radicals tyre choice in wet weather
Discussion
doing another track day at blyton park this saturday but the forecast is pretty bad and its my first time out in the wet. heavy rain at times and light rain/cloud most of the day!
i have 3 sets of wheels tyres to choose from
2 x 205-575 rears and 2 x 160 535 dunlop radials
2 x 170-575 rears and 2 x 160-535 dunlop radials
1 x full set of rims on dunlop wets
if its damp and no standing water what combo would you go for? and how wet does it need to be before full wets are needed?
how are the dunlops in damp conditions? thanks.
i have 3 sets of wheels tyres to choose from
2 x 205-575 rears and 2 x 160 535 dunlop radials
2 x 170-575 rears and 2 x 160-535 dunlop radials
1 x full set of rims on dunlop wets
if its damp and no standing water what combo would you go for? and how wet does it need to be before full wets are needed?
how are the dunlops in damp conditions? thanks.
It might be that hot Dunlop slicks deal with some water ok. Cold slicks struggle to deal with completely dry tarmac let alone damp or wet conditions. So if in any damp doubt, use up those dunlop wets. They work well in wet and drying conditions.
As Fluxy said to some bloke at Donington...what the f
k are you doing Ridgway? You risked smacking your car into something hard for the sake of a set of wets.
BB
As Fluxy said to some bloke at Donington...what the f
k are you doing Ridgway? You risked smacking your car into something hard for the sake of a set of wets.BB
I only use wets when there's standing water. Damp = slicks.
The most important thing I discovered about driving in the wet is that you should probably invest in some waterproofs. I don't know what your car is like, but on mine, the water hits the underside of the clam and falls straight into my lap. I discovered this at the first right-hander I tackled in the wet. It was Anglesey, so the track was like glass it was so wet. I nearly went off the track with shock - it was like being dumped in the sea ... but I didn't see it coming.
The most important thing I discovered about driving in the wet is that you should probably invest in some waterproofs. I don't know what your car is like, but on mine, the water hits the underside of the clam and falls straight into my lap. I discovered this at the first right-hander I tackled in the wet. It was Anglesey, so the track was like glass it was so wet. I nearly went off the track with shock - it was like being dumped in the sea ... but I didn't see it coming.
i only ever bolt wets on if its proper standing water..... or raining properly..
slicks are fine in the damp, its standing water that can provide some interesting moments if you find yourself on slicks.
IF you have fairly old wets that are probably past their best though... and you are just doing a track day - and learning the car, bolting on the wets may be the best approach.. but if they are decent/fresh wets, I'd not be taking them out unless it was proper wet, or you'll end up destroying the wets.. and the car will be nervous on overheating wets anyway.
slicks are fine in the damp, its standing water that can provide some interesting moments if you find yourself on slicks.
IF you have fairly old wets that are probably past their best though... and you are just doing a track day - and learning the car, bolting on the wets may be the best approach.. but if they are decent/fresh wets, I'd not be taking them out unless it was proper wet, or you'll end up destroying the wets.. and the car will be nervous on overheating wets anyway.
Andy probably uses soft compound slicks for sprints/hillclimbs, in which case yes.
However with circuit tyres less of a yes depending on dampness, temperature and experience!
As a newbie I would err on the side of the wets even for damp use, once you have got more used to the car and what it feels like then experiment in different conditions.
Likewise on wet weather settings, many disconnect the front and rear roll bars for the wet, I personally hate it set up like that, what I did used to do with the AVO dampers is back them off a bit from the dry settings but leave the roll bars on. Again I did try the dampers backed right off and again I hated it set up like that. At the end of the day it is what you are comfortable driving it with that counts and that comes with experience.
However with circuit tyres less of a yes depending on dampness, temperature and experience!
As a newbie I would err on the side of the wets even for damp use, once you have got more used to the car and what it feels like then experiment in different conditions.
Likewise on wet weather settings, many disconnect the front and rear roll bars for the wet, I personally hate it set up like that, what I did used to do with the AVO dampers is back them off a bit from the dry settings but leave the roll bars on. Again I did try the dampers backed right off and again I hated it set up like that. At the end of the day it is what you are comfortable driving it with that counts and that comes with experience.
There's a lot of variants between fully wet and fully dry. It's completely useless trying to get cold slicks to work in the wet (and that's wet with spray coming up, doesn't need standing water). So if your only choice is super-duper new wets versus an undriveable car in the wet on slicks, stay in the garage.
And yes, I've been out on slicks on a drying track with a dry line appearing and it worked out ok. But for me, if in doubt, wets are the way.
Bert
And yes, I've been out on slicks on a drying track with a dry line appearing and it worked out ok. But for me, if in doubt, wets are the way.
