A few words...
Discussion
I feel a little history of the UK Viper club should be brought up for those newer owners here. Back in 1998 Wayne, a new pro-active owner took the initiative and sent letters to Chrysler UK dealers, asking for them to be sent on to any Viper owners they knew contacts of. He was keen to form an owners club, as he wasn’t aware of any UK club, only the VCA and approached them to officially start a UK region over here. The VCA welcomed his ideas and he set up a web site, they also instructed him on official club rules, of which required a “President” and “Vice P”. I was unable to find any other owners (other than Justin B) or Viper activities going on (other than Chrysler UK promotional ones, which they were keen to have me involved in!). I didn’t have a computer back then, so when I got Wayne’s letter, I was of course very enthusiastic about a club. 
Given my enthusiasm, knowledge of the car, and offer to help with anything, I was asked to become VP, as simple as that! The VCA were about to have a big regional officials meeting in NV and encouraged us to make that. We did so, and put the UK region ‘on the map’; the established USA regions, Swiss, German, Japanese regions all attended, and were delighted to meet us, and have UK officially a part of the VCA.
I later learned there was a UK club Paul had started...so he is the original UK founder, and needs credit for this; and he had contacted VCA. I hadn’t heard of this existing club or its activities, I would have loved to have known about it. I was just helping Wayne organise meetings, and helping owners with many matters. Then this already formed club came to attention; from what was said, Paul felt things had been taken away from what he’d originally started. I agree, this must have felt awful, but it was never the intention to undermine anything. It’s quite understandable that Paul is the way he is, perhaps a bit defensive when ever a question regarding how the club is run comes up. Now when Wayne suddenly, tragically died, most of the web site was copied across, well done Neil and Paul for saving it. My ugly mug as VP was copied across, and to this day, there it remains! I’ve always left it to Paul to involve me as much or little as he chooses, being sensitive not to interfere, or ‘tread on toes’ given certain issues. I did note that my name was not mentioned regarding original UK members, and on the VCA-members list posted up recently!
Paul does a great job, if he or members want a different VP please do speak up...just politely say! I also think Steve Kingshott deserves huge credit, he’s done a lot for the club and Vipers in the past. 
When I visit a car forum, it’s to read / talk mainly cars, as I’m sure it is for most of us? I don’t think people really want to read personal attacks against others, and it’s not permitted behaviour on PH forums! Just to say thanks to all those that were concerned and emailed me the link to a certain awful topic, your mails are appreciated, and sorry it’s taken me a while to have a moment to reply; I’ve not had time to get to a computer much the last few weeks (in fact over 200 emails I’m still catching up with). I can only wish I could find the time to get on-line, like some of you seem to be able to. Work, work, work...but, I’ve had my GTS nearly 10 years now...just got a last few months of loan payments left to go...then maybe start another 10 year loan, for a new ACR!?
Lets keep post’s positive, there’s no need for all this, Sam’s “accusations flying” etc. Yes there’s been upset, and issues...Bjorn’s post made reference to, which I fully agree with Sam on, don’t “air dirty laundry” and “never assume”...someone should be sat writing lines “I must not assume, I must not air dirty laundry” Bjorn was absolutely NOT referring to Barry regarding cheating me out of money!! I’d have thought several years on you might have been able to lay this to rest, gosh it still seems to be a rather raw nerve...now after your public posting of it, I’m going to have to respond to what you’ve chosen to vent and write
hopefully smooth things over. I didn’t offer my 2 GenII sills up for grabs (beautifully made by Colin). Although you had 2 GenI sills from Colin, you phoned me to ask if I wasn’t going to be using my 2 just yet, could you use them and when I came to need them, you’d replace them. Replacing only 1 sill, was never part of the deal. You did a beautiful job with them, cutting them for the side exit pipes; they really did look fantastic on your first Viper called Bling. When I subsequently needed the sills, you didn’t want to pay me for their replacement? I wasn’t even asking for P&P (£25 I think it is from Scotland) so please help me to see how you “lost out on cash”? I do give small parts away, but a pair of sills I just can’t stretch to, sorry! Yes, my emails of having to KEEP asking for their replacements cost did get blunt. No “abusive” phone calls was ever made by me to you...I had Sam and you phone me after I’d worked a night shift, I was woken up by your call as I’d left the phone on (anxiously waiting for news, my dog needing a big emergency operation, which I explained at the time) I couldn’t even hear the latter part of your call as you had a child crying in the background. So like you say “two sides to every story”.
