Audi RS4 diff rebuild
Discussion
Anybody know of a company that rebuilds Quattro diffs?
My RS4 (B8) recently started making a horrible whining noise when I lift off the throttle, so I've taken it into the dealer. They've diagnosed the fault as being with the final drive. Probably a bearing or something, but it's a "sealed part", so they won't open it up and inspect it. They've quoted me £9k to fix it, as they'd simply replace the entire rear drive line.
As I see it, I have three options:
1) The dealer were supposed to get back to me this morning, having spoken to Audi UK about goodwill. Needless to say, I've heard nothing, but will chase up this afternoon. I'm not holding my breath on a reasonable deal.
2) Buy a used diff
3) Remove the current diff and get it rebuilt with new bearings etc.
My worry about option 2 is that by buying a used diff, I don't know what condition it's in, other than a visual inspection. Option 3 sounds the best to me, but I don't know the extent of the damage to my diff until I remove it (is it just a bearing, or is it more serious?). Problem is, I can't seem to find anywhere that does rebuilds of Audi differentials. I've seen a few posts from people who have rebuilt them themselves, but I'd rather not go down that route unless I have to. If anyone has any recommendations, please let me know!
My RS4 (B8) recently started making a horrible whining noise when I lift off the throttle, so I've taken it into the dealer. They've diagnosed the fault as being with the final drive. Probably a bearing or something, but it's a "sealed part", so they won't open it up and inspect it. They've quoted me £9k to fix it, as they'd simply replace the entire rear drive line.
As I see it, I have three options:
1) The dealer were supposed to get back to me this morning, having spoken to Audi UK about goodwill. Needless to say, I've heard nothing, but will chase up this afternoon. I'm not holding my breath on a reasonable deal.
2) Buy a used diff
3) Remove the current diff and get it rebuilt with new bearings etc.
My worry about option 2 is that by buying a used diff, I don't know what condition it's in, other than a visual inspection. Option 3 sounds the best to me, but I don't know the extent of the damage to my diff until I remove it (is it just a bearing, or is it more serious?). Problem is, I can't seem to find anywhere that does rebuilds of Audi differentials. I've seen a few posts from people who have rebuilt them themselves, but I'd rather not go down that route unless I have to. If anyone has any recommendations, please let me know!
I've wondered exactly the same thing.
Haven't personally been affected but have on a couple of occasions been offered cars (both older S4s) with failed/failed/unwell sport differentials that were otherwise really nice. The cost of replacement made repair uneconomical.
It's the reason I'm religious about observing their service intervals.
If you do manage to find out anything useful on this subject I'd be interested to hear it.
Haven't personally been affected but have on a couple of occasions been offered cars (both older S4s) with failed/failed/unwell sport differentials that were otherwise really nice. The cost of replacement made repair uneconomical.
It's the reason I'm religious about observing their service intervals.
If you do manage to find out anything useful on this subject I'd be interested to hear it.
So the service history thing is what's really bothering me. The car has done 47k miles and has been serviced to the letter, always at an Audi main dealer. It went in at 38k miles for a service and at that time I was told the DSG oil needed changing at 43k miles, along with the diffs.
There seems to be some difference of opinion on the schedule here, with most people reporting that the diffs are due at 40k, not 43k.
So, the story is, it had its DSG and diff oils changed at 43k, as recommended, along with the brake fluid and some other bits. 4k miles later, it starts making a whining noise, which turns out be the final drive.
Now, to my mind, I don't expect to be replacing a diff at 47k miles, especially when it's been serviced to Audi recommended intervals and has very recently had the diffs serviced. Based on that, I've asked the dealer to talk to Audi UK about goodwill, to bring the number down from £9k. I've not heard anything on that front yet, despite being promised a call this morning and having chased it this afternoon. If the number doesn't come in a LOT lower (like <£2k), then to my mind it's not worth doing. Replacing the entire driveline for the sake of what's probably a £100 bearing is just massive overkill.
