Radical vs Caterham for Road and Track use?
Discussion
Hi Everyone
I owned a Caterham a few years ago which I thoroughly enjoyed. It was during that time I discovered Radicals and was always fascinated with them.
Anyway the Caterham ended up going due to a new business venture but things have gone alright and I am now looking for a new toy so to speak. My initial reaction was to get another Caterham however I've started looking at some Radicals.
My budget dictates that it will almost certainly be an SR3.
My primary use for it will be some blatting in the peak district and track days which the Caterham was perfect for. I'm not into touring or long drives, I like a quick blast where I scare myself a bit and then stick it back in the garage until next time. Obviously a track day is a full day but you hopefully catch my drift.
Does anyone have any experience using a Radical in this way? Are they a bit too focused and hardcore for this? Any insight would be much appreciated.
I owned a Caterham a few years ago which I thoroughly enjoyed. It was during that time I discovered Radicals and was always fascinated with them.
Anyway the Caterham ended up going due to a new business venture but things have gone alright and I am now looking for a new toy so to speak. My initial reaction was to get another Caterham however I've started looking at some Radicals.
My budget dictates that it will almost certainly be an SR3.
My primary use for it will be some blatting in the peak district and track days which the Caterham was perfect for. I'm not into touring or long drives, I like a quick blast where I scare myself a bit and then stick it back in the garage until next time. Obviously a track day is a full day but you hopefully catch my drift.
Does anyone have any experience using a Radical in this way? Are they a bit too focused and hardcore for this? Any insight would be much appreciated.
Hi,
I've got a road legal SR3 and love it, doing about 2000 miles a year.
I have friends with Caterhams and Westfields of all varieties and having driven a few there is little compromise in terms of ride on the road. My car is on "road" coil-overs so is softer than the race cars and obviously runs at over twice the ride height so can do speed bumps too. Suspension geometry is fully adjustable in every way so you can make it do what you want.
If you are comparing an SR3 to a BEC with aeroscreen then I would say just decide if you want mid engined or front, there is no difference in practicality apart from no boot, but I can fit enough stuff for a four day golfing trip with my mates in the passenger seat. The drawback is no windscreen or roof. Friends have those half hoods from Soft Bits for 7's and they are handy. In terms of handling on the road, both types of car have more than enough. What surprised me though is how forgiving the Radical is and how much it's possible to play with the balance on the throttle. No where near as much as a 7 but fun in a different way. The two cars cars are on different planets aerodynamically which is very noticeable on track and adds a whole new dimension which needs learning and I love that.
It has a reverse gear not an electric motor too which helps.
I don't know what your budget is but the SR3 SL would be worth a look. It has a car engine not a hyabusa's so that will change the character a bit, still a sequential box though. I'm sure Radical would let you drive it so you would see what one is like on the road. Finding a road legal car that isn't an SL might be the biggest problem. I'm told they didn't make many and converting a race car is prohibitively expensive so you just have to be lucky. That also doesn't leave much room for negotiation on price. Mine was in pretty good nick but it had issues when I bought it that I found out about afterwards (I very much doubt the seller knew though) so do your research on these pages first.
Mine is a 1300 so much less stress on all the components with 70 less bhp than the race cars and probably more practical for what I use it for, though more power is tempting and will happen one day. I haven't had to do much and the only tow I needed was from running out of fuel..... The low fuel light is rubbish I discovered (the first time I drove it!) and there is no fuel gauge.
All in all I wouldn't swap mine for anything. Probably requires more determination to use regularly than a Caterham but for me the car more than makes up for it. It's nice to have something different too.
Good luck
I've got a road legal SR3 and love it, doing about 2000 miles a year.
I have friends with Caterhams and Westfields of all varieties and having driven a few there is little compromise in terms of ride on the road. My car is on "road" coil-overs so is softer than the race cars and obviously runs at over twice the ride height so can do speed bumps too. Suspension geometry is fully adjustable in every way so you can make it do what you want.
If you are comparing an SR3 to a BEC with aeroscreen then I would say just decide if you want mid engined or front, there is no difference in practicality apart from no boot, but I can fit enough stuff for a four day golfing trip with my mates in the passenger seat. The drawback is no windscreen or roof. Friends have those half hoods from Soft Bits for 7's and they are handy. In terms of handling on the road, both types of car have more than enough. What surprised me though is how forgiving the Radical is and how much it's possible to play with the balance on the throttle. No where near as much as a 7 but fun in a different way. The two cars cars are on different planets aerodynamically which is very noticeable on track and adds a whole new dimension which needs learning and I love that.