I’m sorry you seem a little bitter Barry, you helped in the past with dropping my diff off, accompanied me when I dropped my gear box off, and helped pushed my car at various race events. I’ve certainly not forgotten all this. Hey, you should feel privileged to have pushed my car
...I can only say you always offered, and were keen to come along, I never asked you to do any of it. I thought you enjoyed being involved in the Vipers racing team, we enjoyed you coming along. If it’s an issue, then please accept publically my grateful thanks now. Please realise if I’d not believed you to have been a good mate in the past, then I would not have given my time to fit that up-rated clutch and flywheel for you on your current GenII called Lucky. You heard from someone else that I wasn’t going on the German club trip that weekend, and when you phoned and asked then if you could come over, I happily said yes (and put aside plans to work on my own car that day for you, work I’ve still not had a chance to do yet)! No bad feeling on my part, it was right at the time, and you drove away happy with a beautifully installed flywheel and clutch, even a belly full of pizza (that must be where I went wrong, wasn’t big Macs!). This is why it hurts me so much when I clicked on the link and read your replies, which seemed quite aggressive and out to get at me for anything. 
I have been busy racing this year, but have found time to help at least 8 owners out (FOC) who have privately contacted me, also taken 4 Viper owners out for track rides in a Comp Coupe, any time and costs are to me and my choice to give. But, I’m not about to start blowing a trumpet about what I do either. I’m not going to stop helping people, it’s no bother if perceived dealer or not to me. If a Viper has any problems, it’s doesn’t look good for the cars in general, and my passion is with the car. I remember the 3 dealer screw-ups on the frame recalls there was fault with, if I’d not spotted / helped, the cars could still be like it today and maybe owners none the wiser!
Now, given the over time hours I have to work, I’d rather have a quick bite to eat and have a chance to work on a car for the day with racing prep. We didn’t come to the dyno day because I was working, and I’m also fortunate enough to have free access to a local dyno. Don’t take it personally that I’ve stopped coming to pub lunches you organise. It’s a way to come, but I’m seeing if we can make your Crimbo meal night (maybe just for just a drink) in the pub with all going, and show support (called the pub and Sally said no probs). It would have been nice to bring the Comp Coupe, but unfortunately they’ve just salted the roads and now it’s very wet, so we may not do so. I can however offer Viper owners a chance of a ride around Silverstone GP on Dec 15th (get in touch for more details). Life’s to short for upset...I’m willing to offer the Olive branch over all this, it’s would be nice to see it not pooped on!
Given my enthusiasm, knowledge of the car, and offer to help with anything, I was asked to become VP, as simple as that! The VCA were about to have a big regional officials meeting in NV and encouraged us to make that. We did so, and put the UK region ‘on the map’; the established USA regions, Swiss, German, Japanese regions all attended, and were delighted to meet us, and have UK officially a part of the VCA.I later learned there was a UK club Paul had started...so he is the original UK founder, and needs credit for this; and he had contacted VCA. I hadn’t heard of this existing club or its activities, I would have loved to have known about it. I was just helping Wayne organise meetings, and helping owners with many matters. Then this already formed club came to attention; from what was said, Paul felt things had been taken away from what he’d originally started. I agree, this must have felt awful, but it was never the intention to undermine anything. It’s quite understandable that Paul is the way he is, perhaps a bit defensive when ever a question regarding how the club is run comes up. Now when Wayne suddenly, tragically died, most of the web site was copied across, well done Neil and Paul for saving it. My ugly mug as VP was copied across, and to this day, there it remains! I’ve always left it to Paul to involve me as much or little as he chooses, being sensitive not to interfere, or ‘tread on toes’ given certain issues. I did note that my name was not mentioned regarding original UK members, and on the VCA-members list posted up recently!