Problem is, if I can't find somewhere that will recondition the diff, my only other option is a used diff of unknown heritage. I reckon that will cost me around £1k all in, so I'd be willing to go to £2k for what the main dealer want to do. It seems unlikely they'll come down to that figure.
There seems to be some difference of opinion on the schedule here, with most people reporting that the diffs are due at 40k, not 43k.
So, the story is, it had its DSG and diff oils changed at 43k, as recommended, along with the brake fluid and some other bits. 4k miles later, it starts making a whining noise, which turns out be the final drive.
Now, to my mind, I don't expect to be replacing a diff at 47k miles, especially when it's been serviced to Audi recommended intervals and has very recently had the diffs serviced. Based on that, I've asked the dealer to talk to Audi UK about goodwill, to bring the number down from £9k. I've not heard anything on that front yet, despite being promised a call this morning and having chased it this afternoon. If the number doesn't come in a LOT lower (like <£2k), then to my mind it's not worth doing. Replacing the entire driveline for the sake of what's probably a £100 bearing is just massive overkill.
Problem is, if I can't find somewhere that will recondition the diff, my only other option is a used diff of unknown heritage. I reckon that will cost me around £1k all in, so I'd be willing to go to £2k for what the main dealer want to do. It seems unlikely they'll come down to that figure.
Has anyone actually had a specific "rear diff oil change", not DSG or such but specific to the sports differential.
I have spoken to about 3 Audi dealers and a few Specialist indys and no one will quote to change the rear diff oil, its felt like banging my head against a brick wall.
Mine isn't an RS or S but does have the sports diffs, which at least the indys understood that.
I have spoken to about 3 Audi dealers and a few Specialist indys and no one will quote to change the rear diff oil, its felt like banging my head against a brick wall.
Mine isn't an RS or S but does have the sports diffs, which at least the indys understood that.
Dr G said:
Do you have that in writing on the advice sheet?
Message me if you like and we'll have a good look at what's been done and when.
Good question. I've got the paperwork at home, so I'll check.Message me if you like and we'll have a good look at what's been done and when.
I'm not having much luck with Audi so far. since quoting me £9k, I asked them to make some enquiries about goodwill. They said they'd call by midday yesterday and didn't. I've chased them twice and they still haven't called to let me know what's going on, despite keeping hold of my car and leaving me with no courtesy car. Colour me unimpressed.
Icehanger said:
Has anyone actually had a specific "rear diff oil change", not DSG or such but specific to the sports differential.
I have spoken to about 3 Audi dealers and a few Specialist indys and no one will quote to change the rear diff oil, its felt like banging my head against a brick wall.
Mine isn't an RS or S but does have the sports diffs, which at least the indys understood that.
Audi do not schedule a sport diff oil change on non-RS models but there's no reason why you couldn't do it.I have spoken to about 3 Audi dealers and a few Specialist indys and no one will quote to change the rear diff oil, its felt like banging my head against a brick wall.
Mine isn't an RS or S but does have the sports diffs, which at least the indys understood that.
theredmini said:
Good question. I've got the paperwork at home, so I'll check.
That may be very relevant to giving your request for goodwill some weight.I'd get that in order (as I say, happy to assist with setting out what's been done and what should have been done) and then open a complaint with customer service.
At 38k your dealer should have advised that S-Tronic, front final drive, rear final drive, and rear differential oil changes were due. On their advice this work was delayed and a component directly affected by this is now not behaving.
3k miles on that oil change probably makes no difference but were the shoe on the other foot with a warranty company you can't help but wonder what they'd think.
Having looked into this some time ago for someone else, it appears the bearings are not standard sizes. They are also not available as individual components from Audi. So of your solutions, only new or used complete diff replacement are viable options, unless someone has started to specifically offer a sports diff refurb option based on parts they've managed to source.