It has a reverse gear not an electric motor too which helps.
I don't know what your budget is but the SR3 SL would be worth a look. It has a car engine not a hyabusa's so that will change the character a bit, still a sequential box though. I'm sure Radical would let you drive it so you would see what one is like on the road. Finding a road legal car that isn't an SL might be the biggest problem. I'm told they didn't make many and converting a race car is prohibitively expensive so you just have to be lucky. That also doesn't leave much room for negotiation on price. Mine was in pretty good nick but it had issues when I bought it that I found out about afterwards (I very much doubt the seller knew though) so do your research on these pages first.
Mine is a 1300 so much less stress on all the components with 70 less bhp than the race cars and probably more practical for what I use it for, though more power is tempting and will happen one day. I haven't had to do much and the only tow I needed was from running out of fuel..... The low fuel light is rubbish I discovered (the first time I drove it!) and there is no fuel gauge.
All in all I wouldn't swap mine for anything. Probably requires more determination to use regularly than a Caterham but for me the car more than makes up for it. It's nice to have something different too.
Good luck
Edited by Coldaswell on Tuesday 28th August 10:11
Hi mate
I've had 3 Caterhams which I've raced and used on the road and had fun in them all except my last, a CSR which was rubbish!
I now have a sr3sl. Basically I use it for trackdays. I tend to drive to uk tracks and trailer it to SPa and the Ring.
It is brilliant !
Basically it's the next generation Caterham IMHO, it does everything better and is seriously quick. I put slicks on it and it's a different league.
In addition, the service from Radical is exceptional.
If you want to have some serious fun, look no further .
SL is more expensive than a road legal RS it's a wee bit heavier but the extra power makes its a bit quicker in my experience.
Basically, the only thing that ever overtakes you at trackdays a the V8 radicals and there is not much in that really either.
I've had 3 Caterhams which I've raced and used on the road and had fun in them all except my last, a CSR which was rubbish!
I now have a sr3sl. Basically I use it for trackdays. I tend to drive to uk tracks and trailer it to SPa and the Ring.
It is brilliant !
Basically it's the next generation Caterham IMHO, it does everything better and is seriously quick. I put slicks on it and it's a different league.
In addition, the service from Radical is exceptional.
If you want to have some serious fun, look no further .
SL is more expensive than a road legal RS it's a wee bit heavier but the extra power makes its a bit quicker in my experience.
Basically, the only thing that ever overtakes you at trackdays a the V8 radicals and there is not much in that really either.
Good Posts Guys. (More like 50rwhp Steve and that's on a very good day)
Suggest the OP does a PH Search as the topic has appeared a number of times before; basically, it's a Marmite thing; you either get it/like it or you don't: I think it's fair to roughly summarise as Racers usually don't, but Mere Mortal but hardish-core road drivers usually do. If you do like it and providing you've got the wedge, it almost certainly doesn't get any better than an SL ....... and I think Radical will make you a screen. If the budget rules that out an RR BE will do just fine, but as Steve says, they are hard to find.
Rain? As any Biker will tell you, bugger it, who cares, all part of the overall fun ....... in the event of a monsoon, park up, have a coffee, have a smoke, have a Mac, have a laugh. Brilliant.
Suggest the OP does a PH Search as the topic has appeared a number of times before; basically, it's a Marmite thing; you either get it/like it or you don't: I think it's fair to roughly summarise as Racers usually don't, but Mere Mortal but hardish-core road drivers usually do. If you do like it and providing you've got the wedge, it almost certainly doesn't get any better than an SL ....... and I think Radical will make you a screen. If the budget rules that out an RR BE will do just fine, but as Steve says, they are hard to find.
Rain? As any Biker will tell you, bugger it, who cares, all part of the overall fun ....... in the event of a monsoon, park up, have a coffee, have a smoke, have a Mac, have a laugh. Brilliant.
I have had a couple of road caterhams , than a Radical SR4 (track) now back to a Caterham R300(track)
Thoughts are
Radical
Aero is awesome , so is sequential box
BUT
felt fragile , like a purpose built race car
maintenance is by race hours
it takes 2 to take off the rear clamshel to adjust the chain , so you need support with you for every track outing (or a good side line in grabbing the nearest bod to help)
ground clearance can be an issue , even just getting it on the trailer
Caterham
feels bomb proof
lots of slidey fun , both on raod and track (the radical is all about precision)
pop away for a quick evening track day , with just your lid in the passanger seat
thrash it , and just worry about running out of fuel
BUT
Aero of a house brick (it does make the racing exciting)
in engineering terms it isn't what you would call advanced , but it has been honed over the years , and I would say there isn't much wrong with it
in summary and imho
the Radical is a modern race car that you can make road legal
the Caterham is a road car , honed over time , that happens to make an exceptional race car
Thoughts are
Radical
Aero is awesome , so is sequential box
BUT
felt fragile , like a purpose built race car
maintenance is by race hours
it takes 2 to take off the rear clamshel to adjust the chain , so you need support with you for every track outing (or a good side line in grabbing the nearest bod to help)
ground clearance can be an issue , even just getting it on the trailer
Caterham
feels bomb proof
lots of slidey fun , both on raod and track (the radical is all about precision)
pop away for a quick evening track day , with just your lid in the passanger seat
thrash it , and just worry about running out of fuel
BUT
Aero of a house brick (it does make the racing exciting)
in engineering terms it isn't what you would call advanced , but it has been honed over the years , and I would say there isn't much wrong with it
in summary and imho
the Radical is a modern race car that you can make road legal
the Caterham is a road car , honed over time , that happens to make an exceptional race car
Coldaswell said:
Hi,
I've got a road legal SR3 and love it, doing about 2000 miles a year.
I have friends with Caterhams and Westfields of all varieties and having driven a few there is little compromise in terms of ride on the road. My car is on "road" coil-overs so is softer than the race cars and obviously runs at over twice the ride height so can do speed bumps too. Suspension geometry is fully adjustable in every way so you can make it do what you want.
If you are comparing an SR3 to a BEC with aeroscreen then I would say just decide if you want mid engined or front, there is no difference in practicality apart from no boot, but I can fit enough stuff for a four day golfing trip with my mates in the passenger seat. The drawback is no windscreen or roof. Friends have those half hoods from Soft Bits for 7's and they are handy. In terms of handling on the road, both types of car have more than enough. What surprised me though is how forgiving the Radical is and how much it's possible to play with the balance on the throttle. No where near as much as a 7 but fun in a different way. The two cars cars are on different planets aerodynamically which is very noticeable on track and adds a whole new dimension which needs learning and I love that.
It has a reverse gear not an electric motor too which helps.
I don't know what your budget is but the SR3 SL would be worth a look. It has a car engine not a hyabusa's so that will change the character a bit, still a sequential box though. I'm sure Radical would let you drive it so you would see what one is like on the road. Finding a road legal car that isn't an SL might be the biggest problem. I'm told they didn't make many and converting a race car is prohibitively expensive so you just have to be lucky. That also doesn't leave much room for negotiation on price. Mine was in pretty good nick but it had issues when I bought it that I found out about afterwards (I very much doubt the seller knew though) so do your research on these pages first.
Mine is a 1300 so much less stress on all the components with 70 less bhp than the race cars and probably more practical for what I use it for, though more power is tempting and will happen one day. I haven't had to do much and the only tow I needed was from running out of fuel..... The low fuel light is rubbish I discovered (the first time I drove it!) and there is no fuel gauge.
All in all I wouldn't swap mine for anything. Probably requires more determination to use regularly than a Caterham but for me the car more than makes up for it. It's nice to have something different too.
Good luck
Thanks Coldaswell, that's helpful! Taking it on a golf trip sounds like something I would end up doing, sounds brilliant! Was that with some Caterham friends or just random? Luckily the Caterham guys who I used to meet on a Sunday morning have said that I would be welcome to tag along in a Radical.I've got a road legal SR3 and love it, doing about 2000 miles a year.
I have friends with Caterhams and Westfields of all varieties and having driven a few there is little compromise in terms of ride on the road. My car is on "road" coil-overs so is softer than the race cars and obviously runs at over twice the ride height so can do speed bumps too. Suspension geometry is fully adjustable in every way so you can make it do what you want.
If you are comparing an SR3 to a BEC with aeroscreen then I would say just decide if you want mid engined or front, there is no difference in practicality apart from no boot, but I can fit enough stuff for a four day golfing trip with my mates in the passenger seat. The drawback is no windscreen or roof. Friends have those half hoods from Soft Bits for 7's and they are handy. In terms of handling on the road, both types of car have more than enough. What surprised me though is how forgiving the Radical is and how much it's possible to play with the balance on the throttle. No where near as much as a 7 but fun in a different way. The two cars cars are on different planets aerodynamically which is very noticeable on track and adds a whole new dimension which needs learning and I love that.
It has a reverse gear not an electric motor too which helps.
I don't know what your budget is but the SR3 SL would be worth a look. It has a car engine not a hyabusa's so that will change the character a bit, still a sequential box though. I'm sure Radical would let you drive it so you would see what one is like on the road. Finding a road legal car that isn't an SL might be the biggest problem. I'm told they didn't make many and converting a race car is prohibitively expensive so you just have to be lucky. That also doesn't leave much room for negotiation on price. Mine was in pretty good nick but it had issues when I bought it that I found out about afterwards (I very much doubt the seller knew though) so do your research on these pages first.
Mine is a 1300 so much less stress on all the components with 70 less bhp than the race cars and probably more practical for what I use it for, though more power is tempting and will happen one day. I haven't had to do much and the only tow I needed was from running out of fuel..... The low fuel light is rubbish I discovered (the first time I drove it!) and there is no fuel gauge.
All in all I wouldn't swap mine for anything. Probably requires more determination to use regularly than a Caterham but for me the car more than makes up for it. It's nice to have something different too.
Good luck
Edited by Coldaswell on Tuesday 28th August 10:11
My alternative is definitely a BEC Caterham.
jackg said:
Hi mate
I've had 3 Caterhams which I've raced and used on the road and had fun in them all except my last, a CSR which was rubbish!
I now have a sr3sl. Basically I use it for trackdays. I tend to drive to uk tracks and trailer it to SPa and the Ring.
It is brilliant !
Basically it's the next generation Caterham IMHO, it does everything better and is seriously quick. I put slicks on it and it's a different league.
In addition, the service from Radical is exceptional.
If you want to have some serious fun, look no further .
SL is more expensive than a road legal RS it's a wee bit heavier but the extra power makes its a bit quicker in my experience.
Basically, the only thing that ever overtakes you at trackdays a the V8 radicals and there is not much in that really either.
Thanks for the insight. When I had the Caterham, I always felt that the Radical was the next level. Good to hear that some people are driving them to track days. That is something I would most likely do. I've had 3 Caterhams which I've raced and used on the road and had fun in them all except my last, a CSR which was rubbish!
I now have a sr3sl. Basically I use it for trackdays. I tend to drive to uk tracks and trailer it to SPa and the Ring.
It is brilliant !
Basically it's the next generation Caterham IMHO, it does everything better and is seriously quick. I put slicks on it and it's a different league.
In addition, the service from Radical is exceptional.
If you want to have some serious fun, look no further .
SL is more expensive than a road legal RS it's a wee bit heavier but the extra power makes its a bit quicker in my experience.
Basically, the only thing that ever overtakes you at trackdays a the V8 radicals and there is not much in that really either.
Rich S said:
I have had a couple of road caterhams , than a Radical SR4 (track) now back to a Caterham R300(track)
Thoughts are
Radical
Aero is awesome , so is sequential box
BUT
felt fragile , like a purpose built race car
maintenance is by race hours
it takes 2 to take off the rear clamshel to adjust the chain , so you need support with you for every track outing (or a good side line in grabbing the nearest bod to help)
ground clearance can be an issue , even just getting it on the trailer
Caterham
feels bomb proof
lots of slidey fun , both on raod and track (the radical is all about precision)
pop away for a quick evening track day , with just your lid in the passanger seat
thrash it , and just worry about running out of fuel
BUT
Aero of a house brick (it does make the racing exciting)
in engineering terms it isn't what you would call advanced , but it has been honed over the years , and I would say there isn't much wrong with it
in summary and imho
the Radical is a modern race car that you can make road legal
the Caterham is a road car , honed over time , that happens to make an exceptional race car
I've not found them fragile in any way, for trackdays, maintenance is by trackday hours which is way different to race hours and even I can manage the all the bodywork and trailer loading and unloading on a 6 on my tod (now for the benefit of Nick997!) so I'm 100% sure I could now do likewise with a 4.Thoughts are
Radical
Aero is awesome , so is sequential box
BUT
felt fragile , like a purpose built race car
maintenance is by race hours
it takes 2 to take off the rear clamshel to adjust the chain , so you need support with you for every track outing (or a good side line in grabbing the nearest bod to help)
ground clearance can be an issue , even just getting it on the trailer
Caterham
feels bomb proof
lots of slidey fun , both on raod and track (the radical is all about precision)
pop away for a quick evening track day , with just your lid in the passanger seat
thrash it , and just worry about running out of fuel
BUT
Aero of a house brick (it does make the racing exciting)
in engineering terms it isn't what you would call advanced , but it has been honed over the years , and I would say there isn't much wrong with it
in summary and imho
the Radical is a modern race car that you can make road legal
the Caterham is a road car , honed over time , that happens to make an exceptional race car
(Now this is the tongue in cheek, no malice, purely for cheap giggles bit)
But for me, the real 'Radical Defector Returns & Tries To Explain Why He Is Now Driving a Way Slower Track Car' bit is this .............. that the Caterham has the .............