Paul does a great job, if he or members want a different VP please do speak up...just politely say! I also think Steve Kingshott deserves huge credit, he’s done a lot for the club and Vipers in the past. When I visit a car forum, it’s to read / talk mainly cars, as I’m sure it is for most of us? I don’t think people really want to read personal attacks against others, and it’s not permitted behaviour on PH forums! Just to say thanks to all those that were concerned and emailed me the link to a certain awful topic, your mails are appreciated, and sorry it’s taken me a while to have a moment to reply; I’ve not had time to get to a computer much the last few weeks (in fact over 200 emails I’m still catching up with). I can only wish I could find the time to get on-line, like some of you seem to be able to. Work, work, work...but, I’ve had my GTS nearly 10 years now...just got a last few months of loan payments left to go...then maybe start another 10 year loan, for a new ACR!?
Lets keep post’s positive, there’s no need for all this, Sam’s “accusations flying” etc. Yes there’s been upset, and issues...Bjorn’s post made reference to, which I fully agree with Sam on, don’t “air dirty laundry” and “never assume”...someone should be sat writing lines “I must not assume, I must not air dirty laundry” Bjorn was absolutely NOT referring to Barry regarding cheating me out of money!! I’d have thought several years on you might have been able to lay this to rest, gosh it still seems to be a rather raw nerve...now after your public posting of it, I’m going to have to respond to what you’ve chosen to vent and write
hopefully smooth things over. I didn’t offer my 2 GenII sills up for grabs (beautifully made by Colin). Although you had 2 GenI sills from Colin, you phoned me to ask if I wasn’t going to be using my 2 just yet, could you use them and when I came to need them, you’d replace them. Replacing only 1 sill, was never part of the deal. You did a beautiful job with them, cutting them for the side exit pipes; they really did look fantastic on your first Viper called Bling. When I subsequently needed the sills, you didn’t want to pay me for their replacement? I wasn’t even asking for P&P (£25 I think it is from Scotland) so please help me to see how you “lost out on cash”? I do give small parts away, but a pair of sills I just can’t stretch to, sorry! Yes, my emails of having to KEEP asking for their replacements cost did get blunt. No “abusive” phone calls was ever made by me to you...I had Sam and you phone me after I’d worked a night shift, I was woken up by your call as I’d left the phone on (anxiously waiting for news, my dog needing a big emergency operation, which I explained at the time) I couldn’t even hear the latter part of your call as you had a child crying in the background. So like you say “two sides to every story”.I’m sorry you seem a little bitter Barry, you helped in the past with dropping my diff off, accompanied me when I dropped my gear box off, and helped pushed my car at various race events. I’ve certainly not forgotten all this. Hey, you should feel privileged to have pushed my car
...I can only say you always offered, and were keen to come along, I never asked you to do any of it. I thought you enjoyed being involved in the Vipers racing team, we enjoyed you coming along. If it’s an issue, then please accept publically my grateful thanks now. Please realise if I’d not believed you to have been a good mate in the past, then I would not have given my time to fit that up-rated clutch and flywheel for you on your current GenII called Lucky. You heard from someone else that I wasn’t going on the German club trip that weekend, and when you phoned and asked then if you could come over, I happily said yes (and put aside plans to work on my own car that day for you, work I’ve still not had a chance to do yet)! No bad feeling on my part, it was right at the time, and you drove away happy with a beautifully installed flywheel and clutch, even a belly full of pizza (that must be where I went wrong, wasn’t big Macs!). This is why it hurts me so much when I clicked on the link and read your replies, which seemed quite aggressive and out to get at me for anything. I have been busy racing this year, but have found time to help at least 8 owners out (FOC) who have privately contacted me, also taken 4 Viper owners out for track rides in a Comp Coupe, any time and costs are to me and my choice to give. But, I’m not about to start blowing a trumpet about what I do either. I’m not going to stop helping people, it’s no bother if perceived dealer or not to me. If a Viper has any problems, it’s doesn’t look good for the cars in general, and my passion is with the car. I remember the 3 dealer screw-ups on the frame recalls there was fault with, if I’d not spotted / helped, the cars could still be like it today and maybe owners none the wiser!
