Clubsport wider wheels

[radical27]

Having owned my early clubbie (chassis 27)for 10 years now i want to look at the possibility of using wider wheels. Mine is fitted with 6" fronts and 8" rears. Can i just move the 8" rears to the front and purchase some 10" rears like the Prosport has?
If so does anyone have any 10" for sale with 4 bolt holes? Thanks in advance.

[splitpin]

radical27 said:

Having owned my early clubbie (chassis 27)for 10 years now i want to look at the possibility of using wider wheels. Mine is fitted with 6" fronts and 8" rears. Can i just move the 8" rears to the front and purchase some 10" rears like the Prosport has?
If so does anyone have any 10" for sale with 4 bolt holes? Thanks in advance.

Don't know the offset particulars of the original 6s and 8s (and there is nothing to say they would have stayed the same from Day One to when Radical went to 7s & 9s), but general knowledge of the difference between front and rear offsets on 13" wheeled Rads generally suggests they will be too far out by too much i.e. sticking consideraby too far out, causing all sorts of bodywork fouling (and likely catastrophic handling).

But as you can easily check by measuring and calculating or even easier, actually doing the swap static and marking and measuring, that's the 'know for sure' thing to do.

[BertBert]

Just being nosey, why have you settled on 8s and 10s? Sounds like a big jump up.
BErt

[splitpin]

BertBert said:

Just being nosey, why have you settled on 8s and 10s? Sounds like a big jump up.
BErt

I'm guessing it's maybe because Keith is hoping he might be halfway there?

And who knows, maybe it's got a 1610 motor?

And as likely is used in Cyprus, therefore hillclimbing/sprints? Therefore initial grip/rapid warm-up really important, therefore size availability of relevant compounds of Avons???????

Seriously though, I agree; if it were roundy-roundy and a Clubbie that was simply original or mildly Prosportised, I'd move to 7 & 9s.

Edited by splitpin on Sunday 16th June 12:00

[radical27]

Already i am enlightened as to what Radical upgraded too, I only came to the conclusion that it was 8" and 10" as the only reference i have to draw on is a friends Prosport. There are only 6 Radicals here in Cyprus, mine being the first, followed by a friend with 2 Prosports, then an SR4 followed by 2 Sr3s. As my Clubbie is the baby i thought i would start with the wheel size. I am currently running 190x535s on the front and truthfully they are a little too wide for the wheel, The rears have 200x540s and could do with being a bit wider. Unfortunately i know that the rear wheel with this tyre will not fit the front but would with a lower profile. So i am back to the drawing board and now ask what would be the better option to widen the rubber, given that i have to source them on a budget.
I only wish of a 1610 engine but if anyone has one lying around for the cost of a pint i would be happy to collect it pronto!!

[splitpin]

(My edit and your post) ........ We Crossed!

Just going out, will pick up on this later ........ as you say, you are definitely 'over-tyred' on the front; given the sizes, are those Michelins on the back?

[SportsLibre]

radical27 said:

Having owned my early clubbie (chassis 27)for 10 years now i want to look at the possibility of using wider wheels. Mine is fitted with 6" fronts and 8" rears. Can i just move the 8" rears to the front and purchase some 10" rears like the Prosport has?
If so does anyone have any 10" for sale with 4 bolt holes? Thanks in advance.

I run my early (No8) exclusively in Hills and Sprints. I do run the original 8" alleycat rears on the front. However with the offset they stick outside the bodywork (a little) so have attached little arches "spats". On full lock i.e pushing round the paddock rather than actual driving they do just touch the wishbone but this has not caused a problem for the last 7 years.
The big issue was the tyres fouling on the sidepods due to the increased arc of the wider wheel. To solve this we slightly reduced the length of the sidepods, this may not have been a problem had I changed at the time to the lower profile Avons (7.2x20 crossplys)that I have used for many years.
Actually I use these as the spare wheels as the alleycats are not great wheels, heavy and some are particularly bad at holding air.

For my main wheels I bought a set of old revolutions from a racing ford Anglia, like the fronts these stick a bit out from the bodywork again covered by spats and as the offset is not ideal I use a small spacer to stop fouling on the inside.

I don't expect you to follow my route which was basically use what youve got and spent as little as possible. If you can measure the prosport wheels offset etc. the best way would be to order a set of split rims to fit exactly and be much lighter.

http://www.ianhardy.net/gallery/main.php/d/76468-2...

http://www.ianhardy.net/gallery/main.php/d/103642-...

Edited by SportsLibre on Sunday 16th June 13:38

[splitpin]

Angus, with a free rein (i.e. making do and mend less) and with the original engine, what are your thoughts on ideal widths front and rear?

[radical27]

My fronts are Dunlops and the rears are Michelins. I have measured the Pcd and it is 108, As for the offset i am unsure. The engine is standard and the body has been fitted with a Prosport rear wing and has a rear undertray.
As Cyprus manufactures nothing any spares or upgrades can only come via these pages or E*** so all advice is appreciated as is any pointers of where to obtain wider wheels.

