Discussion
Hello everyone,
I'm looking to get a pure track car at the moment. I've done some research on Caterham Superlights, Radical SR4 and Atom2, and I'm leaning towards the Atom now for the reliable Honda engine and relatively lower price tag.
I've got the price list for the Atom2 with me, but I'm getting a bit confused after going through it. I noticed that the 15" wheel tyre package comes as a option for 339+VAT. Does the Atom2 not come with wheels and tyres?
Which options should I tick, and which ones should I avoid?
Does water come splashing into the footwell when you drive in the wet?
Cheers,
Hubert
I'm looking to get a pure track car at the moment. I've done some research on Caterham Superlights, Radical SR4 and Atom2, and I'm leaning towards the Atom now for the reliable Honda engine and relatively lower price tag.
I've got the price list for the Atom2 with me, but I'm getting a bit confused after going through it. I noticed that the 15" wheel tyre package comes as a option for 339+VAT. Does the Atom2 not come with wheels and tyres?
Which options should I tick, and which ones should I avoid?
Does water come splashing into the footwell when you drive in the wet?
Cheers,
Hubert
Hubert,
I have just got a 220 and they are MAGIC. Compared with a Caterham with the same performance (i.e. an R400 or 500) they are chalk and cheese. Firstly it will work and whatever people tell you about the bigger engined Caterham, they break down all the time. Big things, little things, but they break. I got very close to an R500 or 600, but in reality you have to budget for an engine rebuild every year which is £2-3k(check with Keith Jecks, who is the R500 club sec who was the most reliable chap I found). The same is true with pretty much any 180bhp + k-series, but the less powerful ones are sightly cheaper. As an illustration, the last three track days I have been on, I was joined each time with a Caterham-driving mate and on all, the Caterham broke down.
On windiness and so on. The Atom is less practical than a Caterham. There is no boot to speak of, so you have to use the passenger seat and footwell, which is fine with one, less good with two. It is colder than the Caterham and a lot more exposed, but you don't get wet particularly unless you stop. You also really need to wear a helmet and ear plugs at all times. This is easy to deal with though. Buy heated bike clothing and have Simon fit a socket to power it and you will be warm (www.chilliheatedclothing.co.uk or www.motorcycle-uk.com/giali/Gialiheatedclothing.html). Secondly, get some custom made ear plugs with speakers in (www.ultimateear.com) and you can listen to your iPod in peace and tranquility. They are £140, but well worth it. I drove back 450 miles from the Nurburgring with a mate in a Caterham on Monday and with the gear I had on, was probably in better shape than he. If you ride bikes, there is much less buffeting and exposure in the Atom than a bike.
Spec, others have more experience than me, but I have the 220 with virtually everything as it was the company demonstrator. The brake upgrade seems essential for the 220. I have the 16" wheel package (which is 15" fronts and 16" rears, which limits the availability of tyres a bit) which it probably worthwhile, and I will change to mag wheels soon. The LSD improves the brilliant traction a bit more, the baffled sump is good if you do a lot of track days. The adjustable dampers are great for track days too, then back to comfy for the road (and the really do make a difference). Removable steering wheel is a good security thing and 6-point harnesses locate you much more securely on track.
Practically a better way to look at it is to start with your budget and then work out which of the extras you can get within it.
Do it, they are fabulous.
I have just got a 220 and they are MAGIC. Compared with a Caterham with the same performance (i.e. an R400 or 500) they are chalk and cheese. Firstly it will work and whatever people tell you about the bigger engined Caterham, they break down all the time. Big things, little things, but they break. I got very close to an R500 or 600, but in reality you have to budget for an engine rebuild every year which is £2-3k(check with Keith Jecks, who is the R500 club sec who was the most reliable chap I found). The same is true with pretty much any 180bhp + k-series, but the less powerful ones are sightly cheaper. As an illustration, the last three track days I have been on, I was joined each time with a Caterham-driving mate and on all, the Caterham broke down.
