Used AWD commuter recommendations?

[theog87]

Evening all!

I've found a good indy Audi/VW place near me (Sam Harris Automotive, Folkestone, Kent) and thinking it might be nice to dip into the VW/Audi group again.
a
Requirements:
- Petrol
- AWD. Ideally more rear bias, if this is possible, or modifiable?
- ~35mpg
- Small hatch e.g. A3 max size.
- Ideally auto.
- ~£13k
- Any of these cars have steering column-mounted paddles? I dont like the ones on the steering wheel.

Just looking around and doing some research. Not looking to buy yet, so please no offers.

Currently, I'm doing 14k a year, so petrol prices do add up, hence quite keen on something efficient.

I'm looking for a smooth, but 'capable' ride for commuting and the odd trip to Europe. Not too bothered about 'raw' as I have my Impreza for that.

In short, I do not want a Golf R or an Audi S, as I'm pretty sure most of these have seen a hard life.

What is appealing to me at the moment is an A3 1.8T Auto Quattro ~2014. The 1.8T seems to get better MPG than the 2L, and I'm not really in need of too much power. I'm fairly sure a map of the 1.8T will be pretty tastey.

Thoughts welcome, would love to hear all the perks etc. I'm hoping that there are no 'bad eggs' in the range?

Best

T

[Dr G]

You've answered your own question.

8V A3 1.8t quattro.

Paddles are wheel mounted, and you'll need to tweak if you want to alter the handling balance but it's the closest you'll get to ticking every box. No real world difference in fuel economy to S3, and will hover around the low-mid 30s average. Should approach 40 on motorway.

[theog87]

Thanks for that confirmation!

Any ideas on how much power is given to the back of the awd system?

Any way for it to be fixed at 60% at the back?

[catso]

theog87 said:

Thanks for that confirmation!

Any ideas on how much power is given to the back of the awd system?

Any way for it to be fixed at 60% at the back?

My understanding of the Haldex AWD (as fitted to A3) is that the driveshaft to the rear is constantly turning, it has no centre diff and so can only deliver a maximum of 50% of power to the rear wheels.

The Haldex then acts as a kind of diff and varies the actual amount of drive 'taken' by the rear as conditions dictate, i.e. when the front wheels slip.

Though I think there are modifications that can be done to the controller to alter the way it works to get more rear drive, more of the time but still no more than 50%?

[theog87]

Ok thanks for that.

Who would i goto to ask for this kind of work? Someone who specialises in difs or gearboxes?

Is there any audi with more than 50% to the back?

[catso]

theog87 said:

Ok thanks for that.

Who would i goto to ask for this kind of work? Someone who specialises in difs or gearboxes?

Is there any audi with more than 50% to the back?

Haldex controllers are available from various tuners e.g. https://www.awesomegti.com/parts/transmission/hald...

The 'Torsen' quattro cars as per original 'quattro' is used in A4/5/6/8 etc. models and has a more rear biased setup, IIRC a 60/40 split (rear/front) and because of the centre diff have more flexibility, most would agree that it is a better system but not used in the smaller (transverse engined) cars.

[ninjag]

The S4 B8.5 got the crown gear centre differential from the RS5, so up to 85% of torque could be sent to the rear, but would it be too big a car?

[Dr G]

Why exactly do you want more torque to the rear axle?

That's not intended to be condescending, it's a genuine question. If the answer is what I think it is then there are better solutions than playing with torque split.

[theog87]

Dr G said:

Why exactly do you want more torque to the rear axle?

That's not intended to be condescending, it's a genuine question. If the answer is what I think it is then there are better solutions than playing with torque split.

Well, I really like as rear bias as possible for AWD.

TBH, I think an S4 would be lovely, but not right for what I'm looking for right now.

To be honest, since I have been contemplating it all, I'm starting to think the S1 might be a better option now, as it's just much easier to park in town centres etc.

I'm assuming the manual 2L will be even less likely to manipulate in terms of being more rear wheel bias. I doubt they have room for a centre diff in that!?

