What are the Jaguar tuners?
Discussion
What are the Jaguar equivalents of Brabus and Alpina? I know of Arden. But that is more or only a body kit company I think. There is Startech. But again not sure they are it. Or Lister? Is there anything else? I seem to remember another but can't come up with the name. Not sure if it was British. Maybe Dutch. Or maybe I'm thinking of a racing company instead. But do we have a Brabus or Alpina for Jaguar?
Paramount is basically like Arden right? More a body kit afair. And isn't Swallows basically a chip tuning company with a few service mods? Nothing like Alpina or Brabus right, where they modify the cars so much internally and externally that they even assign them new model names. I guess by law they are actually manufacturers themselves Was there ever something like this for Jaguar, regardless if it is still in business or not?
Alpina basically makes BMW's more Jaguar-like and isn't Brabus more of an in-house 'tuning arm' these days (in which case Jaguar's SVO would be the equivalent) - although I think both are regarded as manufacturers in their own right.
The only equivalent in the independent manufacturer sense would be Lister, although they are a far smaller/more exclusive operation.
The only equivalent in the independent manufacturer sense would be Lister, although they are a far smaller/more exclusive operation.
I think you may be confusing Brabus with AMG. As far as I know, Brabus is independent, as is Alpina.
SVO would be like AMG or BMW M. I guess SVO has replaced Jaguar R name.
But both Alpina and Brabus are full service tuners. Their cars have distinct looks and engine, suspension, brakes etc mods. They look and drive different.
SVO would be like AMG or BMW M. I guess SVO has replaced Jaguar R name.
But both Alpina and Brabus are full service tuners. Their cars have distinct looks and engine, suspension, brakes etc mods. They look and drive different.
Edited by ZackM on Sunday 6th June 10:12
Simpo Two said:
The only other one I can think of is TWR, but they're now defunct.
I think that generally manufacturers themselves develop and sell the 'hot' models now.
Has TWR ever made tuned versions of the XKs, XJs, S-type, X-type etc? I thought they were a racing operation. I know of their involvement with the XJ220 and XK8 development. But wasn't aware they had made tuned Jags. What are they called?I think that generally manufacturers themselves develop and sell the 'hot' models now.
ZackM said:
Simpo Two said:
The only other one I can think of is TWR, but they're now defunct.
I think that generally manufacturers themselves develop and sell the 'hot' models now.
Has TWR ever made tuned versions of the XKs, XJs, S-type, X-type etc? I thought they were a racing operation. I know of their involvement with the XJ220 and XK8 development. But wasn't aware they had made tuned Jags. What are they called?I think that generally manufacturers themselves develop and sell the 'hot' models now.
groomi said:
Back in the 80's, TWR teamed up with Jaguar to form 'Jaguarsport' which was basically what SVO is now. They were responsible for the XJ40 XJR and XJR-S models. I think the XJR-15 may also have come under that banner...
Yep: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Walkinshaw_Racin...Rather more race-biased than some I agree, but if you want to go racing you have to be pretty good at tuning too.
Also for BMW there was Hartge, but defunct in 2019.
And Ford had Cosworth of course.
Simpo Two said:
Yep: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Walkinshaw_Racin...
Rather more race-biased than some I agree, but if you want to go racing you have to be pretty good at tuning too.
Also for BMW there was Hartge, but defunct in 2019.
And Ford had Cosworth of course.
Did Cosworth tune any of the Ford era Jags? Did anybody actually? I think Startech had a tuned version of the S-Type. But I'm not sure. Maybe was another company.Rather more race-biased than some I agree, but if you want to go racing you have to be pretty good at tuning too.
Also for BMW there was Hartge, but defunct in 2019.
And Ford had Cosworth of course.
ZackM said:
Paramount is basically like Arden right? More a body kit afair. And isn't Swallows basically a chip tuning company with a few service mods? Nothing like Alpina or Brabus right, where they modify the cars so much internally and externally that they even assign them new model names. I guess by law they are actually manufacturers themselves Was there ever something like this for Jaguar, regardless if it is still in business or not?
Not according to their website and not from my experience , Beecham were another company that did a lot of work on the Jaguar Mk 2 .https://www.paramount-performance.com/jaguar
I thought your Post was concerned with tuning , now suddenly tuning is irrelevant if it doesnt amount to a renaming ?
reddiesel said:
Not according to their website and not from my experience , Beecham were another company that did a lot of work on the Jaguar Mk 2 .
https://www.paramount-performance.com/jaguar
I thought your Post was concerned with tuning , now suddenly tuning is irrelevant if it doesnt amount to a renaming ?
