Beginers guide to Web Site Design?

[richb]

OK so now I have some free web site space and a URL address courtesy of my
ISP.
So next I think about filling it up with some pictures of my Griffith
and perhaps a picture of my old S3c, and I realise that making a web site
look anything like half decent is not easy!!!
Now what I am looking for is a guide or something to get me started.
Anyone recommend a book or something (on-line even better) for real
beginners like me?

Rich...

[M@H]

erm.. I think the main thing to keep in your mind is that its not as hard as it looks... once you understand how tables, or frames work, and you've got an idea of how things should look, you can virtually code HTML by hand (with knowledge of the tags)..

useful sites are:

www.tips-tricks.com/ (v.basic starting points)
http://hotwired.lycos.com/webmonkey/authoring/html_basics/ (again a good basic start)
www.htmlgoodies.com/ (bits and bobs of code for banner, buttons etc etc.)
http://builder.cnet.com/webbuilding/pages/Authoring/Html/ (basic HTML onwards)
www.coolarchive.com/ (button generator and some useful icons and stuff)

If you want to see what you can do with this lot and some imagination go to www.shop4silver.co.uk feel free to spend lots of money

Cheers
Matt.


>> Edited by M@H on Thursday 8th August 13:04

[billb]

depends what you've got at the mo software wise. If u have word / excel u can just save them as a web page with photos in and upload it. If you want to do anything fancier you can either buy frontpage which is very microsofty and easy to use or if you want to be more professional still get macromedia dreamweaver.

[M@H]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.....

..don't use MS word to make web pages.. it creates so much code that is overcomplicated that it makes a real HTML mess... MS word will literally add hundreds of lines of class and style code to even a simple page, not to mention its own file system for the images etc, that becomes a real pain in the @rse..

Cheers,
Matt.

[billb]

quote:
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.....

..don't use MS word to make web pages.. it creates so much code that is overcomplicated that it makes a real HTML mess... MS word will literally add hundreds of lines of class and style code to even a simple page, not to mention its own file system for the images etc, that becomes a real pain in the @rse..

Cheers,
Matt.

what does he care about code and lines of class?!? he says he's a beginer who wants to bung some photos on? why complicate things

[adeewuff]

www.w3schools.com

They are probably the best for explaining HTML in an easy way.

[M@H]

quote:

quote:
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.....

..don't use MS word to make web pages.. it creates so much code that is overcomplicated that it makes a real HTML mess... MS word will literally add hundreds of lines of class and style code to even a simple page, not to mention its own file system for the images etc, that becomes a real pain in the @rse..

Cheers,
Matt.

what does he care about code and lines of class?!? he says he's a beginer who wants to bung some photos on? why complicate things

Err.. but MS products do complicate things.. much better to actually learn to understand the HTML from the start.. saves trying to pick through all the MS Cr@p to make minor changes...

I suppose you are right though.. if someone just wants to produce a webpage, then MS stuff works, but if someone wnats to Code a webpage then they should read some guides and get notepad open... just my 2p, its my own fault cos can't stand not knowing how things work.

Cheers
Matt

[Fatboy]

Buy 'Teach yourself HTML in 24 hours' I found it great - very easy to set up a webpage in notepad, with the satisfaction you did it yourself.

[simond001]

Ok, so i got me a web site address (wwww.simond.org.uk) and i got me a picture of my car.

Now alls i want is picture on wwww and someone to look at it.

can i do that without reading a book?

<~ thinks learning to read may take more than 24 hrs

[funkyboogalooo]

check my site out http://homepage.ntlworld.com/mikebatty this was done with notepad and nothing else. if you like i can mail you the html guide i got. let me know.
groove on baby

[philshort]

Have to agree with billb, if a newbie wants to post a web page as easy as poss then why not MS Word.

Personally I wouldn't touch it with a shitty stick either, but I'm twenty years past being a newbie! Ditto FrontPage. To post a simple site (rather than a single page) its fine, provided it doesn't cost you much (). Once you get past simple though (if you do, and many won't need to) you'll soon get p1ssed off with it mangling your HTML and progress to something better.

DreamWeaver is a bit heavy duty for a beginner - well for anybody really. Excellent tool for crafting professional web sites it may be, beginners tool in ain't.

Let's put it another way. Imagine the carnage if everyone learned to drive in a TVR. Think of MS Word as the Nissan Micra of web development!

But no-one has answered Rich's question yet. He asked about web DESIGN, not web coding ... and I think Funky may be interested in the answer too! (Sorry mate, but maybe its time to move on from Notepad!)


>> Edited by philshort on Thursday 8th August 23:18

[richb]

quote:
Ok, so i got me a web site address (wwww.simond.org.uk) and i got me a picture of my car.

Now alls i want is picture on wwww and someone to look at it.

can i do that without reading a book?

<~ thinks learning to read may take more than 24 hrs

And your point is?

p.s. Thanks for the other replies, I'll do some investigation, once I've learnt to read Rich...