I had to fight to get Audi to agree to replace the instrument cluster on our 2011 S5 Sportback - largely because, as you've found, they'll just quote the replacement cost without batting an eyelid! I understand in more recent times dealers have been given much greater scope to agree contributions locally. For the instrument cluster I paid 10% of the bill (about £100-150 IIRC) and Audi covered 90%
Given the low miles, Audi history and recent service I'd be in the same place as you in terms of expectations for them to cover the bulk of the cost. It's not acceptable for it to fail at such low miles. The only caveat to that is if the car has ever been remapped and/or tracked to the point that the ECU may have stored over-torque events in the transmission. I very much doubt it will have, given it's an NA engine and not forced induction but it's a tack they might take.
Have you had it scanned by someone to see if there's a stored fault showing?
The person who previously was looking for info on this ended up identifying a suitable used part from German ebay and had it shipped over and fitted
I had to fight to get Audi to agree to replace the instrument cluster on our 2011 S5 Sportback - largely because, as you've found, they'll just quote the replacement cost without batting an eyelid! I understand in more recent times dealers have been given much greater scope to agree contributions locally. For the instrument cluster I paid 10% of the bill (about £100-150 IIRC) and Audi covered 90%
Given the low miles, Audi history and recent service I'd be in the same place as you in terms of expectations for them to cover the bulk of the cost. It's not acceptable for it to fail at such low miles. The only caveat to that is if the car has ever been remapped and/or tracked to the point that the ECU may have stored over-torque events in the transmission. I very much doubt it will have, given it's an NA engine and not forced induction but it's a tack they might take.
Have you had it scanned by someone to see if there's a stored fault showing?
The person who previously was looking for info on this ended up identifying a suitable used part from German ebay and had it shipped over and fitted
A good news update!
I finally had a response from the dealer yesterday afternoon. They're going to cover the cost of the parts and I'll pay the labour, meaning the cost to me has gone from £9k to £645. Result! I mean it's still £645 that I shouldn't have to spend, but in the circumstances, I'll take that.
Adrian E, you're bang on with how Audi work. The guy I spoke to yesterday (a different person to the one I was dealing with previously and much more switched on) started the conversation by saying "there's no such thing as goodwill with Audi". You're not kidding, I thought! The cost has been covered by the dealer and they'll no doubt have a mechanism to recover some of the cost from Audi. He said the agreement to cover the cost was based entirely on the age and service history of the car and that typically the response for a car that's out of warranty would be tough luck.
I did scan for codes before taking it into the dealer and nothing showed up.
Thanks to Dr G and others who responded to this thread with offers of help. It's much appreciated, even if thankfully not required.
For the benefit of anyone who comes across this thread in the future with a similar issue, all my avenues of investigation around rebuilding the diff have come up blank. It would appear that quattro diffs are seen as bullet proof and therefore nobody bothers offering a service to rebuild them. Also, from Adrian E's response, I guess it's hard to get hold of the parts for anyone to be able to rebuild the diff. If Audi hadn't come up with the offer to pay for the new diff, my only other option would have been to buy a used diff and swap it out, which isn't ideal, as it would be of unknown provenance.
I'm now left with a decision on what to do with the car once it's fixed. I love the car, but the ownership experience has been pretty terrible to date (this isn't my first disappointing experience with an Audi dealer) and it's really jaded my view. I'm tempted to just get shot of it so I don't have to deal with Audi ever again. Problem is, it ticks all the boxes for me in a way that few other cars can. I'll probably keep it for a few months while I decide what to do.
I finally had a response from the dealer yesterday afternoon. They're going to cover the cost of the parts and I'll pay the labour, meaning the cost to me has gone from £9k to £645. Result! I mean it's still £645 that I shouldn't have to spend, but in the circumstances, I'll take that.
Adrian E, you're bang on with how Audi work. The guy I spoke to yesterday (a different person to the one I was dealing with previously and much more switched on) started the conversation by saying "there's no such thing as goodwill with Audi". You're not kidding, I thought! The cost has been covered by the dealer and they'll no doubt have a mechanism to recover some of the cost from Audi. He said the agreement to cover the cost was based entirely on the age and service history of the car and that typically the response for a car that's out of warranty would be tough luck.
I did scan for codes before taking it into the dealer and nothing showed up.
Thanks to Dr G and others who responded to this thread with offers of help. It's much appreciated, even if thankfully not required.