Well, in my original post I did ask about tuners similar to Alpina and Brabus. https://www.paramount-performance.com/jaguar
I thought your Post was concerned with tuning , now suddenly tuning is irrelevant if it doesnt amount to a renaming ?
I was just wondering if that type of thing is exclusive to the Germans or even to German cars.
So yes, I never asked about chip tuning shops and the like.
I even mentioned that Arden and similar set ups wasn't what I was asking about. ZackM said:
I think you may be confusing Brabus with AMG. As far as I know, Brabus is independent, as is Alpina.
SVO would be like AMG or BMW M. I guess SVO has replaced Jaguar R name.
But both Alpina and Brabus are full service tuners. Their cars have distinct looks and engine, suspension, brakes etc mods. They look and drive different.
Most Alpina BMW are almost indistinguishable from the Standard Cars visually except for the Alpina Wheels , Steering Wheel and discreet Badging SVO would be like AMG or BMW M. I guess SVO has replaced Jaguar R name.
But both Alpina and Brabus are full service tuners. Their cars have distinct looks and engine, suspension, brakes etc mods. They look and drive different.
Edited by ZackM on Sunday 6th June 10:12
https://www.historics.co.uk/buying/auctions/2016-0...
Here is a Paramount Jaguar XKR , much changed over the standard item engineering wise but visually like the Alpina BMWs not that different visually .
There is no equivalent of Alpina as they have a very unique relationship with BMW.
Arden have been around for a long time and are far more than just a body kit company although they have got less and less mechanically involved as the years go on
Paramount performance and swallow are aftermarket parts and tuners
Lister is probably the closest to Alpina but is not really the company it was in the past with the knobleys and stuff
Depending on what car you have and what you want doing a lot of stuff is achieved just be a remap these days as said
Arden have been around for a long time and are far more than just a body kit company although they have got less and less mechanically involved as the years go on
Paramount performance and swallow are aftermarket parts and tuners
Lister is probably the closest to Alpina but is not really the company it was in the past with the knobleys and stuff
Depending on what car you have and what you want doing a lot of stuff is achieved just be a remap these days as said
ZackM said:
Well, in my original post I did ask about tuners similar to Alpina and Brabus.
I was just wondering if that type of thing is exclusive to the Germans or even to German cars.
So yes, I never asked about chip tuning shops and the like. I even mentioned that Arden and similar set ups wasn't what I was asking about.
Paramount is similar to Alpina and Brabus like I have already told you , unfortunately you have trouble accepting this reality . I am stunned I have responded to your pointless ramblings this long , sadly it seems you are one of these Turnips that believe they know the answer before they even ask the question , someone gives an honest and accurate reply and rather than accept this as fact , off you go around the houses and say you have been misunderstood and thats not what you asked at all . I am off down the Pub now , knowing the luck I have been having lately I fully expect to find you at the Bar penniless and looking for company .I was just wondering if that type of thing is exclusive to the Germans or even to German cars.
So yes, I never asked about chip tuning shops and the like.
I even mentioned that Arden and similar set ups wasn't what I was asking about. craigjm said:
There is no equivalent of Alpina as they have a very unique relationship with BMW.
This is what I was thinking. But I think the same is true for any other non German brand right? The whole custom tuner thing was started by the Germans it seems. So it makes sense that only the German cars have had such treatment. Even Arden and Startech, which do Jaguars are German companies. Startech if I'm not wrong is part of Brabus.craigjm said:
Arden have been around for a long time and are far more than just a body kit company although they have got less and less mechanically involved as the years go on
But have they ever been full custom tuners? I mean AMG as an independent and Brabus built custom engines to go with their body kits, custom suspension etc. Was Arden ever at this level? I know them only for the body kits and a few aftermarket parts.craigjm said:
Paramount performance and swallow are aftermarket parts and tuners
Yeah, like them there are a few. But quite different than old AMG, Brabus, Alpina etc. I guess maybe Carlsson could also be put in there. But not sure they did enough. I guess to be what Alpina, Brabus etc are, the company needs to be qualified as a builder or manufacturer, as tuners is just too open of a term.craigjm said:
Lister is probably the closest to Alpina but is not really the company it was in the past with the knobleys and stuff
Looking around indeed Lister seems to be closest. At least back in the day.I guess it really goes back to the whole thing being a German deal. I guess there is no Brabus/Alpina/old AMG equivalent for Alfas, Maseratis, Astons etc either.
