formes (pastry cutter) and stereos (artwork) these cost c£750 for a pair.
The issue with buying large quantities is that corrgutaged deteriates in quality the longer it is in the atmosphere, so if it is important to have the protective or strength properties then you'll need to consider either where you store them or the initial papers used (inner, outer and fluting) to give these during the forecasted life expectancy of the box.
If you're looking at relatively low quantities it might be worth investigating what "standard" boxes the suppliers already produce and then using a self adhesive label to mark them up, this might need a compromise on the shape and size so you will need to consider internal packing as well so that your product doesn't rattle around inside the box.
HTH
god I miss my old packaging days - sad but true
Most of what Marcellus says is good, however,
Cutters are only required for die cut cases, regular FEFCO 0201's (with flaps top and bottom) do not require a cutting forme and are run on rotary machines which add scores and slots then fold and glue all in one pass.
There are plenty of companies whose markets are short run orders,generally termed "sheet plants" as oppossed to "integrated plants" which have the board manufacuring machines in addition to "conversion" machines.
Normal order quantities for sheet plants are 25 units through to 5000 units. Then it becomes more cost effective for integrated plants to run.
If you are looking for quanties of say 500 regulary of standard FEFCO 0201's or die cuts it may be more competitive to buy from a stockist (such as UK packaging in Toteenham, no connection with me) as they buy in bulk from integrated plants and split the delivery in smaller quantities. Stockist are good for quick turn around as you dont have to wait in a production schedule.
With regard to printing, if you are sending high value good's via courrier or post I suggest you limit you external info to delivery address only (label) if you want it to arrive.
If you decide you would like printing on the external of your boxes (print plates are calculeted by the sq inch of area and a "typical" print plate would be about £200. per colour). you will need to have them manufactured bespoke and live with the delivery lead times.
I don't miss my packaging days as I'm still in that game and have been for over 30 yrs!
Cutters are only required for die cut cases, regular FEFCO 0201's (with flaps top and bottom) do not require a cutting forme and are run on rotary machines which add scores and slots then fold and glue all in one pass.
There are plenty of companies whose markets are short run orders,generally termed "sheet plants" as oppossed to "integrated plants" which have the board manufacuring machines in addition to "conversion" machines.
Normal order quantities for sheet plants are 25 units through to 5000 units. Then it becomes more cost effective for integrated plants to run.
If you are looking for quanties of say 500 regulary of standard FEFCO 0201's or die cuts it may be more competitive to buy from a stockist (such as UK packaging in Toteenham, no connection with me) as they buy in bulk from integrated plants and split the delivery in smaller quantities. Stockist are good for quick turn around as you dont have to wait in a production schedule.
With regard to printing, if you are sending high value good's via courrier or post I suggest you limit you external info to delivery address only (label) if you want it to arrive.
If you decide you would like printing on the external of your boxes (print plates are calculeted by the sq inch of area and a "typical" print plate would be about £200. per colour). you will need to have them manufactured bespoke and live with the delivery lead times.
I don't miss my packaging days as I'm still in that game and have been for over 30 yrs!
Ebay is not cheap for boxes! I have no connection with them so no touting going on, but I'd get them from UK packaging in Tottenham. check out there website they carry hundreds of different sizes and thickness's and styles in stock. no ebay "delivery" charges and you can see what your buying before you commit. Open an account with them and get credit terms also.
3200gt said:
Ebay is not cheap for boxes! I have no connection with them so no touting going on, but I'd get them from UK packaging in Tottenham. check out there website they carry hundreds of different sizes and thickness's and styles in stock. no ebay "delivery" charges and you can see what your buying before you commit. Open an account with them and get credit terms also.
OK, I will check them out. Thanks for the tip 3200.If you dont mind stretching your qty to a 1000 then go to this place.
http://www.redrosepackaging.com/home.html
If you want to buy small qtys then buy all mean buy from a packaging company like Macfarlane but they are when all said and done just a reseller otherwise go to a manufacturer like the one i've mentioned above.
http://www.redrosepackaging.com/home.html
If you want to buy small qtys then buy all mean buy from a packaging company like Macfarlane but they are when all said and done just a reseller otherwise go to a manufacturer like the one i've mentioned above.
CHIEF said:
If you dont mind stretching your qty to a 1000 then go to this place.
http://www.redrosepackaging.com/home.html
If you want to buy small qtys then buy all mean buy from a packaging company like Macfarlane but they are when all said and done just a reseller otherwise go to a manufacturer like the one i've mentioned above.
OK, thanks for the tip Chief. Will consider this, definetly. It's January that I'll be looking at stocking up so will be ringing around in a few weeks to get the best deal I can.http://www.redrosepackaging.com/home.html
If you want to buy small qtys then buy all mean buy from a packaging company like Macfarlane but they are when all said and done just a reseller otherwise go to a manufacturer like the one i've mentioned above.
Thanks again
3200gt said:
.....regular FEFCO 0201's (with flaps top and bottom) do not require a cutting forme and are run on rotary machines which add scores and slots then fold and glue all in one pass.....
There are other short run converting machines available that can job change in less than a minute but is an inherently more manual process because you have to glue/stitch the boxes offline once slotted and creased.There are alot of companies out there with this type of equipment to serve the bespoke short run market, but boxes of this type do carry a significant premium over standard size stock boxes. This is because the raw material is cut from stock sheet and generates waste, or the board has been ordered specifically for the job pre-cut, again at a higher price per square metre if a short run order.
It is a trade-off as the end-user whether you are happy to use "best-fit" stock boxes and perhaps void fill or whether you want the exact size boxe for the products you are packing.
You pays your money, you takes your choice!
Gravy said:
stuff
I was trying to keep it simple for the sake of the uniniated amongst us. I was head of structual and graphic design for the largest corrugated packaging company in europe during the 80's and 90's. I now own and run my own packaging company and have done so for several years.Theres not much I don't know about corrugated packaging.
3200gt said:
Gravy said:
stuff
I was trying to keep it simple for the sake of the uniniated amongst us. I was head of structual and graphic design for the largest corrugated packaging company in europe during the 80's and 90's. I now own and run my own packaging company and have done so for several years.Theres not much I don't know about corrugated packaging.
Jackleman said:
rich1231 said:
Do not reuse boxes. It looks very unprofessional.
Buy your boxes in alrge numbers and play suppliers against each other. It will make a huge difference.
I think if you reuse boxes as we all should a sticker on them about ones enviromental policy is a good thing to do.Buy your boxes in alrge numbers and play suppliers against each other. It will make a huge difference.
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