On windiness and so on. The Atom is less practical than a Caterham. There is no boot to speak of, so you have to use the passenger seat and footwell, which is fine with one, less good with two. It is colder than the Caterham and a lot more exposed, but you don't get wet particularly unless you stop. You also really need to wear a helmet and ear plugs at all times. This is easy to deal with though. Buy heated bike clothing and have Simon fit a socket to power it and you will be warm (www.chilliheatedclothing.co.uk or www.motorcycle-uk.com/giali/Gialiheatedclothing.html). Secondly, get some custom made ear plugs with speakers in (www.ultimateear.com) and you can listen to your iPod in peace and tranquility. They are £140, but well worth it. I drove back 450 miles from the Nurburgring with a mate in a Caterham on Monday and with the gear I had on, was probably in better shape than he. If you ride bikes, there is much less buffeting and exposure in the Atom than a bike.
Spec, others have more experience than me, but I have the 220 with virtually everything as it was the company demonstrator. The brake upgrade seems essential for the 220. I have the 16" wheel package (which is 15" fronts and 16" rears, which limits the availability of tyres a bit) which it probably worthwhile, and I will change to mag wheels soon. The LSD improves the brilliant traction a bit more, the baffled sump is good if you do a lot of track days. The adjustable dampers are great for track days too, then back to comfy for the road (and the really do make a difference). Removable steering wheel is a good security thing and 6-point harnesses locate you much more securely on track.
Practically a better way to look at it is to start with your budget and then work out which of the extras you can get within it.
Do it, they are fabulous.
Standard fitted wheels are 14" - I'm pretty sure that almost everyone upgrades them - apparently they're popular in Japan ?!?!?
If it's mainly for tracking, you probably want the 16" wheel/track tyre package which comes with Dunlop R's fitted on nice alloys, 16" at the back, 15" at the front.
If you can afford the 16” Magnesium Wheel/Track tyre Package then they look nicer as they're granite black rather than alloy silver (and Mark'll tell you they make you go faster
)
Someone, please correct me if I'm wrong on any of the the above.
PS. You'll love the Atom on the track. The 220 is fabulous, the 160 is obviously not quite as fast but represents great value and is probably better suited for more road use. Go for it
Cheers, Ross.
If it's mainly for tracking, you probably want the 16" wheel/track tyre package which comes with Dunlop R's fitted on nice alloys, 16" at the back, 15" at the front.
If you can afford the 16” Magnesium Wheel/Track tyre Package then they look nicer as they're granite black rather than alloy silver (and Mark'll tell you they make you go faster
) Someone, please correct me if I'm wrong on any of the the above.
PS. You'll love the Atom on the track. The 220 is fabulous, the 160 is obviously not quite as fast but represents great value and is probably better suited for more road use. Go for it
Cheers, Ross.
Hi coxm, ross and atom290
Thanks for your tips!
I have to say that I like the trademark Caterham look a lot, but the Rover K-series engine really let's it down. I've read from the Caterham forums that a few people have puchased the R400 chassis with a Duratec engine thrown into it, which eliminates the reliability problem, but the total cost would be in the region of 34k, which exceeded my budget. Afterall, I wanted a hassle-free track car that I can drive everytime I'm at the track, that's why the Atom2 really appeals to me.
My plan is to get a race car that will be permanently stored at the track, so I wouldn't need a compromise for the geo setting, and the suspension can be as stiff as rock. Is the more expensive Bilstein suspension adjustable for bump and rebound? Or do I need to order the race dampers to get this sort of adjustability?
What exactly is the bubble screen? Is this the wind deflector above the dash that helps to divert the air above the head? Can I drive with an open face helmet and shades with this installed?
Has anyone driven against the Porsche GT3RS or alike along the straights at the track? How does the acceleration of the two compare up to 140mph?
Oh, does anybody have a pic of the stock dash in operation (not the one included in the road pack)? I can only find images of the road dash.
atom290, how much did it cost you to get the frame coated in yellow? That's a really neat idea!
Cheers,
Hubert
Thanks for your tips!
