may have found a radical. advice needed please

[mnrvortxf20c]

following on from my thread regarding hillclimbing a radical,the general thoughts were a zzr 1100 clubsport with my low budget of under £10k. but preferably prosport which are slightly more expensive!
i have since found on pistonheads classifieds a yellow sr3 tracksport with powertec 1300cc busa power. and its on budget. anyone have any thoughts on these? as i could potentially use it on road also and enter road going classes?
how much heavier are they than the club/pro sports? and are there any real dis-advantages of the sr3 tracksport?
all help appreciated and if anyone knows the yellow car in question, please give as much un-biased info as possibe. cheers

[LCM]

mnrvortxf20c said:

following on from my thread regarding hillclimbing a radical,the general thoughts were a zzr 1100 clubsport with my low budget of under £10k. but preferably prosport which are slightly more expensive!
i have since found on pistonheads classifieds a yellow sr3 tracksport with powertec 1300cc busa power. and its on budget. anyone have any thoughts on these? as i could potentially use it on road also and enter road going classes?
how much heavier are they than the club/pro sports? and are there any real dis-advantages of the sr3 tracksport?
all help appreciated and if anyone knows the yellow car in question, please give as much un-biased info as possibe. cheers

Oh dear!

If you read the Blue Book it will become clear that an SR3 is not eligible for any Production or Specialist Production category (whether roadgoing or modified).

It could only be eligible for Sports Libre.

Have a look at the recent threads on here about Radicals and hillclimbing to find out what the sensible options are.

But, in summary, an SR3 is too big and too heavy even with a 1500 engine to be effective and will never go fast enough to exploit its high speed aero characteristics. A 1300 SR3 would make you consider sticking pins in your eyes as a less painful alternative.

Hillclimb cars need to be small, light and nimble with a high power to weight ratio and amazing brakes............. Not an SR3 (unless of course you a sub masochist. It doesn't matter how cheap it is or what a nice colour. If it isn't based on a Clubsport, Prosport or PR6 it will only embarass you and make you unhappy.

Sorry!

[splitpin]

As above, but remove the hill-climbing/sprinting bit and as a starter for ten for roundy-roundy things like trackdays and it comes across well to me .............. particularly one owner from new and price, especially as road reg.

If it's a good 'un that could give you a superb and real economic intro to Radicals / aero cars i.e. given road reg, not far off glacial depreciation over one/two/three years.

I don't think I know the car, but if it's a good as it reads, I think it'll be sold very quickly indeed.

[mnrvortxf20c]

like i said. ideally it would spend a lot of its time on the road, with a few trackdays as well. but the occasional local sprint/hillclimb.
are the sr3's brakes not up to the standards of the clubsports? or is it just extra weight?

[radical78]

sr3 brakes are better than clubsport. yellow car looks cheep to me. it will probably weigh about 700k and 200 bhp what did your old car weigh?

[mnrvortxf20c]

my current car is a 420kg 919cc fireblade powered rgb racing fisher fury. 128bhp but goof fun and lots of revs!

[BertBert]

Looks like it could be good. And before I get in trouble again for being Mr Neg, make sure you buy on condition. Make sure you know the hours of the important lifed components esp engine and box with some actual evidence. "Not much" usually means the opposite in my experience.

As others have said it'll be hard to find a place where it will be competitive, but could make a cracking track day and mad road fun toy!

Bert

[mnrvortxf20c]

thanks bert! id imagine it would be quite good on track! and nice looking too

[LCM]

mnrvortxf20c said:

like i said. ideally it would spend a lot of its time on the road, with a few trackdays as well. but the occasional local sprint/hillclimb.
are the sr3's brakes not up to the standards of the clubsports? or is it just extra weight?

If there's no hidden snares, then at that price it would be a steal for road/trackday use. Just remember to add into your calculations an early engine re-build as the last one seems to be 9 years (and unknown running hours) ago.

BUT it still will not be eligible for Production or Specialist Production categories in speed events and to use it to sprint/hillclimb it will need to comply with Sports Libre Regs (S14). It will for instance need a 6 point harness for the driver and, as discussed elsewhere on here, the rear wing would need to be lowered as it is too high (980mm vs Blue Book limit of 900mm) in standard configuration. This would then raise the question as to whether it still complies with its SVA spec for road use - Catch 22! I stress that this isn't me being awkward: it's the Regs. I'd hate you to go to all the time, trouble and expense of going to a hillclimb and being sent home as your car doesn't comply with the Regs!

As to the brakes, Wilwood calipers tend to be the limiting factor. You should find them totally satisfactory for trackdays and road use but under the extremes of sprinting/hillclimbing I have found that they flex, with the result that the harder you press on the pedal the less retardation you get! Plus the sheer mass of an SR3 means that for the same brake spec you've got 50% more mass than a Clubsport to slow down. On the other hand, the Radical/HiSpec "Big Brakes" (large floating rotors and stiff calipers) are superb, especially with PF01 pads.

Now to PWR. An SR3 with 200 crankshaft hp and (charitably) 700kg mass has a PWR of 286 bhp/tonne. My hillclimb car has 800bhp/tonne and is now up against bike engined cars in the same class with 1050+ bhp/tonne Pins? Eyeballs?

[BertBert]

I wonder how it would fare in a round of the Clubman's cup? It's obviously not going to be anywhere near the front, but there's quite a range of lap times so you might get a race towards the rear if you can wring its neck!
Bert

[andylaurence]

LCM said:

If you read the Blue Book it will become clear that an SR3 is not eligible for any Production or Specialist Production category (whether roadgoing or modified).

It could only be eligible for Sports Libre.

Check out class 12 (roadgoing class).

As for being outclassed, I've only come up against one SR3 and it's beaten me every time. I think it's the only car/driver combo ever to beat me each time we meet. Admittedly, it's a very well driven 1500 and I've only got a poxy 999cc engine, but the weight difference balances it out. If you stick to sprints, it'll hold its own, but I'd wager it'll be the opposite on the hills. The cars on the hills tend to be lighter with better downforce and there's some potent machinery you don't see on sprints (Force LM, for example).

[mnrvortxf20c]

thanks. i regularly go to watch the hillclimbs up north. barbon and harewood usually, but would only be interested in clubmans events with friends and not serious competition!
one day,if i ever have unlimited funds i might be able to get into it a bit more serious as it requires mega bucks! but until then ill stick to what i can afford.and unfortunately its a sub £10k car which ideally needs to be road legal too.
out of interest (as i have a non race msa license and blue book) which regulation states oit cant be used in a road going specialist class? cheers everyone

[SportsLibre]

No road going Radicals have ever been sold in the quantities to comply with the MSA category definitions of production or specialist production.

[LCM]

SportsLibre said:

No road going Radicals have ever been sold in the quantities to comply with the MSA category definitions of production or specialist production.

Yep!

And just because one organiser may have got it wrong it doesn't make it right.

[mnrvortxf20c]

i thought it was 20 cars in the modified specialist prod cars class? surely radical made more than 20 in a 12 month period!

[gixermark]

That's a good deal for a road legal radical...

IF you are more into fun... Track days, bit of the odd blast on a Sunday for a coffee, and maybe the occasional sprint for 'fun' then I can't see you doing better for 10K period

It's a std busa... So handy to replace worst case, or freshen up/rebuild at that price is not a big deal.

With it being the original 1 owner, it likely to be well cared for... As they'll have paid significant wedge for that, and likely to have looked after it.

Good luck with the search... But to me, that's bargain territory

[mnrvortxf20c]

thats what i thought. cant believe people slamming it really! cheers pal

[BertBert]

mnrvortxf20c said:

thats what i thought. cant believe people slamming it really! cheers pal

Not sure they are slamming it really. I wasn't. But I just have experience of buying a Rad on a budget. It was good but was completely knackered. That not only made me spend more money than I expected, I had a couple of nasty moments at Oulton when two front uprights broke (not at the same time) which could have had very nasty endings plus it was always going wrong at track days. Little things, but couldn't easily be fixed on the day so ultimately ended up being frustrating.

And then I went racing

Bert

[BertBert]

And forgot to say, what are you waiting for? Have you been to see it yet? Full report required!

[mnrvortxf20c]

not yet bert. been on track day at croft today wher i had a few issues with my own cars charging system! i was a bit errattic at times but enjoyed it.
the circuit was a bit fast for a car like mine 128 bhp 900cc fireblade kit car and more powerful cars were flying by on the long straights. nissan gtr's, porsches and the like