L322 viewing - what to look for ?
Discussion
OK, been tempted by a cheap L322 and going to look at the first one on Sunday. Its an early 2002-2006 4.4L V8 Vogue being sold privately.
Car has had a replacement/or rebuilt gearbox a few years back and told the box shifts clean and smooth. The cars MOT history is impeccable, and has never failed an MOT and has had only ever had a couple of advisories . Also comes with a large history file.The car does have the rusty rear arch L322 , but this is reflected in the price which is comfortably under £3k
The aim is not to buy a minter, but something for £3k ish that is a driving experience for maybe 6 months or so, as I've never owned anything other than BMW's and some more sporty focused cars. I'll be doing the servicing and any repairs for more basic stuff and fixing any faults.
I've been viewing a few videos on YT of owners and covering things like checking the suspension settings for etc, but keen to hear other things to check. Does anyone know the VIN locations to check identity and maybe engine numbers match ?
Thanks
Car has had a replacement/or rebuilt gearbox a few years back and told the box shifts clean and smooth. The cars MOT history is impeccable, and has never failed an MOT and has had only ever had a couple of advisories . Also comes with a large history file.The car does have the rusty rear arch L322 , but this is reflected in the price which is comfortably under £3k
The aim is not to buy a minter, but something for £3k ish that is a driving experience for maybe 6 months or so, as I've never owned anything other than BMW's and some more sporty focused cars. I'll be doing the servicing and any repairs for more basic stuff and fixing any faults.
I've been viewing a few videos on YT of owners and covering things like checking the suspension settings for etc, but keen to hear other things to check. Does anyone know the VIN locations to check identity and maybe engine numbers match ?
Thanks
First, you'll be wise to register with the fullfatrr.com forum as there's loads of information there.
You'll know that the early 4.4's in the years you're talking about are BMW engines, albeit LR-ised for LR-type activities that a 5-Series doesn't see.
VIN code is at the bottom of the windscreen on the passenger side.
These 4.4's are historically prone to cam cover leaks that should have been fixed by now and perishing breather pipes that should also have been done. Worth checking the history, though.
Steering column motor adjustment failure is also well documented, but there are fixes depending on your budget and expectations which a specialist or competent DIY'er can do. You don't always need to replace the entire motor assembly these days, as you used to have to do. More often than not, it's a failed nylon nut.
Boot electronics can suffer with water ingress, so check the spare wheel well for moisture and also that the rather antiquated sat-nav and stereo work. Upgrades are available depending on your budget, or just leave and buy the facelift L322 (Jaguar-based engine) with digital TV and a touchscreen system.
L322's have a lot of electrics in them, so ensure the battery and alternator are in the rudest health. The latter carries a hefty price tag to replace.
Buy an IID Tool from eBay, Duckworth LR (on the forum) or Britpart (same item) for diagnostics, or whatever diagnostic tool you feel is most appropriate.
BMW-era RR's don't really handle as such, but they aren't massively quick either unless pushed. That's fine, as they are a lovely place to waft serenely about in.
Brakes and suspension, mostly, are easy DIY jobs.
The leather responds beautifully to a deep clean and application of Gliptone. Smells absolutely wonderful afterwards, and so will you after each drive. To open a RR's door to the deep aroma of quality leather upholstery is a very calming and satisfying experience in itself.
And, please, no adorning it with tacky chrome self-adhesive addenda, ungainly side steps or garish alloys. These large old beasts look at their dignified best when stock, in my rather purist view.
You'll know that the early 4.4's in the years you're talking about are BMW engines, albeit LR-ised for LR-type activities that a 5-Series doesn't see.
VIN code is at the bottom of the windscreen on the passenger side.
These 4.4's are historically prone to cam cover leaks that should have been fixed by now and perishing breather pipes that should also have been done. Worth checking the history, though.
Steering column motor adjustment failure is also well documented, but there are fixes depending on your budget and expectations which a specialist or competent DIY'er can do. You don't always need to replace the entire motor assembly these days, as you used to have to do. More often than not, it's a failed nylon nut.
Boot electronics can suffer with water ingress, so check the spare wheel well for moisture and also that the rather antiquated sat-nav and stereo work. Upgrades are available depending on your budget, or just leave and buy the facelift L322 (Jaguar-based engine) with digital TV and a touchscreen system.
L322's have a lot of electrics in them, so ensure the battery and alternator are in the rudest health. The latter carries a hefty price tag to replace.
Buy an IID Tool from eBay, Duckworth LR (on the forum) or Britpart (same item) for diagnostics, or whatever diagnostic tool you feel is most appropriate.
BMW-era RR's don't really handle as such, but they aren't massively quick either unless pushed. That's fine, as they are a lovely place to waft serenely about in.
