Mid-engined Metro

[shepat]

I've had this idea stuck in my head for a while and I'm interested to know how difficult it would really be. The idea is that I would take the rear subframe of an MGF and put it in the back of a Rover Metro to make it mid engined and rear wheel drive. I'm not sure of many other details but that's the rough idea.

[Pistom]

I don't see the appeal myself but also don't see any reason it couldn't be done.

Obviously lots of structural work and detail work.

Have you the skills, time and resources?

[Uncle boshy]

Like this one at the gaydon museum?

https://www.mg-rover.org/threads/mgf-prototype.364...

[Trevatanus]

shepat said:

I've had this idea stuck in my head for a while and I'm interested to know how difficult it would really be. The idea is that I would take the rear subframe of an MGF and put it in the back of a Rover Metro to make it mid engined and rear wheel drive. I'm not sure of many other details but that's the rough idea.

As above, the 6R4 was a pretty good rally car as I recall.

[Pistom]

Trevatanus said:

As above, the 6R4 was a pretty good rally car as I recall.

But what the OP outlined would be quite far removed from a 6R4.

What they're proposing has been done before so can be done again with sufficient time and skill but as it's been done before, it doesn't hold the same appeal to me as if it hadn't.

A mid engined MGB/GT on the same principles sounds like fun.

A bit like a Unipower GT which doesn't look like a kit car.

[LimaDelta]

Trevatanus said:

shepat said:

I've had this idea stuck in my head for a while and I'm interested to know how difficult it would really be. The idea is that I would take the rear subframe of an MGF and put it in the back of a Rover Metro to make it mid engined and rear wheel drive. I'm not sure of many other details but that's the rough idea.

As above, the 6R4 was a pretty good rally car as I recall.

This would be more of a 4R2 though?

[ARHarh]

plenty have put engines in the back of classic minis, have a google, can't be that much different.

[Trevatanus]

LimaDelta said:

Trevatanus said:

shepat said:

I've had this idea stuck in my head for a while and I'm interested to know how difficult it would really be. The idea is that I would take the rear subframe of an MGF and put it in the back of a Rover Metro to make it mid engined and rear wheel drive. I'm not sure of many other details but that's the rough idea.

As above, the 6R4 was a pretty good rally car as I recall.

This would be more of a 4R2 though?

I always assumed it was 4 Wheel Drive, Rear engine (although technically Mid) and V6?

[LimaDelta]

Trevatanus said:

LimaDelta said:

Trevatanus said:

shepat said:

I've had this idea stuck in my head for a while and I'm interested to know how difficult it would really be. The idea is that I would take the rear subframe of an MGF and put it in the back of a Rover Metro to make it mid engined and rear wheel drive. I'm not sure of many other details but that's the rough idea.

As above, the 6R4 was a pretty good rally car as I recall.

This would be more of a 4R2 though?

I always assumed it was 4 Wheel Drive, Rear engine (although technically Mid) and V6?

The 6R4 was, 6-cylinder, rear (mid) engine, 4wd. An MGF into Metro would be a 4-cylinder, mid/rear 2wd. Semantics though, really.

[Pit Pony]

When you say metro, you mean an earlier one with a A series, which has been pilanged for a Mini, and a K series just won't fit in the front ? I suppose if you had such a metro, the cheapest but most difficult way to get it going would be a K series in the boot.

[shepat]

Pistom said:

I don't see the appeal myself but also don't see any reason it couldn't be done.

Obviously lots of structural work and detail work.

Have you the skills, time and resources?

I have the skills or resources, but I do have the time. It was more of a theoretical question for now just to get an idea of how difficult it would be. I do know people who do have the resources and skills.

[shepat]

Pistom said:

But what the OP outlined would be quite far removed from a 6R4.

What they're proposing has been done before so can be done again with sufficient time and skill but as it's been done before, it doesn't hold the same appeal to me as if it hadn't.

A mid engined MGB/GT on the same principles sounds like fun.

A bit like a Unipower GT which doesn't look like a kit car.

It is partially inspired by the 6R4 but would in no way be trying to imitate it. The idea developed due to how many parts are shared with the MGF. However, if I understand it correctly the MGF effectively has 2 Rover Metro front subframes. So, the rear subframe of a Rover Metro is could not be easily replaced with a MGF subframe.