[theog87]

catso said:

Haldex controllers are available from various tuners e.g. https://www.awesomegti.com/parts/transmission/hald...

The 'Torsen' quattro cars as per original 'quattro' is used in A4/5/6/8 etc. models and has a more rear biased setup, IIRC a 60/40 split (rear/front) and because of the centre diff have more flexibility, most would agree that it is a better system but not used in the smaller (transverse engined) cars.

Thanks for this, much appricated!

[RizzoTheRat]

Octavia Scout? Bit longer than he A3 though.

If you want AWD but smaller than surely a Panda is the answer?

[theog87]

RizzoTheRat said:

Octavia Scout? Bit longer than he A3 though.

If you want AWD but smaller than surely a Panda is the answer?

I know what you mean. To be honest, I was looking around the suzuki Ignis AWD and the Swift AWD, but they just will be a touch too slow for me.

I'm aiming for 0-60 in ~9s really.

My current swift sport is around that, and just fine, just want the AWD.... i really wish they would do a swift sport awd, that would be incredible.

[RizzoTheRat]

There are some AWD versions of the MINI but dunno what prices are like, otherwise if you want quick and AWD then how about an Impreza?

[Dr G]

theog87 said:

Well, I really like as rear bias as possible for AWD.

What is it you like about the rear bias?

I'm going to read between the lines and assume it's handling balance you're after, rather than specifically wanting a different torque split. This is far easier and cheaper to alter with suspension rather than drive. The simplest modification you could make would be to add a relatively stiff rear roll bar. The standard one will be hollow and probably <20mm. Add a solid 22mm (which will probably come with some adjustment) rear bar and you'll neutralise the handling balance from the standard nose-led setup. The soft standard springs won't do much for dynamic camber on the front axle but it depends how far you want to go; next step could be a quality spring it (Eibach etc.) that would help here by maintaning alignment under load without being overly stiff for road use.

Edited by Dr G on Wednesday 29th November 14:10

[Dr G]

Random thought: early MK3 TT dropping into budget now too.

[theog87]

RizzoTheRat said:

There are some AWD versions of the MINI but dunno what prices are like, otherwise if you want quick and AWD then how about an Impreza?

Yeah mini would be ace, but the clubman is quite huge in reality and prices seem £15k+

I have a 2006 impreza sti, heavily modified.

I saw a 2L auto impreza going for £3k the other day... Not a special spec, but really tempting tbh... Having two imprezas is kinda funny though haha

I think the S1 is still looking the best as the impreza has a terrible turning circle, not ideal for town parking etc

[theog87]

Dr G said:

Random thought: early MK3 TT dropping into budget now too.

I know what you mean! Tempting.

Kinda need decent space for my 5 year old son though. Arg

[theog87]

Dr G said:

What is it you like about the rear bias?

I'm going to read between the lines and assume it's handling balance you're after, rather than specifically wanting a different torque split. This is far easier and cheaper to alter with suspension rather than drive. The simplest modification you could make would be to add a relatively stiff rear roll bar. The standard one will be hollow and probably <20mm. Add a solid 22mm (which will probably come with some adjustment) rear bar and you'll neutralise the handling balance from the standard nose-led setup. The soft standard springs won't do much for dynamic camber on the front axle but it depends how far you want to go; next step could be a quality spring it (Eibach etc.) that would help here by maintaning alignment under load without being overly stiff for road use.

Edited by Dr G on Wednesday 29th November 14:10

In short, when i loose traction, i like the response of more rear end powervthan the front nose slide. Type thing.

[RizzoTheRat]

The standard 2 liter, maybe, bit surely a modified STI should be able to turn around in it's own length

[Dr G]

theog87 said:

In short, when i loose traction, i like the response of more rear end powervthan the front nose slide. Type thing.

An A3 1.8T quattro (even tuned) isn't going to have enough torque to overwhelm the tyres without wet grass or snow.