Brakes and suspension, mostly, are easy DIY jobs.
The leather responds beautifully to a deep clean and application of Gliptone. Smells absolutely wonderful afterwards, and so will you after each drive. To open a RR's door to the deep aroma of quality leather upholstery is a very calming and satisfying experience in itself.
And, please, no adorning it with tacky chrome self-adhesive addenda, ungainly side steps or garish alloys. These large old beasts look at their dignified best when stock, in my rather purist view.
Many thanks for the reply. The servicing seems good on the car and has had a recent new battery ( will have to check the rating to make sure its correct ) and things like the suspension and steering column the vendor says are working correctly. The only thing I've spotted so far is it looks like the car has power fold mirrors, of which only one is working.
The car is thankfully free of any accessories at all - no tow bar, no black window tints, chrome tat grilles/door handles and on standard wheels. Drivers seat looks a little worn, but a clean and some leather colour on the edge would make it look very good.
Is the TV a simple upgrade for a later Jag based system then ? I've seen BMW E39 based android systems fitted that have DAB and digital TV options.
Thanks
The car is thankfully free of any accessories at all - no tow bar, no black window tints, chrome tat grilles/door handles and on standard wheels. Drivers seat looks a little worn, but a clean and some leather colour on the edge would make it look very good.
Is the TV a simple upgrade for a later Jag based system then ? I've seen BMW E39 based android systems fitted that have DAB and digital TV options.
Thanks
Sounds like you have done some homework already and have covered most bases so well done.
Engine wise it'll be the BMW 4.4 V8 M62TUB and they can suffer from VANOS problems and timing chain guide issue.
If you've had BMW's before then you probably know about VANOS, just check for a quiet start up, if it sounds like a diesel then it has problems and might be best avoided. They are highly unlikely to die from it but would be difficult to sell on later. There are kits to refurb the VANOS units from the likes of Dr VANOS.
Likewise a timing chain rattle from the front end could mean the plastic guides have broken and need replacing, that's a lot more serious problem to fix and DIY the parts alone are about £1k (I have all the bits ready to do mine).
PCV and oil leaks have already been mentioned, alternator is water cooled and a bit more long winded to replace but easily DIYable. Worth checking though if the battery has been recently been replaced, could be hiding a problem although L322's are notorious for playing up giving lots of errors if the battery output is low on start up.
Check to make sure it goes into and out of Low Range (with engine running in Neutral select Low Range). People hardly ever use it and it can cause problems if not, the position sensor on the shift motor wears out sitting in the same spot on it's start up self test and up until recently it was a £1500 part! They can now be rebuilt for a more reasonable £400.
Other than the engine and transmission the next most expensive things to fix would be the air suspension on the front. Check to make sure it rises to full off road height without issues. It should do it in less than 2 minutes on an early vehicle depending if the air reservoir is full or not, facelift ones are quicker with a revised system. When it's raised up and the pump stopped go around and check all the air bags for cracks and listen for leaks. Often a leak can be sealed by the folds in the airbag especially if it's never taken into off road height.
Front dampers are combined in a strut with the air bags and therefore should be replaced in pairs. You can buy aftermarket air bag kits but they don't last. The original struts on mine lasted 10+ years and over 100k miles and there is no reason why OEM Delphi replacements wouldn't last the same again.
Rear springs don't really give many problems, I'm still on originals on my '02 with 105k miles I did replace the rear dampers when I swapped the fronts out to keep it even....dampers on 100k miles are way past their best!
The steering column motor and position sensing of it has already been mentioned and can be an expensive fix if it fails. Mine works fine but the automatic retraction on getting in and out of the vehicle will inevitably wear it out. I've turned that feature off on mine just for that reason, the IID tool allows you to play around with the factory/dealer options. If you are a keen DIYer then an IID diagnostic tool will pay for itself pretty quickly.
The original factory head unit display/Sat Nav computer is extremely dated. Being a BMW system it can be swapped out for a later Mk3 DVD unit from an E39 etc. which improves the look no end but is certainly no modern system. Pretty much plug and play although obviously it might now say BMW rather than Land Rover on start up but can easily be sorted with a correct disc which is often included if bought from an upgrade vendor.
As for aftermarket head units, then lower spec HSE models are easier to upgrade as there is less integration needed into existing systems.
Unfortunately people forget it is was a £60k+ vehicle 15+ years ago and has the equivalent running costs even though early ones are only worth £3k-£4k today. Once they get down to that level then a lot of maintenance gets forgotten about.
My '02 4.4 was my first Land Rover 7+ years ago and I still love it today, it's awesome off road with decent tyres and just a great place to be on road.
It's not something I would recommend to anyone who's not handy with the spanners or diagnostics or is wanting to run it on a shoestring budget long term. As long as you realise that then they are great motors.
Engine wise it'll be the BMW 4.4 V8 M62TUB and they can suffer from VANOS problems and timing chain guide issue.
If you've had BMW's before then you probably know about VANOS, just check for a quiet start up, if it sounds like a diesel then it has problems and might be best avoided. They are highly unlikely to die from it but would be difficult to sell on later. There are kits to refurb the VANOS units from the likes of Dr VANOS.
Likewise a timing chain rattle from the front end could mean the plastic guides have broken and need replacing, that's a lot more serious problem to fix and DIY the parts alone are about £1k (I have all the bits ready to do mine).
PCV and oil leaks have already been mentioned, alternator is water cooled and a bit more long winded to replace but easily DIYable. Worth checking though if the battery has been recently been replaced, could be hiding a problem although L322's are notorious for playing up giving lots of errors if the battery output is low on start up.
Check to make sure it goes into and out of Low Range (with engine running in Neutral select Low Range). People hardly ever use it and it can cause problems if not, the position sensor on the shift motor wears out sitting in the same spot on it's start up self test and up until recently it was a £1500 part! They can now be rebuilt for a more reasonable £400.
Other than the engine and transmission the next most expensive things to fix would be the air suspension on the front. Check to make sure it rises to full off road height without issues. It should do it in less than 2 minutes on an early vehicle depending if the air reservoir is full or not, facelift ones are quicker with a revised system. When it's raised up and the pump stopped go around and check all the air bags for cracks and listen for leaks. Often a leak can be sealed by the folds in the airbag especially if it's never taken into off road height.
Front dampers are combined in a strut with the air bags and therefore should be replaced in pairs. You can buy aftermarket air bag kits but they don't last. The original struts on mine lasted 10+ years and over 100k miles and there is no reason why OEM Delphi replacements wouldn't last the same again.
Rear springs don't really give many problems, I'm still on originals on my '02 with 105k miles I did replace the rear dampers when I swapped the fronts out to keep it even....dampers on 100k miles are way past their best!
The steering column motor and position sensing of it has already been mentioned and can be an expensive fix if it fails. Mine works fine but the automatic retraction on getting in and out of the vehicle will inevitably wear it out. I've turned that feature off on mine just for that reason, the IID tool allows you to play around with the factory/dealer options. If you are a keen DIYer then an IID diagnostic tool will pay for itself pretty quickly.
The original factory head unit display/Sat Nav computer is extremely dated. Being a BMW system it can be swapped out for a later Mk3 DVD unit from an E39 etc. which improves the look no end but is certainly no modern system. Pretty much plug and play although obviously it might now say BMW rather than Land Rover on start up but can easily be sorted with a correct disc which is often included if bought from an upgrade vendor.
As for aftermarket head units, then lower spec HSE models are easier to upgrade as there is less integration needed into existing systems.
Unfortunately people forget it is was a £60k+ vehicle 15+ years ago and has the equivalent running costs even though early ones are only worth £3k-£4k today. Once they get down to that level then a lot of maintenance gets forgotten about.
My '02 4.4 was my first Land Rover 7+ years ago and I still love it today, it's awesome off road with decent tyres and just a great place to be on road.
It's not something I would recommend to anyone who's not handy with the spanners or diagnostics or is wanting to run it on a shoestring budget long term. As long as you realise that then they are great motors.
Many thanks for the comprehensive replies chaps. Well, I'm very nearly the owner of £2.5K worth of L322 RR.
I went and viewed the car on Saturday and left a small deposit , hopefully to pick up next weekend once the change in private plate is down and new log book is back confirming this.
The owner is a long time LR owner and also a fitter by trade and seemed to know his stuff. He actually spent most of the time walking me through all the RR weak points and telling me what to check, while I was referring back to a list I'd made from here and other LR forums.
I couldn't find fault with all the big expensive fail point items. The engine started up smooth and silent, gearbox shifts slickly ( the old girl and pick up her petticoat and run! )in auto and manual shift mode, air suspension cycled through the settings and in few seconds, no error codes on the dash, electric sunroof working fine, heated seats and steering wheel working, steering column motor adjusts in out/up down, aircon, blows cold, original satnav screen has a later disc and a £300 digital TV upgrade done and works, shifted into low range and HDC engaged ok and all seemed fine.
It is £2.5k , so the rust on the rear arches I knew of before viewing. It's mostly on the wheel arch lip and only just creeping down under the plastic sill trim. It's at a point where if treated now it can be saved I hope with just paint. Tailgate shows zero signs of rust.
The car has had the front and rear bumpers painted and looks very good and really just needs a light machine polish ( something I have and can do ) to bring it back to life.
The car does have what must be the lightest window tint available, so much so I didn't even notice in the original ad for the car. No tow bar ever fitted and no side steps of chrome bits.
Inside is clean and tidy, but an area where the biggest improvement might be made. The leather is all sound and unmarked. The drivers seat show wear, but not dried or cracked and needs a deep clean. The plastic panel along the bottom of the seat and around the electric adjustment switches ( all working ) has a chrome strip with the film lifting, which lets it down.
The car looks like it's seen plenty of gear loaded in the boot, as the C pillar trims are all marked and the paint and been removed from these and looks scruffy, same with the panels where the load cover slides into. Half the silver paint around the heated rear seat switches is missing, and again just make it looks scruffy. The bonnet vent has a bit of paint missing too. These kinds of things are something I'm looking forward to fixing as the cosmetics are the only things that let it down.
Maintenance wise, the car has never failed an MOT and has about a handful of small advisories over its total history and a steady increase in mileage each year on the website. There's a stack of receipts and documents including the service book with LR history up to around 100k .
Just recently had a new battery and the gearbox has be changed, alternator , front diff and recent front suspension arms.
Front tires are near new, rears have plenty of tread too. Wheels are undamaged and original 19" items and don't look to have ever had a refurb.
So hopefully next week I'll be the owner of a L322. Many thanks once again.
I went and viewed the car on Saturday and left a small deposit , hopefully to pick up next weekend once the change in private plate is down and new log book is back confirming this.
The owner is a long time LR owner and also a fitter by trade and seemed to know his stuff. He actually spent most of the time walking me through all the RR weak points and telling me what to check, while I was referring back to a list I'd made from here and other LR forums.
I couldn't find fault with all the big expensive fail point items. The engine started up smooth and silent, gearbox shifts slickly ( the old girl and pick up her petticoat and run! )in auto and manual shift mode, air suspension cycled through the settings and in few seconds, no error codes on the dash, electric sunroof working fine, heated seats and steering wheel working, steering column motor adjusts in out/up down, aircon, blows cold, original satnav screen has a later disc and a £300 digital TV upgrade done and works, shifted into low range and HDC engaged ok and all seemed fine.
It is £2.5k , so the rust on the rear arches I knew of before viewing. It's mostly on the wheel arch lip and only just creeping down under the plastic sill trim. It's at a point where if treated now it can be saved I hope with just paint. Tailgate shows zero signs of rust.
The car has had the front and rear bumpers painted and looks very good and really just needs a light machine polish ( something I have and can do ) to bring it back to life.
The car does have what must be the lightest window tint available, so much so I didn't even notice in the original ad for the car. No tow bar ever fitted and no side steps of chrome bits.
Inside is clean and tidy, but an area where the biggest improvement might be made. The leather is all sound and unmarked. The drivers seat show wear, but not dried or cracked and needs a deep clean. The plastic panel along the bottom of the seat and around the electric adjustment switches ( all working ) has a chrome strip with the film lifting, which lets it down.
The car looks like it's seen plenty of gear loaded in the boot, as the C pillar trims are all marked and the paint and been removed from these and looks scruffy, same with the panels where the load cover slides into. Half the silver paint around the heated rear seat switches is missing, and again just make it looks scruffy. The bonnet vent has a bit of paint missing too. These kinds of things are something I'm looking forward to fixing as the cosmetics are the only things that let it down.
Maintenance wise, the car has never failed an MOT and has about a handful of small advisories over its total history and a steady increase in mileage each year on the website. There's a stack of receipts and documents including the service book with LR history up to around 100k .
Just recently had a new battery and the gearbox has be changed, alternator , front diff and recent front suspension arms.
Front tires are near new, rears have plenty of tread too. Wheels are undamaged and original 19" items and don't look to have ever had a refurb.
So hopefully next week I'll be the owner of a L322. Many thanks once again.
Croutons said:
Have you picked it up and if so, how are you finding it?
Hi, yes, had it a few weeks now and love the experience. The car is fundamentally sound and no nasty surprises. I've been fixing a few bits and bobs and trying to improve a few things.There is a small oil leak from a cam cover gasket, but at £20 the pair , I'll do that along with the spark plugs in a basic service tomorrow. Aircon will need a re-gas in the next few weeks to be fully fit for the summer, but so far no gearbox woes, warning lights and even come back with no codes found when hooked up to a friends code reader. There is a thread on the FFRR forum under the title of 'the 2002 ebay gamble' if interested to see more.
Cheers
my 03 passed its MOT last week and I was intent on selling it as I don't use it much. However for what I will get for it I have decided to hang on to it so its on a Sorn until October. For the money it really is an awful lot of Car and the "challenges" of maintaining it keep the mind active
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