[miniman]

The best advice so far is DEFINITELY don't use Word to make web pages. Use Notepad. It takes longer to learn, but the HTML that you produce is much faster to download and generally better.

The easiest way to learn is to find a site you like, go to a good page, click "View" then "Source" and steal it!

If you are really serious about it, try Macromedia Studio MX.

My site, www.minispecial.com was 95% written with Notepad.

>> Edited by miniman on Saturday 10th August 22:51

[simond001]

The mini site is ideal, Its easy to "navigate" and the menu on the left is easy. But, it doesnt help a thicket like me understand how it works.

I have started using frontpage, but if there is a easier way i would welcome it. Is there a "package" we can buy where we just type in the words, and links etc??

<~ isnt being thick, but doesnt understand how web design works. Maybe i should ask my 8 yr old neighbour!

>> Edited by simond001 on Saturday 10th August 23:30

[chrisx666]

Got a copy of 'Namo Web Editor 3' on the front of PC Pro magazine and had my simple site up in a few hours. Easy and free. I have no intention of doing any more web editing so there was no point learning the code - let the editor do the hard work, it even has a 'publish' window that made uploading to my ISP a piece of p..

Chris.

[pelo]

CuteHTML works pretty good too, and faster than note or edit pad.
DONT use Microshit and then go to a text editor when u get more advanced (i did) - its really annnoying sifting thru the excess tags and bull.
but for simple as pages, frontpage express is great. U cant do great design work without code knowledge or a big (expensive) software package

www.geocities.com/pelosplace/ - frontpage+cuteHTML+editpad

[miniman]

quote:
The mini site is ideal, Its easy to "navigate" and the menu on the left is easy. But, it doesnt help a thicket like me understand how it works.

I have started using frontpage, but if there is a easier way i would welcome it. Is there a "package" we can buy where we just type in the words, and links etc??

<~ isnt being thick, but doesnt understand how web design works. Maybe i should ask my 8 yr old neighbour!

>> Edited by simond001 on Saturday 10th August 23:30

Thanks! It's nice to hear some positive feedback about the site.

It is written in ASP using a Microsoft Access database to feed (most of) the content. This means that you can easily add images, links etc. without modifying the pages themselves. They just read in as many links, pics etc. as are in the database.

The easiest way to learn ASP is to steal some! But, to do this, you need access to the source code of a site, as clicking View... Source will only show you the HTML that the ASP creates. I would be happy to share what (little) I know with anyone interested.

I would seriously recommend uninstalling FrontPage and burning, crushing or otherwise destroying the CD! The problem is that it creates a huge amount of un-necssary code which just slows the site down. MS Word is even worse! Dreamweaver actually shows you the bits of your code that are "bad" - missing tags, unnecessary tags etc.

Also, keep the graphics to a minimum - for example my rollover menu is all text, using a stylesheet to control the rollover effect. Using images means it takes longer to download.

Any q's, give me a shout!!

[antonyb]

richb

I'd have to agree with the dont use word comments... it can end up a real mess and really over complicates things. That said it's then hard to know what to suggest instead... notepad is the ideal i suppose, that way you know every aspect of how the site works. Practically it is a long process though, unless you find you are a natural (not many people are). The best middle ground has to be Macromedia's dreamweaver. It's what I use, (amongst other things). I made www.btinternet.com/~antonybailey (used to be on mtbobsessed.co.uk until BT shafted me ) and www.hifi-nirvana.co.uk with DW and Adobe Photoshop.

As for design - I think a good balance of layout, colour, fonts and overall good user experience is key. try not to use primary colours and in my opinion black is not a good background colour, things 'sink' into it and everything can turn very heavy.

Learn to compress the images you use to a sensible size without losing too much quality. Again the balance between image size against compression/quality loss is something worth practicing.

The best bit of advise I can give you, generally, (and please decide for yourself whether I'm worth listening to ) is to make loads of sites, make the initial ones that you will most likely feel are c*ap, learn from them and then make some more.

Anyway, hope this is in some way useful.

Good luck,

Ant


>> Edited by antonyb on Thursday 15th August 11:59

>> Edited by antonyb on Thursday 15th August 12:00

[wpresland]

I too have a website and I wrote it very simply. I found a website, which displayed pictures, and accidentally saved it (File, Save...)

Then open it in notepad/wordpad. It's a load or rubbish whcih I don't understand, but just change their wording for yours. Update your pictures and hey!!

A simple website

[ninja_eli]

If your time is worth money, and you want it to look relatively decent then frontpage or netobjects fusion will do the job without too much difficulty. It will set up all the folders for you and you can just upload.
Personally prefer netobjects fusion to Frontpage, but it maybe a little more complicated to use.

It really isnt that hard, and although I acknowledge comments regarding learning how everything works (I am like that too!) there is no real need to learn coding. Its a learning curve like anything else and a waste of your time if you don't use it often enough.

Regards