Now, given the over time hours I have to work, I’d rather have a quick bite to eat and have a chance to work on a car for the day with racing prep. We didn’t come to the dyno day because I was working, and I’m also fortunate enough to have free access to a local dyno. Don’t take it personally that I’ve stopped coming to pub lunches you organise. It’s a way to come, but I’m seeing if we can make your Crimbo meal night (maybe just for just a drink) in the pub with all going, and show support (called the pub and Sally said no probs). It would have been nice to bring the Comp Coupe, but unfortunately they’ve just salted the roads and now it’s very wet, so we may not do so. I can however offer Viper owners a chance of a ride around Silverstone GP on Dec 15th (get in touch for more details). Life’s to short for upset...I’m willing to offer the Olive branch over all this, it’s would be nice to see it not pooped on!
Thanks Nad for your kind remarks about everyone and I do really mean that I guess we all may have got the wrong end of the stick but we all read remarks such as My Hillclimb or Time Attack on the US board where you wrote 'No interest from the UK Club' which is not all true as many of us would have loved to help, we just didn't know where you were or what events you had entered.
God we all had a great time following you and Spud round some of the Uk tracks and would gladly do it again.
For the newbies amongst us you how the group was founded is not quite as Nad says but it was long before we found Nad.......or she found us.
In 1998 I bought my first Viper an RT/10 it was a great car and at my first car show I met several more owners all of whome asked me to keep a database of members as we found them at this time we also put the advert in the back of Classic American and joined the VCA with me as a contact for a UK region, months later Wayne contacted me asked to join our little group several weeks later I found out that he had gone to the Presidents meeting in the US and proclaimed himself President (there was no such title before) and written a web site to attract new members and our group grew a little more, it was only really when Steve K came along that things really started to fly and by this time Wayne had sold his car, for some reason he destroyed the website sold the web address and basically destroyed the group.
It was at that stage that once again I picked up all the pieces and offered my details as a single source of contact in the UK for the Viper Group.
I know I am a pain in the ass sometimes but lets face it we all drive the biggest 'In Your Face Car' in the world and sometimes our EGO's are just as big.
I love all you guys and gals you have a passion for the vehicle that few other clubs have and many envy our success, so lets not spoil it.
Great post Nad and as the yanks say 'I'll go out for ribs with you'.
Now everyone back in the garage we have a season to prepare for
God we all had a great time following you and Spud round some of the Uk tracks and would gladly do it again.
For the newbies amongst us you how the group was founded is not quite as Nad says but it was long before we found Nad.......or she found us.
In 1998 I bought my first Viper an RT/10 it was a great car and at my first car show I met several more owners all of whome asked me to keep a database of members as we found them at this time we also put the advert in the back of Classic American and joined the VCA with me as a contact for a UK region, months later Wayne contacted me asked to join our little group several weeks later I found out that he had gone to the Presidents meeting in the US and proclaimed himself President (there was no such title before) and written a web site to attract new members and our group grew a little more, it was only really when Steve K came along that things really started to fly and by this time Wayne had sold his car, for some reason he destroyed the website sold the web address and basically destroyed the group.
It was at that stage that once again I picked up all the pieces and offered my details as a single source of contact in the UK for the Viper Group.
I know I am a pain in the ass sometimes but lets face it we all drive the biggest 'In Your Face Car' in the world and sometimes our EGO's are just as big.
I love all you guys and gals you have a passion for the vehicle that few other clubs have and many envy our success, so lets not spoil it.
Great post Nad and as the yanks say 'I'll go out for ribs with you'.
Now everyone back in the garage we have a season to prepare for
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