I have to say that I like the trademark Caterham look a lot, but the Rover K-series engine really let's it down. I've read from the Caterham forums that a few people have puchased the R400 chassis with a Duratec engine thrown into it, which eliminates the reliability problem, but the total cost would be in the region of 34k, which exceeded my budget. Afterall, I wanted a hassle-free track car that I can drive everytime I'm at the track, that's why the Atom2 really appeals to me.
My plan is to get a race car that will be permanently stored at the track, so I wouldn't need a compromise for the geo setting, and the suspension can be as stiff as rock. Is the more expensive Bilstein suspension adjustable for bump and rebound? Or do I need to order the race dampers to get this sort of adjustability?
What exactly is the bubble screen? Is this the wind deflector above the dash that helps to divert the air above the head? Can I drive with an open face helmet and shades with this installed?
Has anyone driven against the Porsche GT3RS or alike along the straights at the track? How does the acceleration of the two compare up to 140mph?
Oh, does anybody have a pic of the stock dash in operation (not the one included in the road pack)? I can only find images of the road dash.
atom290, how much did it cost you to get the frame coated in yellow? That's a really neat idea!
Cheers,
Hubert
You just dont want to know how much mine has cost!!
Oh and whats wrong with the reliability of the k-series? Mines done 1000 hard miles and still going strong
And no you cant have it yellow, mines yellow and thats the only one that is allowed to be yellow! There aint enough room in this town for two of them!!!
Oh and whats wrong with the reliability of the k-series? Mines done 1000 hard miles and still going strong
And no you cant have it yellow, mines yellow and thats the only one that is allowed to be yellow! There aint enough room in this town for two of them!!!
The top spec Bilsteins have five settings for simultaneous bump/rebound. 5 is the softest and the car is usually set to 4 for road use.
The bubble screens are a wind deflector for people who want them. They are a black GRP base screen (much like the standard screen) with two seperate ABS plastic 'bubbles' bolted into it. Ariel can supply these in different heights. Personally I have no difficulty with the standard screen and quite like the wind in my face. I guess it depends on a few factors, including your helmet shape (and the size of your head!).
Ariel can quote on different powdercoat colours.
Hope this helps,
Andrew
The bubble screens are a wind deflector for people who want them. They are a black GRP base screen (much like the standard screen) with two seperate ABS plastic 'bubbles' bolted into it. Ariel can supply these in different heights. Personally I have no difficulty with the standard screen and quite like the wind in my face. I guess it depends on a few factors, including your helmet shape (and the size of your head!
). Ariel can quote on different powdercoat colours.
Hope this helps,
Andrew
hello Hubert,
Concerning GT3RS, i have the chance to drive with 2 of them on 2 different tracks and in both case, my atom 220 was fastest on a lap time and on acceleration, the Atom is better till 100mph (2 personns in each car, as for my Atom). Between 100 and 120, no difference, after the GT3RS is faster but the time at this speed on a race track is very short.
Till now, after 6 track-days (5 in France, 1 in england with great success considering all the message i had received
on this forum), no other car with normal tyres (every kind of road-legal tyres, no slick) was faster then my Atom (GT3RS, GT2, 360 Stradale, Donkervoort 220, Cat, Radical....).
And my chassis and brakes are still not with optimum set-up for track.
Hope this help,
Jean-Pascal
Concerning GT3RS, i have the chance to drive with 2 of them on 2 different tracks and in both case, my atom 220 was fastest on a lap time and on acceleration, the Atom is better till 100mph (2 personns in each car, as for my Atom). Between 100 and 120, no difference, after the GT3RS is faster but the time at this speed on a race track is very short.
Till now, after 6 track-days (5 in France, 1 in england with great success considering all the message i had received
on this forum), no other car with normal tyres (every kind of road-legal tyres, no slick) was faster then my Atom (GT3RS, GT2, 360 Stradale, Donkervoort 220, Cat, Radical....). And my chassis and brakes are still not with optimum set-up for track.