"Aero of a house brick"
As you well know, with a brick having a big flat bottom, it's nowhere near that good
splitpin said:
even I can manage the all the bodywork and trailer loading and unloading on a 6 on my tod (now for the benefit of Nick997!) so I'm 100% sure I could now do likewise with a 4.
Thank you Trev, I noticed the comment about not being able to do the rear clam solo and was going to leave it but seeing as you have brought it up... Stand behind car, lift wing by the wing supports and gently jiggle the bodywork loose from the location blocks. Roll the bodywork round the rear tyres until it is at a fairly upright angle, there comes a point where it is nicely wedged, resting on the tyres. Whip round the side of the car until you are standing in between the now almost upright bodywork and wing. Lift with one hand on wing support and one hand on bodywork, shuffle gently back wards and place bodywork on floor. Admire the oily bits.Just to confirm for the benefit of the OP that you guys are now talking about a PR6 and / or a clubsport whereas he is looking at an SR3. The rear of the SR3 is easily within the capability of one person on their own as also is the front although it is a bit more of a stretch to reach the upper edge to get the process started.
Obviously, the 6 is HD >
Pull four front pins - two at front, two - one each side - just in front of wheel.
Unlatch body clips - two each side onto side pod; plus two more (one either side just below roll hoop) if the rear bodywork is still on and the front and rear bodywork are still latched together.
Stand at the front of the car and use the front brake duct notches to pull the front bodywork forward away from the towing eye.
At this point the bodywork arch lips may snag the side pin keeps; keep a bit of gentle pressure on as you flex out the body sides slightly to clear.
When clear, continue to pull the bodywork forward; it will then go as far as the tyres; at this point, put protection on the floor; then gradually wiggle the bodywork 'up' the tyres until it's completely clear of the towing eye and then starts to go front edge down onto the protection.
You then use the nose as the pivot to stand the nose on the deck and eventually stand it on it's nose completely clear and completely upright; you then walk it off to wherever you want and depending on your arm stretch, there are various ways of actually lifting it; such as from the underside, the bulkhead lip below the screen or about halfway up the front wing louvres themselves.
When moving it solo in the virtually upright position, be careful - it's surprisingly tall! Lay it down nose end first - much stronger than the cockpit sides end.
HTH
Pull four front pins - two at front, two - one each side - just in front of wheel.
Unlatch body clips - two each side onto side pod; plus two more (one either side just below roll hoop) if the rear bodywork is still on and the front and rear bodywork are still latched together.
Stand at the front of the car and use the front brake duct notches to pull the front bodywork forward away from the towing eye.
At this point the bodywork arch lips may snag the side pin keeps; keep a bit of gentle pressure on as you flex out the body sides slightly to clear.
When clear, continue to pull the bodywork forward; it will then go as far as the tyres; at this point, put protection on the floor; then gradually wiggle the bodywork 'up' the tyres until it's completely clear of the towing eye and then starts to go front edge down onto the protection.
You then use the nose as the pivot to stand the nose on the deck and eventually stand it on it's nose completely clear and completely upright; you then walk it off to wherever you want and depending on your arm stretch, there are various ways of actually lifting it; such as from the underside, the bulkhead lip below the screen or about halfway up the front wing louvres themselves.
When moving it solo in the virtually upright position, be careful - it's surprisingly tall! Lay it down nose end first - much stronger than the cockpit sides end.
HTH
Edited by splitpin on Wednesday 29th August 17:28
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