For the benefit of anyone who comes across this thread in the future with a similar issue, all my avenues of investigation around rebuilding the diff have come up blank. It would appear that quattro diffs are seen as bullet proof and therefore nobody bothers offering a service to rebuild them. Also, from Adrian E's response, I guess it's hard to get hold of the parts for anyone to be able to rebuild the diff. If Audi hadn't come up with the offer to pay for the new diff, my only other option would have been to buy a used diff and swap it out, which isn't ideal, as it would be of unknown provenance.
I'm now left with a decision on what to do with the car once it's fixed. I love the car, but the ownership experience has been pretty terrible to date (this isn't my first disappointing experience with an Audi dealer) and it's really jaded my view. I'm tempted to just get shot of it so I don't have to deal with Audi ever again. Problem is, it ticks all the boxes for me in a way that few other cars can. I'll probably keep it for a few months while I decide what to do.
I'm really pleased that Audi played ball, given your mileage and age it's all you deserved and I do actually think that forums have helped owners in these situations, they now know that news travels fast.
I had a B8 RS4 a couple of years ago and was totally confused by the service intervals and so were the dealers. When it came to service time I called 3 different dealers and their advice was different on every occasion regarding oil changes for gearbox, engine and diffs. I can believe that a few owners will not have done what was required based on the conflicting advice, cost differential was significant.
I had a B8 RS4 a couple of years ago and was totally confused by the service intervals and so were the dealers. When it came to service time I called 3 different dealers and their advice was different on every occasion regarding oil changes for gearbox, engine and diffs. I can believe that a few owners will not have done what was required based on the conflicting advice, cost differential was significant.
Dr G said:
Front final drive is 20, fluids in rear diff are 40.
Sorry for the thread hi jack, but Dr G, are you saying it's all RS and S models which need this, or just RS?Reason being I have a sport diff on my 2016 S5, so would like to make sure I dont overlook the fluid change. (the car is in for a service in a fortnight and has done 21k miles currently, so the front might need changing by the sounds of it, if that is the case?
Thanks
P.S. - Glad you got yours sorted OP. (it's incidents like this which make me wonder if I'm better off extending my warranty at expiry as opposed to going for a Revo Stage 1 map)
theredmini said:
A good news update!
I finally had a response from the dealer yesterday afternoon. They're going to cover the cost of the parts and I'll pay the labour, meaning the cost to me has gone from £9k to £645. Result! I mean it's still £645 that I shouldn't have to spend, but in the circumstances, I'll take that.
Adrian E, you're bang on with how Audi work. The guy I spoke to yesterday (a different person to the one I was dealing with previously and much more switched on) started the conversation by saying "there's no such thing as goodwill with Audi". You're not kidding, I thought! The cost has been covered by the dealer and they'll no doubt have a mechanism to recover some of the cost from Audi. He said the agreement to cover the cost was based entirely on the age and service history of the car and that typically the response for a car that's out of warranty would be tough luck.
I did scan for codes before taking it into the dealer and nothing showed up.
Thanks to Dr G and others who responded to this thread with offers of help. It's much appreciated, even if thankfully not required.
For the benefit of anyone who comes across this thread in the future with a similar issue, all my avenues of investigation around rebuilding the diff have come up blank. It would appear that quattro diffs are seen as bullet proof and therefore nobody bothers offering a service to rebuild them. Also, from Adrian E's response, I guess it's hard to get hold of the parts for anyone to be able to rebuild the diff. If Audi hadn't come up with the offer to pay for the new diff, my only other option would have been to buy a used diff and swap it out, which isn't ideal, as it would be of unknown provenance.
I'm now left with a decision on what to do with the car once it's fixed. I love the car, but the ownership experience has been pretty terrible to date (this isn't my first disappointing experience with an Audi dealer) and it's really jaded my view. I'm tempted to just get shot of it so I don't have to deal with Audi ever again. Problem is, it ticks all the boxes for me in a way that few other cars can. I'll probably keep it for a few months while I decide what to do.