Hope this help,
Jean-Pascal
On the duratec engined Caterham, I looked at that too and drove one. It has none of the handling delicacy of the K-series ones, since the duratec lump is so heavy, so there is a constant battle to stop it understeering. Of course Atom290 mean't to say that his hasn't blown up yet
On the GT3RS, I don't have one, but I do have a 355 and a 993 RS Clubsport with 345ish bhp. The Atom murders both on a track. Up to the top of 5th gear is much quicker, above about 130 or so, the 911 is quicker. I was at the Ring on Saturday in it, and started behind the Ring Taxi. On the drag from Flugplatz to Schweudenkreuz, which starts at about 100mph I lost about 30 yards on it, but has caught all of that back by the exit of Schweudenkreuz. I the RS, I am doing about 160 before I brake for Schweudenkreuz and the M5 will be a little slower. Nothing but nothing came past me all day, and the average lap speed at the Ring is about 105mph. I wouldn't worry about it, there may be brief moments at the end of a straight where a GT3RS is faster, but that's it, and you needn't worry about them overtaking you again . . .
On the GT3RS, I don't have one, but I do have a 355 and a 993 RS Clubsport with 345ish bhp. The Atom murders both on a track. Up to the top of 5th gear is much quicker, above about 130 or so, the 911 is quicker. I was at the Ring on Saturday in it, and started behind the Ring Taxi. On the drag from Flugplatz to Schweudenkreuz, which starts at about 100mph I lost about 30 yards on it, but has caught all of that back by the exit of Schweudenkreuz. I the RS, I am doing about 160 before I brake for Schweudenkreuz and the M5 will be a little slower. Nothing but nothing came past me all day
, and the average lap speed at the Ring is about 105mph. I wouldn't worry about it, there may be brief moments at the end of a straight where a GT3RS is faster, but that's it, and you needn't worry about them overtaking you again . . .Jean Pascal and coxm,
Thanks for your info on the speed comparison. I guess the air drag acting on the bare-boned Atom really comes into play above 100mph. Should be a fun and challenging project to improve the aerodynamics of this
coxm,
I thought the Duratec weighs pretty much the same as the K-series???
Thanks for your info on the speed comparison. I guess the air drag acting on the bare-boned Atom really comes into play above 100mph. Should be a fun and challenging project to improve the aerodynamics of this
coxm,
I thought the Duratec weighs pretty much the same as the K-series???
Hi Andrew,
Thanks for your help! I guess I can decide on the bubble screen when I order the car.
That good news, just hope that wouldn't cost a fortune Atom290, don't worry, yellow is not really my colour
I have to say that the K-series with 160hp is robust and light, but the limit of this engine can clearly been seen if you push it above 200hp.
>> Edited by Hubert on Friday 1st October 02:22
Thanks for your help! I guess I can decide on the bubble screen when I order the car.
owi said:
Ariel can quote on different powdercoat colours.
That good news, just hope that wouldn't cost a fortune
Atom290, don't worry, yellow is not really my colour I have to say that the K-series with 160hp is robust and light, but the limit of this engine can clearly been seen if you push it above 200hp.
>> Edited by Hubert on Friday 1st October 02:22
Hi All,
been reading about powder coating requirments
If you want special colours, metalflakes,chrome silver , golds etc etc I can do it for you. The factory simon uses to build the frames is down the road (abour 1hr) from my factory. I won't charge much and you will get just what you want. I have a 5 metre oven that can take a whole car chassis and a very large totally enclosed spray booth. If its of interest send me an email
Mark
been reading about powder coating requirments
owi said:
Ariel can quote on different powdercoat colours.
If you want special colours, metalflakes,chrome silver , golds etc etc I can do it for you. The factory simon uses to build the frames is down the road (abour 1hr) from my factory. I won't charge much and you will get just what you want. I have a 5 metre oven that can take a whole car chassis and a very large totally enclosed spray booth. If its of interest send me an email
Mark
I am hoping that with the new design of plenum, I should be able to get closer to 300bhp!