Edited by ZackM on Sunday 6th June 16:06
Red diesel Paramount is NOT similar to Alpina. Which Paramount modification is carried out on a car in the factory during build? At what point of the design stage of a car do Jaguar invite paramount in to start developing their version with the blueprints? None and never is the answer. The BMW and Alpina relationship really is unique. They are actually registered as a manufacturer in their own right unlike Brabus and others that are very much aftermarket tuners. No other modifying company in the world has a relationship with an OEM like Alpina does with BMW. Oh and Alpina make more money out of wine than they do cars too 
zackM in the 70s and 80s Arden used to modify the engines and operate very similar to the likes of AMG. They will still do this with the old models but went off the boil somewhat with the Ford era cars and beyond
zackM in the 70s and 80s Arden used to modify the engines and operate very similar to the likes of AMG. They will still do this with the old models but went off the boil somewhat with the Ford era cars and beyond
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:15
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:17
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:18
craigjm said:
Red diesel Paramount is NOT similar to Alpina. Which Paramount modification is carried out on a car in the factory during build? At what point of the design stage of a car do Jaguar invite paramount in to start developing their version with the blueprints? None and never is the answer. The BMW and Alpina relationship really is unique. They are actually registered as a manufacturer in their own right unlike Brabus and others that are very much aftermarket tuners. No other modifying company in the world has a relationship with an OEM like Alpina does with BMW. Oh and Alpina make more money out of wine than they do cars too
zackM in the 70s and 80s Arden used to modify the engines and operate very similar to the likes of AMG. They will still do this with the old models but went off the boil somewhat with the Ford era cars and beyond
Why is it not similar Craig , both modify vehicles by fitting enhanced equipment to existing cars , is that true or not ? The only difference is that Alpina deliver the parts to the BMW Factory where they are then fitted by BMWzackM in the 70s and 80s Arden used to modify the engines and operate very similar to the likes of AMG. They will still do this with the old models but went off the boil somewhat with the Ford era cars and beyond
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:15
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:17
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:18
craigjm said:
Red diesel Paramount is NOT similar to Alpina. Which Paramount modification is carried out on a car in the factory during build? At what point of the design stage of a car do Jaguar invite paramount in to start developing their version with the blueprints? None and never is the answer. The BMW and Alpina relationship really is unique. They are actually registered as a manufacturer in their own right unlike Brabus and others that are very much aftermarket tuners. No other modifying company in the world has a relationship with an OEM like Alpina does with BMW. Oh and Alpina make more money out of wine than they do cars too
zackM in the 70s and 80s Arden used to modify the engines and operate very similar to the likes of AMG. They will still do this with the old models but went off the boil somewhat with the Ford era cars and beyond
The Thread Title is " What are the Jaguar Tuners " have I answered that question correctly Craig ? Absolutely no mention in the thread Title of the tuning having to be done in house . You mention AMG , AMG is often no more than a badge and wider wheels and absolutely no additional tuning whatsoever .zackM in the 70s and 80s Arden used to modify the engines and operate very similar to the likes of AMG. They will still do this with the old models but went off the boil somewhat with the Ford era cars and beyond
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:15
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:17
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 16:18
I think Sunday must bring out the Pedants .
reddiesel said:
The Thread Title is " What are the Jaguar Tuners " have I answered that question correctly Craig ? Absolutely no mention in the thread Title of the tuning having to be done in house . You mention AMG , AMG is often no more than a badge and wider wheels and absolutely no additional tuning whatsoever .
I think Sunday must bring out the Pedants .
I never said you hadn’t answered the question correctly I just said your statement that Paramount is like Alpina is totally wrong, and it is. My mention of AMG was in the context of the 70s and 80s within the Arden comment. AMG was a respected tuner and racing prep company prior to Mercedes buying it and since they have owned it the AMG division is no different and is a fully self sufficient division that builds engines for Aston Martin too. The A180 AMG line type cars are nothing other than kits and wheels but that’s just Mercedes making money out of the name in the same way BMW do with MSport.I think Sunday must bring out the Pedants .
Alpina are involved with the cars development from the outset. They make as many changes as they want and this sometimes includes a completely different engine or gearbox to the stock car and always different suspension and lots of other bits. They are built to a certain point on a BMW line and then taken away to be finished. The product is far beyond a stick on a few bits shed operation like Paramount. Anyway this is not what this thread is about. Yes paramount for tuning for Jaguars
Edited by craigjm on Sunday 6th June 17:34
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