bgt restoration
Discussion
hi guys,
i am doing some work on a 1968 bgt and think the sills need changing, what is the best course of action? are heritage panels generally the right size/shape or do they just resemble the part they are supposed to be? i want to do the work myself but am a bit of a beginner at the restoration business and need a few pointers. thanks
i am doing some work on a 1968 bgt and think the sills need changing, what is the best course of action? are heritage panels generally the right size/shape or do they just resemble the part they are supposed to be? i want to do the work myself but am a bit of a beginner at the restoration business and need a few pointers. thanks
Good luck - it's a time consuming job to take on if you're new to the restoration game - the most obvious thing (and I will state it!) is that you need to be able to weld properly, as this work involves the structural integrity of your car. You don't say what makes you think that they need replacing - are they full of holes along the full length of them (probably along the lower half of the sill) or are there a few rust bubbles under paint on the lower rear wing or front wing? If the latter, this could just be a weld line from an earlier replacement bubbling the paint. If in doubt, get prodding hard with a stick or screwdriver - if the sills are sound, it won't go through; if it does then they are not.
The front quarter of the length of the sill is covered by the lower part of the front wing, and is generally the first area to go with all the muck thrown up by the front wheels and built-in rust traps (so if you have holes elsewhere then they need replacing). The front wing unbolts, however, the rear 6 inches or so of the sill is covered by the lower part of the rear wing, which us welded on and has to be cut off to expose the sill to allow replacement and then use a repair panel and re-finish it to cover back up afret replacement. Once those are off, if the sills are spot welded, they need drilling out or, if they have been replaced and seam welded at some point, you have a long job with an angle grinder to look forward to. Once you have the outer sill off, you will almost inevitably find that the inner sill and is shot and need replacing too, along with the jacking point reinforcers. If you are really unlucky, the castle sections that the inner sill mates up to may also need repair - replacement rather than repair of that is a really major job (as if sill replacement isn't big enough in the first place).
Once you have exposed and repaired where necessary back to the point of being ready to build it all back up again, the next challenge is trial fitting everything up with clamps at first, then tack welds etc to get all the gaps right before final welding. After that it's the preparation and painting.
Unless you want to do it for personal satisfaction, £300 a side is well worth thinking about - if you haven't already got the right tools you'll easily spend a shed load of money buying them....good luck with it whichever way you decide to go,
MG Mark
The front quarter of the length of the sill is covered by the lower part of the front wing, and is generally the first area to go with all the muck thrown up by the front wheels and built-in rust traps (so if you have holes elsewhere then they need replacing). The front wing unbolts, however, the rear 6 inches or so of the sill is covered by the lower part of the rear wing, which us welded on and has to be cut off to expose the sill to allow replacement and then use a repair panel and re-finish it to cover back up afret replacement. Once those are off, if the sills are spot welded, they need drilling out or, if they have been replaced and seam welded at some point, you have a long job with an angle grinder to look forward to. Once you have the outer sill off, you will almost inevitably find that the inner sill and is shot and need replacing too, along with the jacking point reinforcers. If you are really unlucky, the castle sections that the inner sill mates up to may also need repair - replacement rather than repair of that is a really major job (as if sill replacement isn't big enough in the first place).
Once you have exposed and repaired where necessary back to the point of being ready to build it all back up again, the next challenge is trial fitting everything up with clamps at first, then tack welds etc to get all the gaps right before final welding. After that it's the preparation and painting.
Unless you want to do it for personal satisfaction, £300 a side is well worth thinking about - if you haven't already got the right tools you'll easily spend a shed load of money buying them....good luck with it whichever way you decide to go,
MG Mark
If you know somwhere that will do it for £300 a side then take their hands off, and the rest of their arms as well. Even at £30 an hour thats only ten hours labour a side.
I had the castle rails changed a few months back and with labour at £35 an hour by a MG specialist it was getting towards £1k. Depends what needs doing but for the whole sill section to be replaced professionally I would have thought you'd be looking at £3k for both sides. It is one of the biggest jobs, if the not the biggest, and most expensive jobs that you can do to a B.
I'll have a chat with someone more knowledgable than me and see if I'm correct but I'm sure your looking at big bills if you find you can't do it yourself.
I had the castle rails changed a few months back and with labour at £35 an hour by a MG specialist it was getting towards £1k. Depends what needs doing but for the whole sill section to be replaced professionally I would have thought you'd be looking at £3k for both sides. It is one of the biggest jobs, if the not the biggest, and most expensive jobs that you can do to a B.
I'll have a chat with someone more knowledgable than me and see if I'm correct but I'm sure your looking at big bills if you find you can't do it yourself.
Yeah just double checked. To have it done by the best MG specialists your looking at £1k a side. There are people that can do it for under £500 a side but then you need to consider all of the filling and respraying that needs doing afterwards as you have to cut the rear wings off to access the end of the sills. You then need repair panels fitting filling and eventually spraying.
Also if the sills are rotten expect to find further rot to the floors and seatbelt mounts.
Best of luck.
Also if the sills are rotten expect to find further rot to the floors and seatbelt mounts.
Best of luck.
I'm sorry to say this but it sounds like your garage took advantage of you a bit.
There are plenty of people who will do the sills at £300 ish a side, you do need to factor in painting, but it's only the bottom half, about £100 a side.
I'm not going to say it's a nice job, it isn't, I do plenty of them (no I don't want to do yours) but it is worth considering having a go if your capable.
There are plenty of people who will do the sills at £300 ish a side, you do need to factor in painting, but it's only the bottom half, about £100 a side.
I'm not going to say it's a nice job, it isn't, I do plenty of them (no I don't want to do yours) but it is worth considering having a go if your capable.
the reason i think they need changing is because on the underside there is a seam (im not sure i think this is where the outer sill meets the floorpan) and it appears to be coming apart slowly due to rust. the rest of the siil seems solid when prodded with a screwdriver.
other than the sills the rest of the rotted panels were replaced by the previous owner who left very little rust (all surface i think) and had the exterior of the car re-sprayed. ill put some pics up when i get my camera working to show you what i mean.
the welding if it actually needs doing will be done by a friend of mine who is a mechanic and between us i think we have the necessary tools to do the job, if not they can be begged for, borrowed and stolen.
theres a lot more to be done on the car than just this so expect to see a lot of questions as i want to do the majority of the work myself for personal satisfaction.
other than the sills the rest of the rotted panels were replaced by the previous owner who left very little rust (all surface i think) and had the exterior of the car re-sprayed. ill put some pics up when i get my camera working to show you what i mean.
the welding if it actually needs doing will be done by a friend of mine who is a mechanic and between us i think we have the necessary tools to do the job, if not they can be begged for, borrowed and stolen.
theres a lot more to be done on the car than just this so expect to see a lot of questions as i want to do the majority of the work myself for personal satisfaction.
stripped the car down completely this week, the passenger side sill is solid all the way along, i think the previous owner may have done this when he started the restoration.... the drivers side on the other hand is shot completely, took the front wing off and there is a hole about the size of a penny on the very bottom of the sill at the front. the seam along the bottom of the sill is also coming apart because of the rust so this side will be done. unfortunate thing is that the previous owner has done both the rear quarters, oh well thats his hard work gone tits up so to speak. while the sill seems to be strong i think it may be better doin this before i get the car sprayed rather than tidy it a bit and have to get it done in a year or less time
I repaired the sills on one of my B's and yes it's quite an involved job, but I had no previous experience and with a bit of time and patience I completed both sides. I used the MG owners repair kit, each side is a six part kit (or is that five?) and all fitted well.
So I would say, have a go - at least you will know it was done properly !
So I would say, have a go - at least you will know it was done properly !
thanks for the vote of confidence, i will be having help from a friend mainly with the welding altho i will try to do the majority myself. whats included in the kit? id guess it would be the inner and outer sills maybe the castle sections, the rear quarter and the jacking points? is this assumption right or wrong? or is it a stupid question?? thanks colin
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