[SportsLibre]

I think the 8" and 10" wheels with the slightly smaller 7 and 9 approx tyres is the way to go, this is of course the conventional fitting for crossply tyres being slightly less than the wheel width. I don't know about the Radials but perhaps they like being nearer the wheel size? Of course with the early clubsport there is not enough adjustment to get enough camber for the Radials, my rears screwed right in and it gives barely negative camber.

Given that the body completely covers the wheels so the aero is not an issue like on single seaters it would appear obvious to go for the max. Certainly I found wider fronts stopped my car from "eating" its front tyres and reduced the understeer. As the Hills and Sprints can won or lost on the standing start, the wider rears are also a must. Coming up for a re-run with warm tyres can make a noticeable difference to the launch.

I would think that a good quality set of split rims or just wheels the correct offset should be able to fit. Although over the years the budget probably was there to upgrade the wheels I never felt the need and spent it on doing more events and enjoying the car.

Of course LCM will no doubt be along with his take on the subject

[SportsLibre]

The PCD is standard Ford, getting the perfect offset is less easy, that is why I just bought them and used a small spacer on the rear and covered up the sticky out tyre (make do and mend).

[radical27]

I have managed to get 2mm neg camber on the front and a max of 1.5 on the rear. Assuming i can source some 10" wheels i will still have to source the tyres ( secondhand of course ) as my budget does not run to £1000 a set.
I currently use a 14 front sprocket and a 48 rear as with the 15 front i was not getting out of 4th gear. If anyone has some wheels lying around, please get in touch.

[andylaurence]

radical27 said:

I have managed to get 2mm neg camber on the front and a max of 1.5 on the rear. Assuming i can source some 10" wheels i will still have to source the tyres ( secondhand of course ) as my budget does not run to £1000 a set.

If you don't have the budget for a new set of tyres, don't buy new wheels. Save the money you'd spend on new wheels and put it towards a decent set of tyres. You'll gain far more time from a new set of tyres than you will from adding a couple of inches width with a set of ditch-finders.

[radical27]

andylaurence said:

If you don't have the budget for a new set of tyres, don't buy new wheels. Save the money you'd spend on new wheels and put it towards a decent set of tyres. You'll gain far more time from a new set of tyres than you will from adding a couple of inches width with a set of ditch-finders.

Thanks for the advice Andy, I am sure that i am not the only one to run on secondhand tyres and of course if i did buy new they would be as good as secondhand after i had used them once or twice. The point is that the driver and the car would benefit from wider rubber as the only track here is very twisty and understeer and grip is a problem to name but a few reasons.
As my current tyres need replacing i thought it a good opportunity to replace the wheels and tyres at the same time.

[andylaurence]

radical27 said:

Thanks for the advice Andy, I am sure that i am not the only one to run on secondhand tyres and of course if i did buy new they would be as good as secondhand after i had used them once or twice. The point is that the driver and the car would benefit from wider rubber as the only track here is very twisty and understeer and grip is a problem to name but a few reasons.
As my current tyres need replacing i thought it a good opportunity to replace the wheels and tyres at the same time.

I suppose it depends how secondhand you're buying. If you're buying tyres a few months old after a couple of runs up the hill, then it's a different proposition to buying tyres a couple of seasons old.

[Steve57]

Protyre sold me some once used michelins for a VERY reasonable price, im just a track dayer tho.

When i have a spare few moments i will run through my findings on 8"/10" on a clubbie.

[Martin B]

I run the prosport size wheels on my clubbie, 7.5" front and 10" rears and were a reasonable step forward over the 6s and 8s. I did find that the Dunlop 190s moved around a lot on the 7.5" fronts, I actually gained grip by going down to 175s which are the optimum Dunlop tyre size for the 7.5s and are much more stable on the rims. The optimum size for the 190s are 8" rims with the optimum size for the 10" rims being 230 which is what are normally fitted to the prosports.

Don't try to cram as big a tyre onto the rim as possible as they will move around a lot and probably end up with less cornering grip. Just my experience/thoughts though.

[SportsLibre]

Martin B said:

I run the prosport size wheels on my clubbie, 7.5" front and 10" rears and were a reasonable step forward over the 6s and 8s. I did find that the Dunlop 190s moved around a lot on the 7.5" fronts, I actually gained grip by going down to 175s which are the optimum Dunlop tyre size for the 7.5s and are much more stable on the rims. The optimum size for the 190s are 8" rims with the optimum size for the 10" rims being 230 which is what are normally fitted to the prosports.

Don't try to cram as big a tyre onto the rim as possible as they will move around a lot and probably end up with less cornering grip. Just my experience/thoughts though.

Sounds like a good sized set up, of course for the hills, there is no real substitute for the soft Avons.

[radical27]

Sounds good to me Martin, am now looking in the classifieds. Thank you to all who contributed to my posts.

[viperu]

I have 195 on fronts and 250 on rears on Casper the clubbie, and I found some used image wheel sets in Italy.