Bert
well today did not go well at all! it was tipping down all day,water everywhere. i went out on the dunlop wets with dry weather settings and couldn't get power down at all and couldn't keep it on the track. if i pushed too hard i either under-steered and went wide or lightning quick oversteer causing it to spin and end up facing backwards on the grass on the inside of the circuit.
visibility was apauling,legs drenched in the footwell (need to sort out where waters getting in) and we all packed up an came home just after lunch.
it really was like driving around on ice,and i just nursed it round which made me frustrated when fwd hot hatches were getting more grip!
im not confident enough in altering the settings in case i cant find the sweet spot again(which was incredible in the dry last time out)
is there anything i can easily do to help in wet conditions. as the car felt like it was just aqua-planing even at very low speeds? thanks everyone
visibility was apauling,legs drenched in the footwell (need to sort out where waters getting in) and we all packed up an came home just after lunch.
it really was like driving around on ice,and i just nursed it round which made me frustrated when fwd hot hatches were getting more grip!
im not confident enough in altering the settings in case i cant find the sweet spot again(which was incredible in the dry last time out)
is there anything i can easily do to help in wet conditions. as the car felt like it was just aqua-planing even at very low speeds? thanks everyone
mnrvortxf20c said:
is there anything i can easily do to help in wet conditions. as the car felt like it was just aqua-planing even at very low speeds? thanks everyone
Buy new wets! , old wets are worse than usless. They need to be as soft as you can get away with as the wet conditions stop the tyres generating any heat.Brand new soper soft wets like we use in hillclimbs give an amazing amount of grip when it is fully wet, but even these are crap in only damp conditions and prefer the slicks. Once they get even a couple of years old the grip falls away.
i wonder if it was the older wets causing the issue? it was bad enough on the sighting laps! but once i pressed on a bit it was dangerous.
i was going to try softening the dampers a bit or removing an anti roll bar but i was that wet and cheesed off,i decided to pack up,dry myself off and come home!
i was going to try softening the dampers a bit or removing an anti roll bar but i was that wet and cheesed off,i decided to pack up,dry myself off and come home!
do i just need to remove the rear ARB? or does the front need removing also?
and do the shocks need to be the same front/rear? (both at half way) or does one need to be stiffer than the other?
one thing i was really pleased with was the braking performance.(which made me think the tyres may be ok) i could easily outbrake everything and never locked a wheel under braking all day! thanks again
and do the shocks need to be the same front/rear? (both at half way) or does one need to be stiffer than the other?
one thing i was really pleased with was the braking performance.(which made me think the tyres may be ok) i could easily outbrake everything and never locked a wheel under braking all day! thanks again
I take it you had the tyres the right way round?
Wet set up is really down to your own preference and will only be achieved by driving it and playing with the settings. Oh and it will also probably teach you to be really gentle with the controls too and to get a feel for what the car is doing.
Wet set up is really down to your own preference and will only be achieved by driving it and playing with the settings. Oh and it will also probably teach you to be really gentle with the controls too and to get a feel for what the car is doing.
mnrvortxf20c said:
do i just need to remove the rear ARB? or does the front need removing also?
and do the shocks need to be the same front/rear? (both at half way) or does one need to be stiffer than the other?
I'd start with keeping the front bar on. But don't be afraid to experiment. Same with shocks, my suggestions were a place that should be different without being horrid! From my experience that snappy understeer to oversteer is classic with a stiff setup. If you soften the back off to give more grip at the back you should stop the snappy-ness. If you end up with an understeering pig, then you know you've generated too much grip at the rear!!and do the shocks need to be the same front/rear? (both at half way) or does one need to be stiffer than the other?
Bert
thanks mate. im gonna have to find setup guides somewhere as continuous changes in track conditions are making this car behave so differently and im not used to a car which requires so much 'fine tuning'.
in the dry warmish weather the car was stunning on this setup but in the wet it was lethal. now its getting cold i imagine setup will need adjusting again. cheers
in the dry warmish weather the car was stunning on this setup but in the wet it was lethal. now its getting cold i imagine setup will need adjusting again. cheers
Don't lose faith Dan...
Wet - Dunlop wets (as new as possible), roll bars disconnected, shocks wound out to soft and as much downforce as you can i.e.: rear wing, dive planes etc. You will be amazed at the amount of grip available!
To be honest the car would still run okay with these settings on slicks but re-fit roll bars, start to stiffen shocks and reduce downforce until you lose confidence.
Wet - Dunlop wets (as new as possible), roll bars disconnected, shocks wound out to soft and as much downforce as you can i.e.: rear wing, dive planes etc. You will be amazed at the amount of grip available!
To be honest the car would still run okay with these settings on slicks but re-fit roll bars, start to stiffen shocks and reduce downforce until you lose confidence.
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