A mid-engined MGB would be interesting actually, but I'd imagine that is more work?

[shepat]

Pit Pony said:

When you say metro, you mean an earlier one with a A series, which has been pilanged for a Mini, and a K series just won't fit in the front ? I suppose if you had such a metro, the cheapest but most difficult way to get it going would be a K series in the boot.

I was thinking the Rover Metro, although maybe using an early Metro has the benefits of parts being shared with the Mini. I was hoping it would have hydragas though, although that is a whole other level of complexity which maybe I should avoid

[Pistom]

shepat said:

Pistom said:

I don't see the appeal myself but also don't see any reason it couldn't be done.

Obviously lots of structural work and detail work.

Have you the skills, time and resources?

I have the skills or resources, but I do have the time. It was more of a theoretical question for now just to get an idea of how difficult it would be. I do know people who do have the resources and skills.

I do hope my comment didn't come over as patronising. It wasn't intended to. The more I thought about this today, the more I see your interest in doing it. In a project like this, it is the small details which take up a lot of time and if you're paying someone for that time, it can get expensive long before you have anything like a finished car.

If you want to see what's possible, look at YouTube videos such as Project Binky or the one where they take a triumph GT6, fit a custom chassis, V8, custom suspension and steering and the last I saw, replaced the bulkhead. Great entertainment and probably fun to do.

If you do go ahead - it would be fabulous to see a thread on here about it.

[shepat]

Pistom said:

I do hope my comment didn't come over as patronising. It wasn't intended to. The more I thought about this today, the more I see your interest in doing it. In a project like this, it is the small details which take up a lot of time and if you're paying someone for that time, it can get expensive long before you have anything like a finished car.

If you want to see what's possible, look at YouTube videos such as Project Binky or the one where they take a triumph GT6, fit a custom chassis, V8, custom suspension and steering and the last I saw, replaced the bulkhead. Great entertainment and probably fun to do.

If you do go ahead - it would be fabulous to see a thread on here about it.

Don't worry it didn't. I imagine the small stuff are the things you don't think about when starting out but that take the most time. I would hope to do as much as possible myself and use it as a bit of learning experience. I should admittedly get an easier project first, but I started this thread because I thought I would get some interesting advice and insights on my idea.

I've found 2 channels that have done something similar, but in both cases they effectively cut out the entire rear floor of the car and I would hope to keep as much of the original chassis in place to reduce the amount of fabrication needed. I have also seen some of the Project Binky videos but I'll have a look at the ones that are more specifically about the engine mounting and subframes etc. I'll have a look for the one about a Triumph GT6 as it sounds interesting. Thank you.

[Pit Pony]

shepat said:

Pit Pony said:

When you say metro, you mean an earlier one with a A series, which has been pilanged for a Mini, and a K series just won't fit in the front ? I suppose if you had such a metro, the cheapest but most difficult way to get it going would be a K series in the boot.

I was thinking the Rover Metro,

In which case, what is the most powerful K series ? Let's say 200 bhp from.a tuned 1.8 VVT
Put one at each end. 400 bhp 4 x 4

Wasn't there a twin engineed nova with 2 LETs from calibra turbos going around about 20 years ago. 700 bhp IIRC

[Pistom]

Here's some inspiration - courtesy of MST Cars

[shepat]

Pit Pony said:

shepat said:

Pit Pony said:

When you say metro, you mean an earlier one with a A series, which has been pilanged for a Mini, and a K series just won't fit in the front ? I suppose if you had such a metro, the cheapest but most difficult way to get it going would be a K series in the boot.

I was thinking the Rover Metro,

In which case, what is the most powerful K series ? Let's say 200 bhp from.a tuned 1.8 VVT
Put one at each end. 400 bhp 4 x 4

Wasn't there a twin engineed nova with 2 LETs from calibra turbos going around about 20 years ago. 700 bhp IIRC

I have looked into how much the K series cpuld make but I can't remember how much people thought. It would be an interesting idea to do it twin engine but that is a whole other level of complexity. I had thought about it originally but decided to work out how difficult it would be to mount the rear engine first.

It might actually be easier to do an AWD MGF as you could just use the front drivetrain and subframe from a Rover Metro. Although, due to the low bonnet it would probably be better to make the front axle electrically powered.