It was a great shame that the car was down on power at Rockingham due to the stupidly high inlet temperatures. Im not quite sure why the change, as the water injection pump was putting it somewhere
But the new design will help dramatically
It was a great shame that the car was down on power at Rockingham due to the stupidly high inlet temperatures. Im not quite sure why the change, as the water injection pump was putting it somewhere
But the new design will help dramatically my Atom is identical spec to Meyricks and was what the factory recommended for track day use - and I've just come from a GT3 clubsport ( Noble M12, mark 1 GT3 before that - its singificantly quicker than those as well)
the Atom murders the GT3 to to 125, and then largely stops.......
Its also significantly quicker than my Caterham ( vauxhall 200bhp car built for long distance racing)
I did go throught the radical/JP1 debate myself ( test drove the JP 1 at Bedford - awesome, but also awesome costs) but what swings it for the Atom is the Honda engine and simplicity. If you have a bike, you already have all the gear - problem solved!
the Atom murders the GT3 to to 125, and then largely stops.......
Its also significantly quicker than my Caterham ( vauxhall 200bhp car built for long distance racing)
I did go throught the radical/JP1 debate myself ( test drove the JP 1 at Bedford - awesome, but also awesome costs) but what swings it for the Atom is the Honda engine and simplicity. If you have a bike, you already have all the gear - problem solved!
Hi Mark, and thanks for your offer. I'll definitely keep that in mind
Now then, what happens when the Atom2 is up against the SR4? I know the SR4 laps faster than the Atom2 based on tests done by EVO, TRC, CD and other magazines, but do these reviews really do justice? As usual, they never factor in the reliability issue in their reviews.
Has anyone seen Radicals break down at the track? I wouldn't expect these engines to be reliable when they require a refresh/rebuild once a year.
In terms of performance around the track, I can't help thinking that the two cars may be in for a close fight if the Atom is running on slicks, with Penske race dampers setup properly.
Now then, what happens when the Atom2 is up against the SR4? I know the SR4 laps faster than the Atom2 based on tests done by EVO, TRC, CD and other magazines, but do these reviews really do justice? As usual, they never factor in the reliability issue in their reviews.
Has anyone seen Radicals break down at the track? I wouldn't expect these engines to be reliable when they require a refresh/rebuild once a year.
In terms of performance around the track, I can't help thinking that the two cars may be in for a close fight if the Atom is running on slicks, with Penske race dampers setup properly.
I've driven an SR3 and SR4. When they are working, they murder an Atom and pretty much anything else, but you need to be pretty committed and you will trip up over even more traffic. Note the "when they are working". Mate of mine has two SR3s and two R500s which he has a transporter and 2 mechanics take to trackdays, so that one of them is working most of the time (his words). Personally I have never seen a Radical survive a track day, rather than the other way round, but I may have seen a biased (but pretty large) group.
Radicals are in a totally different league in cost terms. The factory charges like a wounded rhino. They are very fragile, like anything with a bike engine, and a tuned one at that. The SR3 Turbo, that Phil Bennett (who I race with) broke the Ring lap record with, only managed 3 laps of the Ring running properly with full factory support and broke on the last one. The one that Sutcliffe drove to Croft (with an Atom, R500, Grinnall and Westfield) needed 5 ECUs, and I do mean 5, to complete the journey. Don't even think of it, unless you a) like tinkering; or b) have full-time mechanics and a brace of them.
Radicals are in a totally different league in cost terms. The factory charges like a wounded rhino. They are very fragile, like anything with a bike engine, and a tuned one at that. The SR3 Turbo, that Phil Bennett (who I race with) broke the Ring lap record with, only managed 3 laps of the Ring running properly with full factory support and broke on the last one. The one that Sutcliffe drove to Croft (with an Atom, R500, Grinnall and Westfield) needed 5 ECUs, and I do mean 5, to complete the journey. Don't even think of it, unless you a) like tinkering; or b) have full-time mechanics and a brace of them.
Gassing Station | Ariel | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff