Oil opinion from the man at Shell
Discussion
Just in case anyone might be interested, I recently e-mailed Les Dash at Shell regarding engine oil for Rover V8 engined TVRs, here is my original e-mail followed by his reply.
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Dear Sir,
Having read your article on the TVR Car Club website about Shell oils, I am keen to hear your opinion on oil types specifically for use in Rover V8 based TVR engines.
I have read several other articles which are seemingly at odds with each other regarding the use of "thin" oils such as Mobil One, I would like to know which type of oil is better suited for use in my standard road-going 5 Litre TVR Griffith. I have read that the Rover V8 engine relies on oil volume rather than pressure to maintain adequate lubrication, are thicker
more traditional oils better suited to these engines than thinner "modern" oils? I am concerned that the volume of oil supplied by the oil pump when thin oil is used may not provide adequate lubrication, particularly to the top end of the engine.
Several people I have spoken to swear that the Rover V8 is not suited to thin oils like Mobil 1, yet TVR used to recommend this oil. What is your opinion on the
matter?
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Les's reply:
Keith ,
Thanks for your enquiry, this is probably another issue for the website.
The Rover V8 based TVR engines are based on a Chrysler engine design from the 50s if my memory serves me correctly, and as a result the design of the oil pump, the oil galleries and the oil pressure were related to engine oils of the 20W-50 /15W-40 viscosity type.
I am not aware of any modifications that were made to the oil system when TVR decided to use these engines. so basically these engines were designed to use relatively high viscosity products, NOT , in my opinion the latest fully synthetic, fuel economy, low friction products.
The issue is viscosity not the synthetic nature of the products.
As power is not an issue with TVRs, I would personally recommend Shell Helix Ultra Racing 10W-60 for this engine.
The latest engine as used in the TVR Tuscan Championship in the CDL sponsored cars run on Helix Ultra 5W-40.
TVR recommended Mobil 1 when they were the title sponsor of the Tuscan Championship but this was a commercial not a technical decision, the same goes for the current title sponsor "Carlube "
Hope this helps
Les
***********
Obviously he is going to recommend a Shell product, but an interesting reply nonetheless?
**********
Dear Sir,
Having read your article on the TVR Car Club website about Shell oils, I am keen to hear your opinion on oil types specifically for use in Rover V8 based TVR engines.
I have read several other articles which are seemingly at odds with each other regarding the use of "thin" oils such as Mobil One, I would like to know which type of oil is better suited for use in my standard road-going 5 Litre TVR Griffith. I have read that the Rover V8 engine relies on oil volume rather than pressure to maintain adequate lubrication, are thicker
more traditional oils better suited to these engines than thinner "modern" oils? I am concerned that the volume of oil supplied by the oil pump when thin oil is used may not provide adequate lubrication, particularly to the top end of the engine.
Several people I have spoken to swear that the Rover V8 is not suited to thin oils like Mobil 1, yet TVR used to recommend this oil. What is your opinion on the
matter?
********
Les's reply:
Keith ,
Thanks for your enquiry, this is probably another issue for the website.
The Rover V8 based TVR engines are based on a Chrysler engine design from the 50s if my memory serves me correctly, and as a result the design of the oil pump, the oil galleries and the oil pressure were related to engine oils of the 20W-50 /15W-40 viscosity type.
I am not aware of any modifications that were made to the oil system when TVR decided to use these engines. so basically these engines were designed to use relatively high viscosity products, NOT , in my opinion the latest fully synthetic, fuel economy, low friction products.
The issue is viscosity not the synthetic nature of the products.
As power is not an issue with TVRs, I would personally recommend Shell Helix Ultra Racing 10W-60 for this engine.
The latest engine as used in the TVR Tuscan Championship in the CDL sponsored cars run on Helix Ultra 5W-40.
TVR recommended Mobil 1 when they were the title sponsor of the Tuscan Championship but this was a commercial not a technical decision, the same goes for the current title sponsor "Carlube "
Hope this helps
Les
***********
Obviously he is going to recommend a Shell product, but an interesting reply nonetheless?
Especially as the oil pumps etc have been changed with the design. The serp engines use a totally different oil pump driven direct from the crank. Doesn't even look like the oroginal 50 year old design.
Synthetics resist heat degredation better than mineral oils which means they tend to last better. I use a mineral in the 520 as it is better at coping with fuel dilution but it needs changing almost every time the car competes.
I also bet the Tuscan has its oil changed every meeting and anyway they use an AJP in the racers now....
Steve
www.tvrbooks.co.uk
Synthetics resist heat degredation better than mineral oils which means they tend to last better. I use a mineral in the 520 as it is better at coping with fuel dilution but it needs changing almost every time the car competes.
I also bet the Tuscan has its oil changed every meeting and anyway they use an AJP in the racers now....
Steve
www.tvrbooks.co.uk
There is 4 pages on this in the new bible as there is not a clear answer at all. Use a good synthetic oil and change it regularly is about the best advice. My Griff gets Mobil 1 Motorsport. This can be very much a religious war so be careful the oil police don't come a knockin'
>> Edited by shpub on Friday 3rd January 17:14
>> Edited by shpub on Friday 3rd January 17:14
Now I didn't want to start a "my oil is better than your oil debate". I just thought it might have been interesting to hear what someone who makes the stuff thinks.
I am totally confused about what to use anyway, so I suppose I will stick with Mobil 1. If "God" uses it , then it must be ok.
Oh, on the subject of Bibles, can I get a part-ex on my old one? Can I buy the new pages as an after-market add-on? Or do I have to go out and buy the new edition?
I am totally confused about what to use anyway, so I suppose I will stick with Mobil 1. If "God" uses it , then it must be ok.
Oh, on the subject of Bibles, can I get a part-ex on my old one? Can I buy the new pages as an after-market add-on? Or do I have to go out and buy the new edition?
As far as I can tell (from shpub and other sources) you can use any of the oils as long as you check the levels and change regularly. However, it seems that cars running on standard Mobil 1 (5W40 IIRC) tend to use alot of oil. Cars running on Mobil 1 Motorsport (10W40 or 15W40 IIRC) or similar tend to hardly use any oil. Another general recomedation is that you should use full synthetic due to the power/stresses in the engine. The other types breakdown alot faster.
Having said that if you change the engine every few miles (like Steve does in the 520) it doesn't really matter what type you use as it won't get chance to breakdown before it's replaced.
Having said that if you change the engine every few miles (like Steve does in the 520) it doesn't really matter what type you use as it won't get chance to breakdown before it's replaced.
My car now runs on 76 20w-50w oil as its 36k service.
Steve Guglielmi uses this oil and recommended it for the service.
He explained that mobil 1 10w-40w oil can be too thin and the only difference between mineral and synthetic oils of the same rating is the time duration of replacement.
Mineral normally last 6k whereas synthetic lasts 50% to 100% longer. Give my griff 500 is serviced every 6k (as most should be) mineral is a good alternative and significantly cheaper too.
Steve Guglielmi uses this oil and recommended it for the service.
He explained that mobil 1 10w-40w oil can be too thin and the only difference between mineral and synthetic oils of the same rating is the time duration of replacement.
Mineral normally last 6k whereas synthetic lasts 50% to 100% longer. Give my griff 500 is serviced every 6k (as most should be) mineral is a good alternative and significantly cheaper too.
apache said: as a matter of interest, how many miles do you Mobil 1 users get to the litre? I used to get between 300/500 till I started using Halvoline 5/40 now it is transformed
With Motorsport grade Mobil 1 I get well over 1000 miles to the litre, with the exception being when I had a knackered rocker cover gasket - then it dropped to 500 miles/litre.
Pete
I'm with Pete's end of the scale. I topped up monthly but I doubt I used a litre a year - which equated to about 2/2500 miles from memory. The common benchmark of 500miles a litre was way off for my Griff.
For most of us the lifespan of oil is a mute point I imagine as 6,000miles in a year is never reached before the next service.
For most of us the lifespan of oil is a mute point I imagine as 6,000miles in a year is never reached before the next service.
. I did actually but on second thoughts maybe I was right first time
pete said:
apache said: as a matter of interest, how many miles do you Mobil 1 users get to the litre? I used to get between 300/500 till I started using Halvoline 5/40 now it is transformed
With Motorsport grade Mobil 1 I get well over 1000 miles to the litre, with the exception being when I had a knackered rocker cover gasket - then it dropped to 500 miles/litre.
Pete
I've done about 3,800 miles since getting my 4.0 last May, and have not yet needed to top up
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