Hi mate, how hard did you have to push Audi? I have the same issue on a 39k RS4 I finally had a response from the dealer yesterday afternoon. They're going to cover the cost of the parts and I'll pay the labour, meaning the cost to me has gone from £9k to £645. Result! I mean it's still £645 that I shouldn't have to spend, but in the circumstances, I'll take that.
Adrian E, you're bang on with how Audi work. The guy I spoke to yesterday (a different person to the one I was dealing with previously and much more switched on) started the conversation by saying "there's no such thing as goodwill with Audi". You're not kidding, I thought! The cost has been covered by the dealer and they'll no doubt have a mechanism to recover some of the cost from Audi. He said the agreement to cover the cost was based entirely on the age and service history of the car and that typically the response for a car that's out of warranty would be tough luck.
I did scan for codes before taking it into the dealer and nothing showed up.
Thanks to Dr G and others who responded to this thread with offers of help. It's much appreciated, even if thankfully not required.
For the benefit of anyone who comes across this thread in the future with a similar issue, all my avenues of investigation around rebuilding the diff have come up blank. It would appear that quattro diffs are seen as bullet proof and therefore nobody bothers offering a service to rebuild them. Also, from Adrian E's response, I guess it's hard to get hold of the parts for anyone to be able to rebuild the diff. If Audi hadn't come up with the offer to pay for the new diff, my only other option would have been to buy a used diff and swap it out, which isn't ideal, as it would be of unknown provenance.
I'm now left with a decision on what to do with the car once it's fixed. I love the car, but the ownership experience has been pretty terrible to date (this isn't my first disappointing experience with an Audi dealer) and it's really jaded my view. I'm tempted to just get shot of it so I don't have to deal with Audi ever again. Problem is, it ticks all the boxes for me in a way that few other cars can. I'll probably keep it for a few months while I decide what to do.
Mpginoz said:
theredmini said:
A good news update!
I finally had a response from the dealer yesterday afternoon. They're going to cover the cost of the parts and I'll pay the labour, meaning the cost to me has gone from £9k to £645. Result! I mean it's still £645 that I shouldn't have to spend, but in the circumstances, I'll take that.
Adrian E, you're bang on with how Audi work. The guy I spoke to yesterday (a different person to the one I was dealing with previously and much more switched on) started the conversation by saying "there's no such thing as goodwill with Audi". You're not kidding, I thought! The cost has been covered by the dealer and they'll no doubt have a mechanism to recover some of the cost from Audi. He said the agreement to cover the cost was based entirely on the age and service history of the car and that typically the response for a car that's out of warranty would be tough luck.
I did scan for codes before taking it into the dealer and nothing showed up.
Thanks to Dr G and others who responded to this thread with offers of help. It's much appreciated, even if thankfully not required.
For the benefit of anyone who comes across this thread in the future with a similar issue, all my avenues of investigation around rebuilding the diff have come up blank. It would appear that quattro diffs are seen as bullet proof and therefore nobody bothers offering a service to rebuild them. Also, from Adrian E's response, I guess it's hard to get hold of the parts for anyone to be able to rebuild the diff. If Audi hadn't come up with the offer to pay for the new diff, my only other option would have been to buy a used diff and swap it out, which isn't ideal, as it would be of unknown provenance.
I'm now left with a decision on what to do with the car once it's fixed. I love the car, but the ownership experience has been pretty terrible to date (this isn't my first disappointing experience with an Audi dealer) and it's really jaded my view. I'm tempted to just get shot of it so I don't have to deal with Audi ever again. Problem is, it ticks all the boxes for me in a way that few other cars can. I'll probably keep it for a few months while I decide what to do.
Hi mate, how hard did you have to push Audi? I have the same issue on a 39k RS4 I finally had a response from the dealer yesterday afternoon. They're going to cover the cost of the parts and I'll pay the labour, meaning the cost to me has gone from £9k to £645. Result! I mean it's still £645 that I shouldn't have to spend, but in the circumstances, I'll take that.
Adrian E, you're bang on with how Audi work. The guy I spoke to yesterday (a different person to the one I was dealing with previously and much more switched on) started the conversation by saying "there's no such thing as goodwill with Audi". You're not kidding, I thought! The cost has been covered by the dealer and they'll no doubt have a mechanism to recover some of the cost from Audi. He said the agreement to cover the cost was based entirely on the age and service history of the car and that typically the response for a car that's out of warranty would be tough luck.
I did scan for codes before taking it into the dealer and nothing showed up.
Thanks to Dr G and others who responded to this thread with offers of help. It's much appreciated, even if thankfully not required.
For the benefit of anyone who comes across this thread in the future with a similar issue, all my avenues of investigation around rebuilding the diff have come up blank. It would appear that quattro diffs are seen as bullet proof and therefore nobody bothers offering a service to rebuild them. Also, from Adrian E's response, I guess it's hard to get hold of the parts for anyone to be able to rebuild the diff. If Audi hadn't come up with the offer to pay for the new diff, my only other option would have been to buy a used diff and swap it out, which isn't ideal, as it would be of unknown provenance.
I'm now left with a decision on what to do with the car once it's fixed. I love the car, but the ownership experience has been pretty terrible to date (this isn't my first disappointing experience with an Audi dealer) and it's really jaded my view. I'm tempted to just get shot of it so I don't have to deal with Audi ever again. Problem is, it ticks all the boxes for me in a way that few other cars can. I'll probably keep it for a few months while I decide what to do.
...and now the same thing has happened to me...
2015 RS4 Avant, 52,000 miles, full Audi main agent service history including all the diffs and gearbox oils changed, by Audi, in line with their specifications. 3 weeks ago, a transmission noise became evident. Audi have diagnosed that the rear diff bearings have broken up. The estimated bill ? £14,500 !!!
Audi have offered to pay half, but that still leaves me with a £7k+ bill on a fully dealer maintained car, literally maintained regardless of cost. I've been a long term RS owner - RS6, 2x RS4s, current model RS3 etc, but they really don't appear to care about any loyalty to their long term customers... I won't buy an Audi again (including the e-tron which I had been thinking of) unless they pay materially more towards the repair. I've copied Audi AG's CEO and other Board Members on my latest response. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what I need to do to make Audi listen to me and pay more of this unwelcome repair ? Rock-on Audi Tunbridge Wells !
Many thanks !
2015 RS4 Avant, 52,000 miles, full Audi main agent service history including all the diffs and gearbox oils changed, by Audi, in line with their specifications. 3 weeks ago, a transmission noise became evident. Audi have diagnosed that the rear diff bearings have broken up. The estimated bill ? £14,500 !!!
Audi have offered to pay half, but that still leaves me with a £7k+ bill on a fully dealer maintained car, literally maintained regardless of cost. I've been a long term RS owner - RS6, 2x RS4s, current model RS3 etc, but they really don't appear to care about any loyalty to their long term customers... I won't buy an Audi again (including the e-tron which I had been thinking of) unless they pay materially more towards the repair. I've copied Audi AG's CEO and other Board Members on my latest response. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what I need to do to make Audi listen to me and pay more of this unwelcome repair ? Rock-on Audi Tunbridge Wells !
Many thanks !
Hi there,
I’ve just had the same issue, took my 2013 rs4 into a local mechanic as it was making a loud noise (sounded like a jet engine) from the rear and the guys said rear diff failed that’s it. Quote was £9k but I’m not sure if they just googled and say the original quote at the top of this feed. Only done 44k miles from new and has Audi service history. Not sure what my options are but get a gear box specialist to take a look (if that is the issues). I thought it was wheel bearings at first but they are not convinced.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
I’ve just had the same issue, took my 2013 rs4 into a local mechanic as it was making a loud noise (sounded like a jet engine) from the rear and the guys said rear diff failed that’s it. Quote was £9k but I’m not sure if they just googled and say the original quote at the top of this feed. Only done 44k miles from new and has Audi service history. Not sure what my options are but get a gear box specialist to take a look (if that is the issues). I thought it was wheel bearings at first but they are not convinced.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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